Wide Skis and Bad Knees

A snowHead

Just back from a 5 week trip in the Alps. In the first week or so I used my newish soul 7s. My left knee became very swollen. I took 3 days off. Physio, anti-inflamm gel and icing got the knee back to normal size. Conditions had started to worsen due to lack of new snow. That and the knee made me think my old watea 84s should be used. So I used these for the remaining 3 weeks. The wateas are now defunct after damaging an edge on the penultimate day. During the 3 weeks I followed a regime of physio, anti-inflamm gel and the odd icing.
The wateas are 84mm under foot. The souls 106mm.
During the last 3 weeks swelling was negligible.
The question: was the extra ski width largely responsible for the swelling? This was largely on top of the knee, gave out heat and was tender to the touch. The knee has reacted like this before but to nowhere near the same extent.
History is a cartilage injury aged 11(now 56). Chronic tendonitis in my 20s - a Dr Shakespeare from Stratford said I had the knees of a 50 yo at the time. Some arthritis elsewhere so may be relevant. Lots of sport over many years. Fit and strong before going skiing.
So do I need to ditch the wide skis?
I will have a scan done at the end of the season if the problem reoccurs on my other trips.
Any experience or knowledge appreciated.

A snowHead

PS I use ski mojos.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Off-piste skiing can be hard on the knees, especially if the wrong stance is adopted, ie sitting back, or maybe just it was just coincidence?
I'll take the skis if you don't want them Very Happy

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Was the affected knee the one which had the previous injury?

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@Mark1863, were you skiing (mostly) on piste or off piste?

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@Mark1863, where in the Alps did you find snow calling for 106mm skis at Christmas and new year?

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I've been skiing 122 rocker2's all week and was very worried about my knees (scar tissue in the right and damaged MCL in the left) and had no more pain than usual!

Maybe you need to go bigger! Laughing

After all it is free

Agreed, my 117's make the skiing much easier on my old worn-out knees!

Dr Shakespeare from Stratford?................

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This has been discussed a couple of times on snowHeads I think, including this time and this time.

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Hmmm. Lunchtime today guess which ones are mine.

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Ahhh, @jbob, bet they weren't were they? But ... Rossi 4G. Nice ski. 7G a totally better animal ...

@Mark1863,

With cartilage trouble age 11 sounds like you may have a bit of arthritic change in the knee .

A knee like that is very sensitive to " new experiences" and many people who can participate in their regular activities get into trouble when they try something new. It is therefore important to pace your self when staring something you haven't done for a while. Shorten your first day so you don't blow it for the whole week on day one. You are at your most fatigued on day three so have that day off or shorten it. Try to avoid skiing with an effusion, so ice, ice etc. Use a compression sleeve and if you tolerate them take
Anti inflammatory medication.

The problem with fat skiis seems to crop up mainly in people who have suddenly switched to them having been used to a much narrower ski.

Given the conditions early season I would suggest that the very icy conditions were as relevant as any trigger for your knee flare up. Worn knees do not like ice and bullet hard pistes!

Jonathan Bell

You know it makes sense.

Thanks for your replies especially @Jonathan Bell for his professional advice.
Neither of my sets of skis are good on hardpack. I did not want to wreck the soul 7s on stones either. I did not go off piste much at all because of the conditions. Was in the Espace Killy.
Yes it was the same knee as the previous damage.
@Jonathan Bell, when should I use the compression sleeve?
I do not think it is technique that is causing it.
Once the swelling starts it does not like putting force through it; e.g climbing stairs; so lead with my right leg and a stair at a time.
The cartilage damage was done actually on my 11th birthday. Lunchtime football practice. The day of my 11 plus. So did the afternoon part of the exam with my leg on a chair. I had been putting a shilling a week for a year into a bike shop saving scheme. Due to get my bike that afternoon. Could not ride it for 2 months. There was no operation. It still hurts now - in both senses.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@Mark1863, with the knee history you have I'd suggest a narrower pair of skis if you are on piste, especially in the conditions that we had during most of December.

A snowHead

A snowHead

@Mark1863,

We sell the bio skin ( standard) which I think is as good as any. It's about £30. No point spending more.
It should be used any time you are likely to make the knee swell as the compression will help. They also improve proprioception ( feedback) from slightly worn knees .

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@Jonathan Bell, I always wear compression tights for exercise, but I guess these things of which you speak (and of which I've never heard) are tighter. Maybe I should invest in a pair. (I know I've got some arthritis going on in the knees - a very good physio told me so. wink

j

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I am ditching mine. I have a damaged cartilage underneath patella and I definitely feel the difference. Off-piste was OK, but when I had to ski the groomed slopes to get down it was a torture, I had to stop every few turns. No swelling, but my knee was really sore for a couple of days. Luckily I am light so don't really need fat (112) skis, to as I can get enough float on skis with 90-95 waist, so will stick to this width for the time being.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@Jonathan Bell,
I normally wear compression tights as a base layer on the legs, and sometimes a cheap support on whichever knee is giving me bother when I get up in the morning.
I was thinking of a more sophisticated support for both knees - any recommendations? I know support are not as good as braces but I can't afford fitted braces!

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Again thanks for the advice. Will see if I can pick something up.
Admin was thinking of compulsory renaming me robocop because as well as the mojos I wear a top with plastic shoulder pads(left shoulder wrecked and op'd on a few years ago). So some knee "sleeves" will just add to the general impression/amusement

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@haigie,

Check out the link on my name below. It takes you to my blog entries, one is on braces.Cheap and simple is best for a mildly worn knee .?try a Bioskin standard skin. You can get one from us or online. They are about £30

Jonathan Bell

After all it is free

I've come to the conclusion that if I can ski off piste with a modicum of succes on a sub 100 width ski the why do I need to go bigger?

I've tried all sorts from 100-120 underfoot and whatever way you dress it up it is harder physically to ski this width of ski on anything other than the optimum conditions for which it has been designed.

For an above average but still effectively a 10 -14 day a year skier like myself,the amount of times you drop lucky and get and powder day are becoming less and less IMO.

For those non powder days when encountering the full gammut of mixed conditions both on or off piste a 90-100 underfoot ski is preferable and certainly much less tiring.

Am I the only one who has actually made a conscious decision to downsize slightly?

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I've been watching this thread with some interest and a little trepidation as someone who has been recovering from hip re-surfacing and anticipating more effort going into the knees, which have suffered with fluid in the past, when I finally got the wide skis out. I've been using an all mountain Rossi 83, but finally got the 110s out, with this thread in the back of my mind. Having now experimented a little my conclusion: absolutely no problem in powder; no problem on a true carve with the frame stacked, in fact easier on both hip and knee; however if there is any skidding or lack of commitment (poor light) then I feel tension in the knees. IMHO the issue is the wider skis will in theory put strain on the ankles on a skid, but our stiff boots transfer that to the knees. If you can stack the skeleton and carve (which is not going to be possible all the time) problem solved! In icy conditions as there were in Ek up to a couple of weeks ago - leave the wide boys in the locker.

It's a hard thing with knees, they're the most complex joint in the human body. Wider skis are shown to increase stress on the knees, but that is dependant on how you ski.

strictly speaking about ON PISTE here, the wider your skis the more you need to be bent at the knee and the more forward your weight needs to be over your foot.

My Atomic Vantage 90s were delayed in the post a few weeks ago, so had to borrow a pair of really narrow skis - cant remember anything about them apart from the fact they were narrow, and black. I found them so narrow (comparatively to the 85 - 90mm underfoot i'm used to ) that I was coming on to the edges so fast I couldn't initiate a wide or aggressive carve... although they were a lot softer on the knee because effort was far reduced - they were uncomfortable for my skiing style.

The wider the ski, the more the weight/effort/knee bend comes in to play - ever wondered why the number of people on wider skis not turning properly (often dressed like 'dudes' or whatever, wearing avy packs) head almost straight line down the piste is increasing?

Help!!

Wide Skis and Bad Knees

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