 Poster: A snowHead
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Trying to cover so many bases here, tell me where to compromise!
I normally ski one week a year, maybe 12 weeks over 30 years, Level 6-7 Inside Out. 95% on groomed piste, yet I look back 25 yrs ago and remember the times bumping down under the lifts between trees – where did those days go?! Took private tuition on bumps last year in Canada which was confidence-building if not ultimately successful. I’m 178 tall, 74kg, late 40s age. I always hire gear, have never bought.
I dream of a cheeky weekend away every now and then. I have one small mountain (La Covatilla, Bejar) 4 hours’ drive away, but it struggles with snow, I don’t think it opened at all last season. Nursery slopes are open at the moment, on which I could do drills for a day if I wished. Otherwise I can get cheap tickets to Barcelona, Geneva or Munich.
So I’m wondering about buying; If I want a weekend, then I would likely arrive very late at night and wouldn’t want to waste time hiring gear. But as in the Hire Or Buy thread, it would normally be economically unadvisable for me to spend a lot of money, the stuff would be “out of date” long before the end of its useful life. I could also be quite happy to ski basic equipment for a long weekend, while hiring good stuff for a week. I have truly no clue how often this “cheeky weekend away” will become a reality.
Unfortunately there seems to be very little choice near me for used skis. The Portuguese generally seem to keep things (any things) for ages then offer them for sale at 2/3 their original price, way higher than what us Brits are used to. Frequently the ads won’t even mention the length of ski, let alone width. I see there is more choice in the Spanish used ads, but that’s a minimum of 2 hours’ drive each way to collect, so maybe 100 euros of fuel, meaning it’s not so cheap after all! Or I could go for some new, basic Decathlon planks; their Wedze Boost 300 in 165cm/72mm are on offer now at €130, and their AllMountain XLander 500s in 176cm/75mm are €200…
Any pointers as to what I should go for – or what I should avoid? Any equipment before X year (eg after 2011 manufacturers started to use a more modern construction)? I’m thinking something around 175ish, preferably 80mm wide just in case I decide to be daring and go off the groomed stuff. Am I right in thinking that, for a day or two, too short is better than too long?
Examples: for sale in the used ads now, I see:
Fischer R15XTR 165 with Fischer RS10 bindings - €319
Volkl Tiger 3Motion 161 114_68_100 - €160
Rossignol WorldCup 9GS ti from 2011, 180cm - €195 (I get the impression I'd kill myself on these)
Some Rossis – anyone know (?!) - https://www.olx.pt/anuncio/esqui-para-a-neve-IDyFhyh.html#c5439893c7
What do you think? Old, tired, quality gear, or new budget stuff – and too short is better than too long? (I haven’t even started on boots yet, or ski bags!) I guess simply I lack the confidence to spend money not knowing if, when or how it would be used…
Thanks for any thoughts after this unfocused rambling!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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The first two are a bit short for you I think. You're similar age and dimensions to me and I got a pair of k2 impact 174 (80 mm underfoot) off ebay last winter for just over £100 and they seem to suit me fine. Seemed a bit long at first but that was down to me previously using too short a ski. Can't comment on the rossignol but could be a bit of a handful? I'd sort some decent fitting boots before worrying about skis. I thought I had a bargain set of boots till finding they were a full shell size too big so were a waste of money!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Why not have a look online at the likes of Glisshop and Ekosport. Large French retailers who sell loads of previous year model skis at sometimes huge discounts from original prices, sometimes as much as 70% off. Have used both companies and got good service.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Whitty, the boots seems a far more logical proposal! But I've hired for years and never really had a complaint, so I was putting them as a lower priority, ie I thought I could pick up anything and make it work for a weekend. I think you're right, 174 sounds close to perfect. Wondering again about the 176 Decathlon jobs... I'm a bit nervous that old bindings might be "dangerous" somehow, and that could cost me a knee. Maybe I'm wrong.
@RobinS, I don't expect to go anywhere near them and I simply assumed postage would be too much - can look though, thanks for the tip. Also off to El Tarter in 3 weeks so will again pop into that shop that appears to do stupid discounts.
I'm just struggling with the idea of spending €2-300 on something that I might not use much... it's a mind game, after that the details will probably fall into place...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Orange200, the likes of Glisshop and Ekosport often have free postage offers. Economically it almost certainly doesn't make sense, especially if you have to pay for ski carriage on your flights, but in terms of convenience for local trips it can. Plus who doesn't like shiny new gear 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@mgrolf, Depends who you fly with / how you get to slopes (driving in the case of the OP). Could easily save the money you've invested in skis within a few trips, and its a good excuse to get out and use them when you have them.
There will be deals pop up just keep looking.
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For me buying second hand gear with all its hassles when you don't really know what you are doing or looking for is not a good idea.
And if you have skied "12 weeks over 30 years" again it really makes no sense.
And personally I wouldn't drive 4 hours to dick around on a nursery slope or a tinpot hill.
In short stick to hiring stuff - even for a weekend away, which may or may not happen.
Unless there are some loftier ambitions I am missing in your post.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Personal I've never found buying something in the hope of making it form a habit has worked for me in the long run. It does sound to me like buying your gear pivots around getting somewhere reasonably local you can get to for the odd weekend - I'd try the drive a few times to see if it's realistic before you invest.
If it's something you enjoy and do regularly then you might revise your budget too, spending 4 hours and 200 euros on petrol will mean you don't want to be stuck with naff gear and the initial outlay will soon be dwarfed by ongoing costs.
Looks like La Covatilla, Bejar is getting some snow this weekend, strike while the iron's hot!
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| Quote: |
| Damn, forgot about paying for ski carriage too |
And then there is servicing...
| Quote: |
| I think I was hoping for a €100 bargain for the nursery slope. |
You can certainly find something for that price - especially if you are knowledgeable about kit. But as you've now realised the ongoing cost and hassle may not be worth it.
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| Perhaps I need to concentrate more on locating one particular resort and one rental shop within it, preferably one that stays open until 9-10pm |
They do actually open quite late and open early! I wouldn't sweat this tbh.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@Orange200, generally speaking, hiring for a weekend is going to be similar to or even cheaper shipping them. And that's without factoring in purchase price and servicing costs. Hire shops open before first lifts, so you could chose a hire shop that's en route from your accommodation to the lifts, book in advance and just pop in and pick them up on your way out skiing. Owning your own boots could speed this up further, as you could then just tell the hire shop your BSL and DIN when you book the skis (& poles), so that they can be literally ready to go. Or just hire boots too, if you are happy to continue doing that. I can't see that buying skis really makes much sense for your situation, either from a price, time or hassle perspective.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If you have decathlon, I'd look there at the boots, far more important and easy to transport than skis. Hiring a pair of skis much easier than boots, and 15 mins in hire shop to grab skis and poles.
Cheap skis in decathlon make less sense to me, you'll probably find deals on secondhand skis in resort, especially at the end of the season, or in the personal ads here.
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I bought a pair of second hand well used slalom skis from a club racer via ebay, paid £75 and am on my 4th season on them, I've probably skied 25 - 30 weeks on them.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Scarpa wrote: |
| I bought a pair of second hand well used slalom skis from a club racer via ebay, paid £75 and am on my 4th season on them, I've probably skied 25 - 30 weeks on them. |
How much to service and transport them? I'm guessing from how much you ski you knew what you were buying?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Layne, With ski rental at £100 per week in most top rated ski resorts just do the math. Even with servicing, transport, and averaged out weekly cost, hiring skis is positively extortionate.
The real problem is just how much someone originally pays for their skis. If you go to a "pro ski shop" you must expect to get ripped off with punter prices. There are many discount, outlet, and auction sites that can provide superb value for money when buying ski kit, you just need to know what you are buying and what is a relatively "good" price.
@Scarpa, seems to have enjoyed a bargain, and it's no secret that there are lots of bargains to be had if you are genuinely flexible with which skis you would be happy to ski on. However, if you have your sights on a 2016 season Whitedot Carbonlite series ski don't expect to see dozens of them on ebay.
Some really great prices are from German web-based sports clearing houses which seriously undermine the validity of "renting".
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Poster: A snowHead
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Well I think @Gämsbock has really spelled out what might have been hinted at by others; I was putting cart before horse. IF it's true that hire shops open before lifts (never noticed that  ) then if I get myself a decent pair of boots, I can carry those wherever and just warn the hire shop that I want a pair of 176/80s with 125 poles, set for a Mundo 28.5 boot... and pick 'em up. No time wasted boot fitting, no carriage charges.
Soldeu.com want around €23 per day for a set of reasonable skis, +3 for boots. So that's about 10-15 days before payoff for the skis, and a fair bit longer for the boots. Excludes transport and servicing.
@skimastaaah, would you be so kind as to volunteer a couple of those German sites?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| skimastaaah wrote: |
| [b]@Layne[/b, With ski rental at £100 per week in most top rated ski resorts just do the math. Even with servicing, transport, and averaged out weekly cost, hiring skis is positively extortionate. |
Assuming you can't hire something decent for less than £100 Ryanair charge £40 for each single trip, a basic service is £30. You do the maths.
| skimastaaah wrote: |
| The real problem is just how much someone originally pays for their skis. If you go to a "pro ski shop" you must expect to get ripped off with punter prices. There are many discount, outlet, and auction sites that can provide superb value for money when buying ski kit, you just need to know what you are buying and what is a relatively "good" price. |
But that last sentence is another factor for the OP, they don't know what they are buying.
We (2 adults 2 children) all have our own kit but we drive to the slopes (so no transport costs), I service them all (so minimal servicing costs), I know what I'm buying so buy and sell at good prices. It would be easy for me to suggest the OP buy his own kit. But he's not me.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| skimastaaah wrote: |
@Layne, With ski rental at £100 per week in most top rated ski resorts just do the math. Even with servicing, transport, and averaged out weekly cost, hiring skis is positively extortionate.
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I have done the math, for the circumstances Orange200 describes, i.e. a weekend skiing and getting cheap flights, so I assume ski carriage is extra. Sport 2000 in Soldeu quote €21.60 for a 2 day weekend hire of skis. Easyjet are charging £70 return for ski carriage.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Gämsbock, @Layne, don't go with easy jet if they charge silly prices. I just booked flights to Turin with BA including car hire and an extra 23kgs free with the BA sale for £150 per person 5 day short break. That means skis defo go "free", and I got absolute bargain with car hire. Why on earth would any one choose to get ripped off on "cheap flights"?
The math also includes selling on your skis after 3 or 4 weeks at about half what you pay for them (on ebay for example), doing what servicing you can, like edges and waxing, and not being so crazy as to buy cheap flights that rip you off on baggage and skis. Fly Swiss or Lufthansa.
If you ski just twice a year the cost of your own skis cetainly is a lot less than than you both make out. Maybe you earn top dollar, I don't know, but please don't dismiss "the math" just because you seem happy to pay punter prices.
btw some German based ski shops..... Ski4fun ....Skisport4u both based on ebay, both sell on demo ski gear, don't buy the ex-rental stuff, and do your homework on the hardware.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@skimastaaah, I don't generally fly at all with my skis these days, and I own my skis and only hire if I want to test new ones. But I ski 40-50 days a season, and do my own servicing, so the math for me clearly favours owning, and I have no doubt it does for your circumstances, too.
But, the OP is flying from Portugal for the occasional weekend, so direct flights to ski airports on BA are unlikely to be an option. £150 isn't exactly a cheap flight, either - if that's measured against £50 return on Easyjet or Ryanair, then having ski carriage included isn't a a good deal. BA have two-tier fares now too, so the headline price doesn't necessarily include skis. Last time I did fly with skis (LTN-GVA on EJ), the base flight was £50 return. I don't think paying £50 return is getting ripped off?
For a lot of people, buying skis makes sense, and I am sure it does for you in your situation, as it does for me in mine. The economics of owning vs hiring for a week long self drive trip to the Arlberg are completely different to flying for a weekend to Andorra. Having done the math based on everything Orange2000 has said, rather than my own personal circumstances, I maintain that it will be cheaper and less hassle for Orange2000 to hire as needed rather than own.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Gämsbock, The £150 pp included 5 days car hire. (BMW 218D - Large Standard Vehicle - All extras included. Try the BA website, these deals are still current!)
My general point is that hiring is expensive compared to owning in the longer-term, and depends upon just how, where you ski. 
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Sun 5-02-17 13:14; edited 1 time in total
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@skimastaaah, generally true, yes, but not when the shipping cost per trip is higher than the hiring cost per trip.
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@skimastaaah, I just seen skisport4u has 175/91 Scott The Ski 2014, plus bindings, for €175.
Curse you, this could get expensive 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Orange200, just make sure you check out the high-def pictures of each of the skis like that. There may well be one ski that has less use than others....... the give-aways are tip chips and binding knocks.
there are some good skis there. 
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@skimastaaah, we are talking about the OP not you, me or anyone else.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Orange200 wrote: |
@skimastaaah, I just seen skisport4u has 175/91 Scott The Ski 2014, plus bindings, for €175.
Curse you, this could get expensive |
You could buy new for approx twice the price from glisshop just for comparison.
I think you have two problems:
1) Buying from skisport4u you will be taking a point on the condition and life of the ski. You tend to get more lightly used and well looked after skis from private sellers. I'm not saying it's a bad deal per se, just a word of caution.
2) Do you know the ski. It's an advanced skiers ski that you may or may not get on with. It's clearly a great ski. it's just whether it's a great ski for you.
All said, if you take a punt and it doesn't work out for either 1 or 2, you can still probably sell and recoup some of the money.
Personally I still think you should continue renting but if you are going down the buying route...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Layne, sincere thanks for your contributions also.
Oh, to have but two problems 
I absolutely don't know the condition of the ski, or whether it suits me. I might hope that, considering what I've seen for sale here used, I could sell it for nearly what I paid for it (tiny supply here but perhaps tiny demand too, I don't know). With private sellers what I fear is a general lack of returns policy, and arrangements for international postage. Maybe I'm wrong.
But after the euphoria of seeing a highly desirable ski, that "sounds like" it might be for me, well within the price range of what had previously been 6 yr old barely appropriate skis... I agree that the cold light of day is adding in the price of sticks, bag, carriage... and boots, and I've held off the credit card just yet.
I haven't come to a final decision - this is often the case in my life - but I do feel more confident that any decision will now be far better informed.
I now have to look a bit more at boots. Even if I find a place that sells used ones cheap online, that's a big gamble to cough up €200 for something that I might not be able to live with for 2 hours! Not sure how to get a satisfactory bargain on that one. Guess I could irritate the hire shop in Andorra at the end of this month and change them every day, claiming discomfort but actually deciding which I like. Though I understand that still wouldn't be ideal as rental boots aren't the same as private sales.
I'll also have a look at ski carriage with the main airlines from here.
Thanks again everyone, and I also hope these discussions help other readers in a similar situation.
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You should check out sportisimo.com, they have great boots. It's where I got mine, however you may have to pay shipping 
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FAQ
which is probably why I put the post up in the first place!
