 Poster: A snowHead
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Anyone use these ? Curious as to how people are getting on with them...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Whats that link got to do with knee bindings?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Old Man Of Lech, I can't see any link in skimottaret's actual post. Are you referring to the link in his signature?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I do. I found them harder to get on initially until I got the technique better (thanks to Spyderjon for that) but other than don't notice any difference while skiing. I have "tested" the lateral rear release which did it's job nicely a couple of times now.
Wouldn't go back!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Thanks, I have not seen a pair myself and am hoping to get a bit of knowledge as I have lots of clients with bum knees... Reading a bit on the bindings it would appear that they make your skis right and left handed. Is that the case?
How were they harder to get on?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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That us correct. Though if you put them on the wrong way around they will just behave as normal bindings - ie you don't benefit from the lateral rear release.
I had to push my weight down differently to put them on without needing to resort to forcing my foot down incredibly hard which is fine on that flat but impossible on a steep slope. Probably from poor original technique 
I switched to them for that reason. I have half a reconstructed ACL remaining and only a third of my cartilage left. The surgeon said any further damage will necessitate a complete knee replacement but I am too young to have one.
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@NickyJ, Were you able to try them on a pair of skis before you bought them or did you just go on recommendation?
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I was able to look at them mounted to a demo board and look at the mechanisms and speak to Spyderjon (while visiting to do his servicing course ) about them.
He then offered me a rather good deal so I snapped them up.
I had previously read about them but had wanted to see them in the flesh.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I'll have a chat with Spyderjon about them when I next see him. 
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I'm also very interested in these and surprised there hasn't been more uptake of this technology, or indeed licensed by a big binding manufacturer. If athletes like Ligety, Fenninger or @touchguru can be sidelined with ACL injuries while training then I guess this can happen to anyone, regardless of fitness, if you get in the wrong situation. The Kneebinding website contains fairly convincing content demonstrating situations where conventional bindings are not protecting knees as well as their product. I have not skied a pair myself, primarily as all the skis I've bought come with bindings or are fitted with touring bindings, but do wonder if this is the way forward.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@balernoStu, they don't seem to have any good clinical evidence (as yet, I presume, and understandable given the cost and scope of assembling it) which may be slowing adoption.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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The binding is not clinically proven, expensive and ugly. Plus many customers are not going to be aware but there has been a whole corporate shitshow going on between the inventor and the company that forced him out. Not sure if that's settled and how close his new version is to market.
I can't see many athletes wanting to ski it at present but it's probably a good option if you fit the risk profile.
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@under a new name, I guess so. Also, anecdotally at least, those who suffer the injury may often blame themselves rather than scrutinising their equipment, so the market doesn't demand it in sufficient numbers.
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You know it makes sense.
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I have them on my Black Pearls - they make no difference whatsoever to skiing but allegedly may help in particular types of fall. As I hurt my knee last year I wanted to maximise my chances, but I feel much more relaxed about the risks now. They are much stiffer to click into and out of, and yes as NickyJ said, they turn your skis into a left and a right (I left instructions about making sure the graphics still worked!).
@skimottaret, would you like me to bring them next Saturday?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@motyl, yeah be cool to have a look... Not too keen on forcing your skis into L/R versions but if you dont tune a lot I guess not a big deal...
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Poster: A snowHead
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@skimottaret, I'll bring them along. That's an interesting comment about L/R as the graphics encourage them to be used L/R anyway - I had wondered about wear, but concluded that it's not a big issue for me.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Why Knee Binding when the superior Look TT is already for decades............? Look TT..... Highest elasticity of any binding. Full lateral heel rotation with the tib/fib as central rotational axis. Easiest to get into in deep snow. Unmatched. Take it from there, period.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| arcsinice wrote: |
| Why Knee Binding when the superior Look TT is already for decades............? Look TT..... Highest elasticity of any binding. Full lateral heel rotation with the tib/fib as central rotational axis. Easiest to get into in deep snow. Unmatched. Take it from there, period. |
That's not correct. The Pivot binding is no safer than any other conventional alpine binding as when the toe releases laterally the heel does not turn/track the line of the boot which it would have to do if it was going to reduce the load on the leg. The Pivot heel was developed because the functionality of the Look toe at the time was poor. When the toe bindings were improved Look dropped the Pivot binding. It was relaunched a few years ago as it is a great binding due to it's high elasticity but that doesn't make it safer on the leg.
All alpine binding manufacturers have effectively just ignored the ACL/MCL issue and have just continued to make essentially the same products for years which are designed to (hopefully) prevent leg breakages. Yes, improvements have been made but progress has been pedestrian. Thankfully breakages are rare but the next area of weakness is the ACL/MCL and those injuries often have a bigger longer term impact than a break.
The Kneebinding is the only binding to be designed to have all the functionality of an alpine binding but with an additional straight lateral inward release at the heel which, combined with a second heel mounted AFD, is what is needed to mitigate against the vast majority of ACL/MCL injuries. The nearest bindings to have this type of release are the Dynafit Radical 2 & the Dynafit Beast 16/14 freeride touring as their heels pivot to track the rotating toe but they still don't have a full lateral release. And the elasticity of the Dynafit Beast heel matches that of the Pivot heel. The lateral release function of the Kneebinding does add some height and weight to the binding but it's no heavier than a metal chassis binding and is no higher than a rail system binding. The Kneebinding skis better than low/mid range bindings and as well as the top models. And there's now a 14 din version for the racing market. The biggest barrier to entry for the Kneebinding is the price, especially with the current poor $/£ rate which when combined with the factory increase has put the price of them up by about £50.
Breaking in to the mainstream binding market is extremely difficult as all but one of the alpine binding companies (Vist) are owner by ski manufacturers who will ship the majority of their skis with pre-fitted hostage bindings/rail systems. However there are now a number of US resorts (I can't recall which ones) whose instructors all ski the Kneebinding due the resorts benefitting from reduced insurance premiums as the cost to them if an instructor goes down with an ACL/MCL injury is significant.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| @motyl, yeah be cool to have a look... Not too keen on forcing your skis into L/R versions but if you dont tune a lot I guess not a big deal... |
Just mount them with inserts so you can swap 'em over 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| arcsinice wrote: |
| Why Knee Binding when the superior Look TT is already for decades............? Look TT..... Highest elasticity of any binding. Full lateral heel rotation with the tib/fib as central rotational axis. Easiest to get into in deep snow. Unmatched. Take it from there, period. |
That's not correct. The Pivot binding is no safer than any other conventional alpine binding as when the toe releases laterally the heel does not turn/track the line of the boot which it would have to do if it was going to reduce the load on the leg. The Pivot heel was developed because the functionality of the Look toe at the time was poor. When the toe bindings were improved Look dropped the Pivot binding. It was relaunched a few years ago as it is a great binding due to it's high elasticity but that doesn't make it safer on the leg.
All alpine binding manufacturers have effectively just ignored the ACL/MCL issue and have just continued to make essentially the same products for years which are designed to (hopefully) prevent leg breakages. Yes, improvements have been made but progress has been pedestrian. Thankfully breakages are rare but the next area of weakness is the ACL/MCL and those injuries often have a bigger longer term impact than a break.
The Kneebinding is the only binding to be designed to have all the functionality of an alpine binding but with an additional straight lateral inward release at the heel which, combined with a second heel mounted AFD, is what is needed to mitigate against the vast majority of ACL/MCL injuries. The nearest bindings to have this type of release are the Dynafit Radical 2 & the Dynafit Beast 16/14 freeride touring as their heels pivot to track the rotating toe but they still don't have a full lateral release. And the elasticity of the Dynafit Beast heel matches that of the Pivot heel. The lateral release function of the Kneebinding does add some height and weight to the binding but it's no heavier than a metal chassis binding and is no higher than a rail system binding. The Kneebinding skis better than low/mid range bindings and as well as the top models. And there's now a 14 din version for the racing market. The biggest barrier to entry for the Kneebinding is the price, especially with the current poor $/£ rate which when combined with the factory increase has put the price of them up by about £50.
Breaking in to the mainstream binding market is extremely difficult as all but one of the alpine binding companies (Vist) are owner by ski manufacturers who will ship the majority of their skis with pre-fitted hostage bindings/rail systems. However there are now a number of US resorts (I can't recall which ones) whose instructors all ski the Kneebinding due the resorts benefitting from reduced insurance premiums as the cost to them if an instructor goes down with an ACL/MCL injury is significant. |
So glad to know via your expertise that Knee Bindings will ensure injury free skiing with aplomb...........
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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If cost is putting somebody off. Just look at how much several physio sessions cost. That was my comparator, when I bought mine
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FAQ
