Dale Boots update

A snowHead

Any snowheads belonging to the funny feet club may be interested to learn that following the closure of Outdoor Traders there are some new developments. Richard Shayler, who I understand used to work with James, is opening a new business in Abingdon from mid October. The address is 20-21 Market Place Abingdon OX14 5BY. This is to be a full factory service with boots being made in Abingdon. For more info contact richard@daleboot.com

A snowHead

that is correct

Richard has spent the past 4 years working at daleboot in Kitz running their workshop, he will as has been said be building the boots on site so the turn around time will be massively reduced

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Great news. Thanks for that.

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Will the shop be selling other makes do you know? And will the provide other services like boot adjustments and ski servicing?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Right now they will only be selling and fitting the dale boot products

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whats happened to Outdoor Traders as without James assistance and Dale boots I would not be able to ski?

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After all it is free

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@sugarmoma666, sorry, you are right. I misread it - I wasn't being intentionally misleading. Embarassed

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So what happens if I already bought Dale Boots from James, in reliance on his lifetime fitting policy? Am I now stuck with very expensive boots that don't really fit and hurt my feet? It all seems quite unfair.

Would I now have to pay again to fix my problems, when that was already included in my original purchase. Can't say I am really happy about this. Sad

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Imagine the lifetime guarantee is going to be given by the entity selling, i.e. a corporate entity. Over flies the veil of incorporation and once that entity is gone so is the guarantee. Guarantees are only as good as the giver of it.

You may get some goodwill from this Richard but unlikely he has an obligation

You are probably right, but Dale itself should stand behind their boots and cover situations like this. I can't ski for more than 2-3 minutes without stopping in mine.

You know it makes sense.

@Bobab out of interest did they fit properly at the time? You feet can change (mine did and made a pair of perfectly fitted boots hurt like hell).

Maybe you should ring up and ask. Frankly it's a small industry where people rely on reputation, I'd be surprised if he didn't try to help you however he can.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@Bobab, from what i know Richard is taking care of any of Jame's customers who have any dale boot issues... as @dp asked, were they good when you left the shop, i ask this because often the answer is yes (i wouldn't expect anyone would walk out of a shop with a boot which was hurting them! if you did then maybe you have to question why) next thing comes down to ski technique and flexibility, if i refer someone for a daleboot it is for one of three reasons or a combination of them (where i know that an off the shelf/fitted boot will only cause pain long term), there has to be some onus on the individual to work on flexibility if that is what their issue is, so if you have a muscle tightness to the point that a daleboot isn't working for you (it can be made the mot upright boot on the market barr none) and you haven't done anything about it, then sorry to be blunt, but maybe you you are not in the right sport.

instead of bumping your gums on an internet forum why not e mail Richard via his website www.daleboot.co.uk and ask the question, but i would do it politely, he is quite at liberty to tell you that it is not his problem, but as i said above i believe from what has been said so far that this would not be the case.

A snowHead

@Bobab, “I can't ski for more than 2-3 minutes without stopping in mine.“

You can’t be serious.

A snowHead

Thank you for your replies (no need to be patronising though).

As for the boots. They were fine, tight, but certainly not painful. Perhaps not as tight as I wanted them to be first time around.

I wasn't sent there for Dale boots. I went there after doing some internet research because James was recommended, and I just wanted to make sure I had the option to go with Dale if I had to. I also have had issues with snowboard boots because the back part of my feet is narrow and the front wide, so I was never able to find a boot that would be comfortable, but prevented heel lift. Having a boot which could be "fitted" to this shape seemed like a good idea. I just didn't want to have another trip being made less enjoyable by ill fitting boots. Just to note, I never had pain in hire ski boots. Just more way movement than I would like.

I don't know if I have tightness problems. Where would I feel the pain if I did? My pain seems to radiate from the bottom middle of my feet and if I continue skiing take over my entire feet. It can become so bad that I am unable to breath. I think it is worse on flats than steeps.

And yes, the pain can often start in less than 5 minutes. Last time I couldn't ski with instruction group after the first 30 minutes each day for a whole week.

Unless I have some physical problem that I experience when I am skiing only, then the problem seems to be in the footbeds.

To be fair, James has always been willing to help and adjust the boots. But the whole process is rather frustrating, made worse by the fact that it is a long trip out of London on the train and the bus ... and you never know whether the adjustments have fixed the problem or made it worse until you are on your next ski trip and by then it is too late.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@Bobab, assuming that the pain only comes on when actually skiing (ie so it's probably not a fit/footbed issue) then my punter diagnosis would be lack of range of ankle flex/tight calves. Get a Pro Stretch from CEM & use it everyday from now. A worse scenario could be on set of Mortons Neuroma (which I've had & ended up having cryo surgery in both feet) but even then it's possible to adjust the footbed in that area to take the pressure off which is what CEM did for me and worked great for a couple of seasons before it got so bad that I needed surgery.

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@Bobab, tightness in the calf/ ankle joint is very common AND for the most part doesn't affect every day life, ski boots on the other hand hold you in a fixed position of forward flex which if you have a limitation they may then cause loading in the area that you get the pain... of course it could be a number of other things but from what you describe it would be the first thing i would check

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@CEM, I would have to disagree with you (but only very slightly) I see a lot of people with limited ankle flex, which does affect every day life.

I'm a physiotherapist with a special interest in lower limb biomechanics, which probably explains why i see a disproportionate number of people with these issues compared to my colleagues. Often they have other problems such as forefoot equinas, flexible mid foot and tight gastrocs which as you know will compound the problem. Surprisingly quite a few of them have no issue with lack of flexibility in other areas.

Good boot fitters such as yourself are definitely worth consulting, it must be a very interesting process.

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@spyderjon, @CEM, the Pro Stretch is this https://www.solutions4feet.com/catalogue/accessories/foot-care---exercise/prostretch ?

I have crappy ankle flex (I blame my Mum) which I've been trying to improve through stretching. Pretty interested in this if it works - can you explain what it is/does please?

Thanks

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@clarky999,

http://youtube.com/v/5TTbUHsnYLg

After all it is free

@clarky999, there's a load of Prostretch stuff on YouTube as well including exercises with it for increased lateral stability.

@clarky999, combination of prostretch and foam rolling is best, stretching the muscles is one thing but you need to work the fascia and break down any adhesion as well

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I use a Prostretch+, a foam nano roller and a big foam roller. It has provided noticeable change in a relatively short time. In terms of body flexibility, when @CEM introduced me to the rollers I could barely touch the floor with my fingertips and after 3 months I could put my fingers flat on the floor.

Also worth noting that these things are worth owning because after my injury, they were a big help in my recovery physiotherapy.

Out of interest @Bobab, - can you describe the pain and where it is at all? Just 'pain' is no great help

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I'll take a shot.

I would describe the pain as an ache. Starts off as a dull ache, but then rapidly gets worst. To get a sense of what it feels like, make a fist with your right hand, then press the 2nd join knuckle of the index and middle finger of your right hand into the palm of your left hand, and slowly increase the pressure until the pain becomes unbearable.

In terms of location, it is a bit harder to say, because I have had a number of adjustments made to the sole now, and it has shifted the problem around a bit. But I would say there is probably two broad areas. Since I don't know the names of different areas of the foot, I'll use the names in this picture to refer to them (http://patriciahealing.weebly.com/uploads/3/0/4/2/30428326/9030328.jpg?405):

- First one: Pain starts in the spleen and then the stomach, and then spreads through out the foot, with the spleen area being sort of a sort of the most pain.
- Second one: Starts in the spine, small intestines, liver and the hear. Mostly on the inside of the foot, i.e. towards the left of my right feet. Again spreads through the foot, but would say the most intense pain is in the spine and liver.

I was originally get more of the first type of pain, so James removed the right front side of the heel lift. That reduced the pain quite a bit - i.e. could ski longer before I had to stop, but it introduced a bit of instability in the right foot ... some more adjustments and started getting more of the second type of pain, while still getting the first.

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Went to see Richard. Top guy. I highly recommend.

Also seen Richard recently and yes he will honour the Dale boot guarantee and do any work f.o.c.

You know it makes sense.

I saw Richard last week for repairs to boots bought 5 years ago all done free , excellent service !

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I have been trying to contact Richard by email and phone on the contact details via the new website but alas no responses. Presume the new business was short-lived unless anyone can tell me differently ? Does anyone know of any other Dale Boot supplier in the UK or is it visit to Kitz ?

A snowHead

@BJP, he is on holiday until the 27th, not sure how long you have been trying

(Strangely it is one of those things that skiers do... SKI). Had you called my office a week ago you could have thought the same thing we closed for a week 😂

A snowHead

Hi CEM, thanks. I have been trying since early February. Will try again after 27th March. Cheers.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@BJP, I spoke to him last week so he is definitely still in business ( not sure he is in the office all day every day)

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My experience with Dale Boots has so far been a disaster.

Having been referred to Outdoor Traders a couple of years ago, I got fitted out by James.

The first time I used the boots the pain was so excruciating I had to ski back to the lift with the boots open. The fitting was so tight that even the lowest setting had to be forced and crushed my foot. This pain didn't appear in the shop, I'm amazed James managed to put the clips on as it took every ounce of my strength to do the clips up on the lowest rung.

I asked for some longer straps and these were sent and fitted.

I had one week skiing in them and they were still very tight but just about bearable.

I used them last week in Italy and lasted one day. My toe was crushed on the lowest clip setting and I had to hire some boots and will probably lose a nail.

I've written to Richard to see if anything can be done but haven't reveived a reply.

I'll have one more go before I write them off as a very expensive mistake.

I've tried some Atomic Livefit boots and they seem very comfortable.

Overall extremely disappointed with Dale Boots. Taking out the Intuition liner the interior of the shell seems very cheap and far inferior to other boots I've owned.

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@John1952, so sorry to hear of your troubles. My husband and I both have Dale Boots and have been really happy with them. Have you tried contacting Alain Baxter in Scotland? He is a Dale Boot agent. Also, I went through the main distributor in Kitzbhuel although my husband went through Outdoor Traders- the shop in Kitzbhuel is the guy who owns the European franchise as far as I know (including UK) so he should respond to you.? We posted our boots to Alain Baxter to have new inners and a few repairs which worked out ok.

I hope you find a solution.

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@John1952,
Did you wear the same thickness socks at the fitting and when you first skied in them?

I once bought some ski socks thinking I was replacing like with like but the new socks were thicker (Internet purchase, very similar sock version name). Ended up having to take the ski boot footbeds out otherwise I couldn't stand up in them. (also Intuition liners).

With heat moulded liners I find it critical to use thin ski socks and always the exact same model/version i.e. buy numerous pairs of identical ski socks.

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Yes I did, used the same Smart wool socks as worn for the fitting.
It just seems like there isn't enough volume in the shell and the plastic coated straps aren't long enough to close comfortably.

After all it is free

Are you putting them on correctly and doing the clips up in the right order?

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I'm not accusing anyone of being foolish, but in my experience, when you are pulling like f**k just to get the first notch done up, you're doing something wrong - ie part of the liner has got folded up underneath the shell, or there's something trapped under the catch, etc.

I cannot believe that something can be comfortably fitted in the shop at the end of the buckle and then be excruciating on the first notch of the buckle when on the mountain. Your leg - even with different socks on - shouldn't be changing in circumference by 20, 30, maybe 40mm at a time. That's just bonkers.

Help!!

Dale Boots update

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