Going to winter park, need some info.

A snowHead

We've booked up to goto winter park for 11 days starting on Sat 14th Jan and need some resort info.
The crystal brochure gives lessons as half days, booked as 1 - 3 days at a time, morning or afternoon. Rusty if you're reading this do you know what these instructors are like? Are they the normal resort instructors like yourself or something organised by crystal independantly?.
I've never skied off piste, but want to try and was going to use these lessons as a first step, will these guys be upto it, do these groups get over crowded, or am I best to seek out a particular company or indivisual?.
As we have 11 days and my wife doesn't think she'll be able to sky for that long we had planned on having a day off half way through. Denver seems pretty close, is it worth a trip over for the day and are there any other resorts close enough to spend the day?.
Thanks for any info from anyone. By the way we're staying at the mountain lodge, anyone else stayed there?.

A snowHead

mac, for a day off, you might want to go to the Silverthorne outlet stores for a bit of retail therapy...
http://www.silverthornefactorystores.com/
(ask Robbie on here about the drive to them Wink

)
The group lessons shouldn't be too crowded that time of year. My advice would be to take the lessons in the morning, then go practice in the afternoons. If they are official lessons, then it will be with the Winter Park ski school, which has some pretty good instructors in it. Unlike Europe, the US resorts normally only have one ski school per resort, and that school is run as part of the resort.
On a powder day, you'll find plenty of off piste to learn on, and several pistes which won;t be bashed, and so will be good for learning on too (when 30+ cms fall overnight, every run is fun!)

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

the lessons are all conducted by members of the winter park ski school. above the first time skiers the vast majority of the instructors (estimate 90%) are full cert (psia level III) instructors with many, many years of experience. i'm honestly very proud of my peers. we may have an occasional shining/rising star level II cert teaching lower level intermediates. level I certs or non-certs are getting their start teaching kids.

off piste is a slightly different situation here as opposed to europe. winter park is really two different contiguous area. we refer to the winter park side of the mountain and the mary jane side of the mountain. i would guess 90% of mary jane is un-groomed or........off piste. if by "off piste" you mean outside the boundaries of the resort or non lift service/ backcountry terrain you simply will not find this ski instructor anywhere near it. why? it is very, very dangerous to ski the backcountry in colorado due to avalanche danger. lot's of folks do it and in my mind they are morons. the winter park side is probably 50% groomed and 50% natural.

i hope that answers the off piste query. our upper level group lessons are deemed "bumps, steeps, powder". we aren't going to take ANY CUSTOMER someplace where they aren't safe and/or are going to be frightened. in a word it isn't good business.

the lessons are on AVERAGE six folks. if you can afford a private lesson for a day it is obviously a great way to get a great deal of individual attention.

denver? it's two hours away and in my mind a rather run of the mill large city. take a day off and drive to the little town of steamboat springs (120 minutes) and shop half a day and go to the hot springs for a soak in the afternoon. silverthorne is okay. you have to keep in mind i hate shopping. ski five hours a day as opposed to sunup to sundown.

you will have a great time. i'm very proud of our little corner of the world. please call me upon your arrival (303-859-0530 cell) or simply ask/find me at the ski school meeting place. i'll buy you guys the first round of drinks!

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Thanks for the info. All the instructor working for the resort rather than indivisual companies was the answer I hoped for.
By off piste, I meant trying to learn to ski powder rather than dissappearing into the wilderness. I also want to learn how to get down bumps looking like I know how rather than brute force and ignorance. I see from the web site that some of the classes available are bumps clinics so I'll be trying to get onto those. I will be booking two lots of 3 mornings and my wife may book the womens day on the 23rd.
Really can't wait.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

mac, if you can ski intermediate terrain we can make you a decent bump skier. i am working the 14th and off sunday the 15th. call me sunday morning and i will be more than happy to give you a quick tour of the mountain.

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We took an afternoon out and drove to the 'sulfur springs' - brilliant. Very relaxing sat in thermal pools, surrounded by the rocky mountains what more could you want? One funny side effect was that our hair and nails grew like mad for about two weeks after Puzzled

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

Lorraine, did you do anything else whilst there or stick to the skiing?.
Rusty, thanks for the offer we'd love to take you up on that so long as you don't mind it on your day off.

After all it is free

in terms of other things....there are "sleigh ride dinners" where you are taken on a sleigh ride, eat, a cowboy sings a few songs while strumming a guitar by a fire. the "cowboy" is actually a local ski instructor who plays in a rock band and for the sleigh gig he wears blue jeans and they slap a cowboy hat on him. in addition snowmobile tours, great nordic skiing, dogsledding.

i guess i'm a bit perplexed when people ask or look for "other" things to do. we typically get up out of bed, ski, eat dinner, and......do it again the next day!

if i ski on my day off i'll be glad to give you a quick tour.

The ski, eat & sleep thing is my idea of the perfect ski holiday, but my wife doesn't think she'll manage to ski all 10 days. Although she knew we'd be going skiing she hasn't done any fitness work, etc so will find it very tiring. Looks like an afternoon at the springs and maybe a trip into Denver one day.
We get in quite late on the Saturday, but I'll give you a shout on the sunday morning to organise meeting up, thanks for the help.

*Ski* the Net with snowHeads

Oii, Wear The Fox Hat, just seen this thread!!

Now, about driving anywhere from Winter Park - ensure rental car has proper winter tyres, and try not to drive in the worst blizzard of the season. Then, try not to spin the darn car off the raod twice in the first 1/2 hour (the second time in to a post and ditch) necessitating a very shameful, slow, return to the rental place with a battered and bruised car, driver, passengers...

Embarassed

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

mac,

I went to WP last Jan, and posted a trip report on the Resorts listings (http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewpost.php?p=89575).

I stayed at the Mountain Lodge and found it very comfortable. Also, the bar brews its own beer. I recommend the "Helle's Half Acre".

snow reports

Mac,

We had our tribe with us and decided to have a rest day mid-week. We hired a 4WD car (with winter tyres!) in Winterpark (jeeps were a bit on the expensive side), we actually got a refund on our ski passes for that day which just about covered the cost (try doing that in Europe!). We drove through the Rockies and went to the 'Sulfur Springs' we spent the morning there and then drove to a mall and visited a local ex- gold mining town and then pottered back. It was great, I would have liked to have gone to Denver too (it would have been a full day trip from Winterpark) but we were only prepared to miss out on a day off piste as we were only there for a week.

We're being transfered via bus from Denver and would have had to look around at hiring a car for a day or two, but didn't know if that was poss in WP or if we'd be tied to just buses. Lorraine that answers that question.
Acacia, read your review and everyone else's positive comments about WP and hence we're going there instead of just a week in Keystone.
8 days to go and getting desparate.

You know it makes sense.

We're going to WP soon. Can't wait. For a day off skiing we're going to try a bit of dog-sledding - something I've always quite fancied.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

We tried the dog sledding in Banff the first year we went. It was an afternoon thing that took a few hours. Good to say you'd done it, but I wouldn't set a day aside for it. The dogs were a lot smaller than I thought they would be. They were a cross breed between huskies and hounds for better endurance. Our 'Driver' was a real big bloke, I'm not that small and the wife is ok, but I thought they'd struggle, needn't have worried though.

A snowHead

i know the folks who run the sleigh rides. they are good folks and i'm sure run a great operation. my daughter rides at their stables in the summer. i think it would be fun to ride in a sleigh and have an outdoor dinner under the stars near a warm campfire.

i can't stand snowmobiles, hence, that isn't much of an attraction.

steamboat is a nice town and feels very "western". in addition the hot springs there are very, very beautiful.

A snowHead

mac, we're going in feb (pending the cps) hope you have a great time, make sure you take lots of pictures and report back here !

Anyone else going around feb 25 the ?

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Rusty, do these stables do winter riding too. If so do you have there name and details. I'm not into horses, to many legs and not enough wheels, but the wife is. I can pack her off onto a horse for a while and be left to carry on skiing. Her day off sorted.

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i will try to find you the name of a stable that will do winter rides.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Rusty Guy, are these the stables...

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Rusty Guy, Generally, is the snow still good in mid/late March? I'm keen to to visit after your high recommendations! Is it best to stay in the village and take a bus to the mountain, or stay somewhere like Iron Horse and then bus to the village in the evenings? Cheers.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

erica2004, March is possibly the best snow in WP. The shuttles to/from the village run regularly through the day, so if you choose to stay there, it shouldn't be an inconvenience.

After all it is free

Mac

Was in Denver last year for a couple of days. Did not get the impression that this was a great city to visit with a family. You might be better exploring some of the other resorts and old mining towns in the area.

The tuition at WP last year was very good.

Wear The Fox Hat, no it isn't the stable i'm referring to, however, you do have a remarkable library of photos. i think the one you have pictured is near beaver village off 40 between the resort and town. am i correct?

erica2004, yes.....you can have absolutely no concerns about any march date. the primary reason is that we have had record snowfall to date and march is typically a month when we get hammered. don't confuse denver weather with mountain weather. if we didn't have a nother drop of snow we would be able to ski until may. the large resorts close in mid april. the closure is not typically due to a lack of snow. folks simply start turning their attention to spring recreation such as golf, cycling, etc. my favorite time of the year is skiing in april at loveland. the snow is always superb. it is a non-destination resort near frisco or georgetown. i mention this not as an alternative. it simply serves to alleviate any concerns. we got lots of snow.

either logistics work. i like the small nearby town of fraser. if i was going to do a vacation i'd find a condo in fraser and ride the local transit system. i dase this on the assumption lodging is cheaper given this scenario. i don't want to give the impression any of the towns have much to offer in terms of nightlife. locals frequent one or two local bars or grab a case of beer at the supermarket. it is not austrian style discos. we ski, have a few beers, eat dinner, soak in a hot tub, go to bed, and repeat!

StevenFeldman, i agree. denver has a trendy area called low-doe which is full of bars and eateries. other than that it does nothing for me. i will be the first to admit most american cities have very little to offer. harkening back to my assesment of life in fraser i'm more of a small village kind of guy!

*Ski* the Net with snowHeads

Rusty Guy, spot on - that was taken about 5 years ago, when I was staying at the beaver village.

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

Wear The Fox Hat, i love that expression.....spot on. is there a "spot off"?

snow reports

We got back from our 11 days in WP last week and time for a review.
It seems that the tour ops are pushing WP this year as every brit in the place seemed to have got a deal of some sort. The best being via the daily mail, flights, accomadation and passes for a week for £275. Bargin.
We stayed at the mountain lodge which is opposite the mountain, but across the interstate. This means that although it is only a few hundred metres to the lifts you have to get the ski bus. A minor inconvience, but annoying as the brochure doesn't mention that. An underpass or such would have been a real bonus. The hotel it's self is a bit of rabbit warren with rooms in the new part needing two lifts and a couple of corridor walks to get to. A little bit shabby in places, but generally ok. Compared to a canadian/banff 3 star hotel I think this one would have been rated a 2 star. Food was ok, but brekfasts get busy and why have only one four slice toaster for all those people. Surely a toaster isn't to expensive.

The Mountain. The base area is quite small with a few shops and kit hire outlets, none of which are cheap, but that's to be expected in such a small erea. The first main lift up is a four which should be a 6 as the Mary Jane lift is. Don't know why they would put a 6 further up the mountain, but leave the main lift as a 4. That said the queues weren't a problem except first thing in the morning and a bit at the weekends.
The resort is known for it's bumps and off piste and once there you know why. There is only one small black run that is groomed reg, the rest are left with a couple of others groomed once a week or so. They also half groom some of the runs leaving one side bumped and one side smooth, which seems like a good idea. There are lots of cruising blues, but far to many flat greens that require a lot of paddling and pushing. Everyone commented on these, the borders especially. Some of the really nice blues are spoilt by the fact that they join flat runs at the bottom. If you want just groomed pistes you can do the mountain in a couple fo days and a week at the resort would be enough. I had hoped to try some easy off piste and bumps, hence going to WP and going up timberland gives you this. Coming down through the bowl and into the trees. They seemed to have made an effort at thinning the trees (problems with tree eating bettles apparently) which makes things easy for beginners like myself and during the last few days of sun was fantastic.
We booked three bumps lesson whilst there. The first was a waste of time with the instructor seeming to give up rather than going back to basics. The next lesson was far better, although the instructor didn't se it that way according to Rusty. This time the technique was to stay in the dips between bumps and make things as easy as poss. Different to the day before and the 'turn on top' technique. Odd that the same school teachs different ways to beginners. The third lesson I finally got to met up with Rusty and am pleased to say was the best lesson. He really tries and has a lot of enthusiasm which shows through. The heavier snow fall of the previous few days helped a lot with dealing with the bumps as was shown in the last couple of days trying the same slopes. Practice doesn't seem to make perfect in my case. He went back to basics to get us down the bumps rather than concerntrating on perfect tech. Turning in with the inside knee is something new too. Never mentioned in previous years in Canada or europe. Suppose things just keep evolving. Sorry that we never got together for a drink and proper chat, I really was looking forward to that.
We also went to Copper mountain for a day which is cover on the WP pass. This seems odd as you go past keystone, which is on the breck pass, but copper isn't, to get there. It was sold as a completely pisted mountain, but was anything but. Not all the runs that were supposed to have been groomed had been, atleast not in the previous couple of days. The 10 inchs of snow the night before didn't help those in the party on blades, but did make for great skiing for the rest of us. Well worth a visit even though it took nearly an hour and a half to get there.
The town of winter park is very small and has a few restaurants and a few ski shops. Some of the restaurants were good, smokey moe's, and some not so good, untamed. The ski shops were ok, but quite expensive. I had planned on buying a pair of saloman boots, but found them to be about £30-40 more than here at home let alone in europe. Main shops, such as safeways are in Fraser a couple of miles up the road. All the buses are free, but a bit of a pain having to change in WP and then onto fraser and vice versa. Had a go at the tubing in fraser too. This was great fun and cheap.

In summary WP is quite a small mountain that offers specialist skiing rather than general allround skiing. You can go and cruise around on piste, but after a week you'd have done it all and wasted the resort. You'd be better off going to breck from what I hear or from experience, Banff. WP is an ideal place to goto if you want to try bumps and off piste as everything is there in one compact resort. I gather it has a really good snow record and certainly while we were there the snow was great with a bit of snow every night for the first couple of nights and then some bigger dumps of 6-8inchs for the next few before being left with clear skys and sun for the last few days.
Now we've been to WP will we go back? Probably not as there are other resorts and places I want to go and a limited number of holidays. Would I recommend it to someone else? Yes, no problems at all with that, just be aware of having to push on the flats a bit more than other resorts.
And ask for Rusty. Very Happy

mac, it was a pleasure to ski with you and i wish we had gotten together for a pint. thanks for the kind review you did exceedingly well in the lesson and are a very good skier. as i hope i said, there are a wide variety of ways to ski bumps and to teach mogul skiing. i agree that we should all be on the same page, however, the reality, as you have found out, is that we are not. i can say that everything i presented is based upon info i have garnered from our training staff at WP and/or from our SSD who was a former national demo team member. in reality.....who is to say i'm right!

inside leg steering is really not new. i would posit that it has become more important in the last decade with the advent of new equipment. i also feel strongly that what we do with the inside leg is most important in bumps, steeps, powder, crud, etc.

the snow keeps coming and the bumps keep growing. before long they will be the size of small homes!

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

you are brilliant to remember.

for others.........a remedy to mitigate skiers looking down at their ski tips? the paper plate! it precludes looking down.

A snowHead

Rusty Guy,

It's not something you forget in a hurry!

Help!!

Going to winter park, need some info.

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