 Poster: A snowHead
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I have limited experience as a skier but after a day course followed by 2 weeks at a resort I now can get down any red route that I've tried and can carve on most of them. Still buzzing after my holiday I decided to spend a few days in Glencoe. I purchased a set of cheap skis to avoid the misery that is rental queues.
As soon as I was in the first tow I noticed that I was in a snowplow position. Getting the skis into a parallel position needed a fair bit of effort, it felt like I was forcing my knees out wards. Skiing was difficult and unpleasant though did get easier with practice. Is it just a matter of getting used to new skis? I can find no adjustment on the bindings that may help with this issue.
Cheers
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Maybe you had the the right ski on the left foot and the left ski on the right foot 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Good point, I'll try swapping them around next time, or I could put them on upside down.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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In all seriousness, what skis did you buy, can you post a pic?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Are they your own boots? I had a similar feeling and noticed that one of the canting adjusters had been turned (presumably by my curious kids).
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Any chance the edges have not been de-tuned? That might mean that the still sharp edges at the base of the shovel will bite if there is any hint of a snowplough. That hint of snowplough will be accentuated on a drag, where skis will often rest on their inside edges even if the skis are not turned into a snowplough. Would be cured by rubbing a file along the offending sharp edges.
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The skis are Rossignol Experience 75 and I'm wearing the same boots that I had on holiday. Another factor may be the Teflon snow at Glencoe, I've previously only skied on ice , granular powder or slush. The skis are a bit too flexible but I didn't want to knacker my better skis on the heather and rocks...
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Thu 26-03-15 18:04; edited 1 time in total
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Might be worth getting the skis checked firstly to see if any damage, the ski or skis could be slightly warped especially if previous owner stored them in really bad conditions. Is there any canting plates under the bindings etc. Both are not common issues but equally not impossible.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Skis are new, bought them in the sales last week, they seem to be in perfect condition. Will give them another go tomorrow. On the plus side it's really easy to ski down blue and red routes in the snow plough position. People seem to get annoyed when overtaken by a ploughing skier, especially snowboarders...
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Compare the bInding delta angles on your new and old skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@Ski lots it sounds like your suggestion is the most likely cause. Edges sharpened right to the tip/tail. I would recommend having the ski left like this but add a 0.5 degree base edge angle so they dont feel as 'catchy'. A zero base edge is pretty hard to ski on and some manufacturers will send them out of the factory on the zero edge. You can have greater than .5 on the base edge, fiddle around a bit.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@BobG, the snow @ Glencoe did feel like that last Saturday. Rain followed by some wet fresh then a re-freeze made a pithy layer on top of hardpack. I don't 'detune' my tips or tails either and the skis certainly felt 'hooky' on a couple of occasions on the plateau and the area above the cliffhanger. The pal I was skiing with had the same happening and his edges are always blunt as a blunt thing. The T-Bar up slopes were particularly awkward for it too. It just happens sometimes and the solution is to seek out some sunshine or softer snow ... out of the area off the next mountain, the snow was super lush and you didn't need edges. Similar conditions on the East Ridge. The downside to Glencoe is that its core area all faces NE, and much of it stays out of the sunshine most of the time with the bulk of Meall a Bhuiridh casting a shadow across the basin & plateau which is where the easiest skiing is.
P.S. regards tip & tail 'detuning', I didn't think modern ski shapes benefited much from it ?
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There's more to this than meets the eye...
If there was a physical problem with the bindings then when you swap the skis from Left foot to Right foot then you would get an inverse snowplough.
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P.S. regards tip & tail 'detuning', I didn't think modern ski shapes benefited much from it ?
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Absolutely.
Are the skis the same length as the ones you rented on holiday?
What is your height and ski length?
Short skis with an A-Frame stance will produce this problem.
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You know it makes sense.
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@flangesax, not so likely to a-frame on a drag surely?
@BobG, I've never heard nor seen a pair of skis want to do that on their own ... If they're flat on the snow.
Going up a drag you may have your legs quite wide, pitting the skis on their edges and making them want to do what they were designed to do i.e. turn. In this case, both on inside edges, they'll both turn in...
It could be that they're too short or soft for your weight, but in that case I'd have thought you'd easily overpower them back into line.
So try having your feet shoulder width apart and the skis flat.
Assuming you're not knock kneed...
Also that no-ones been at the bindings with shims - although that would produce two different effects when you swap skis on feet.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Also that no-ones been at the bindings with shims - although that would produce two different effects when you swap skis on feet.
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covered that...
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Going up a drag you may have your legs quite wide, pitting the skis on their edges and making them want to do what they were designed to do i.e. turn. In this case, both on inside edges, they'll both turn in...
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A-framing.... legs wrapped tight around the pommel... legs wide.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@flangesax, that's not classic "a-framing" which is tucking your inside knee in during a turn.
I think you mean a "Poma" lift... Not a "pommel" (after the eponymous engineer)
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Sun 29-03-15 9:47; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@moffatross, agreed, no need to detune shaped skis. I never detuned straight ones either must admit...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Ski length is 168 and I'm 5'10. The hire skis that I learnt on were a bit shorter still. The skis are very soft and I would have been using my 'grown-up' skis if conditions were better. I did alter the cant of my boots on Friday and things did get slightly better. By the end of Friday I was doing some half decent turns and a bit of carving but it took a lot of runs on the same slope to build up famailarity and confidence.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@BobG, height is mostly meaningless... Skis don't know how tall you are...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@under a new name, WoW... you are really going for it today!
No, skis don't don't how tall you are as they are inanimate, however relativity does.
Sorry, yep... caught me red handed... I did mean a Poma lift!... I'm not sure why I wrote that other than to hugely de-rail the thread and the fact that it was a noun used to explain that your legs are wrapped around the pommel on the Poma lift.... my bad 
A-Frames happen before, after, during turns, along with skiing forwards, backwards, left, right, up or down.
It normally happens due to excessive snow ploughing after the first few lessons.... lessons never followed up to the basics of carving or alpine position.
Then you have the A-Frame that only sticks around for the turn... normally because ^^^^
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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How many 5'4" 14 stone skiers do you know?
Stop being so pedantic and a little more realistic.
IMO/E Classic case of an A framing skier who could do with a little help ironing out. New skis at different widths or length (out of the norm) are amplifying the problem.
If your height has nothing to do with anything then why do skis come in different lengths?.... those damn money stealing manufacturers!...
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Wha does relativity have to do with it?
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I think you'll find relativity has quite a lot to do with everything!
Maybe my slight artistic use of English was a bit way off target but TBH this is why I very rarely post on tech threads.... just a waste off time... i'm out!
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@BobG, have I got this right..you had a 1 day course...learn to ski in a fridge perhaps...then 2 weeks in resort, was that a 2 week course or with lessons?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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2weeks with 4 or 5 hours per day private lessons...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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bollox.... i'm back!
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Skis come in different lengths because people come in different weights...
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Yeah... I feel no difference between my 123's and my 185's
I have a crash diet/Burger King in between using either pair.
....Actually that is pretty accurate as I can ski well and edge/carve properly. The only thing that changes hugely is the turning radius.... which make me thinks of overturning, under turning, difficulties of carving a longer ski vs ease of turning a short ski. So... maybe, just maybe the OP isn't quite ready to edge and carve properly and has an A-Frame.... which will explain all of the issues in this post.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@flangesax, except it's not a-framing as ....
Oh whatever.
I'm reasonably sure you're right without seeing OP ski. Skis don't naturally snowplough unless your legs make them do so.
Having been reading early part of thread on tiny screen, I hadn't picked up on the single lesson aspect.
Without doubt, more instruction required... 
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@under a new name, he has explained he had 2 weeks of half day private lessons as well
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You know it makes sense.
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Getting the skis into a parallel position needed a fair bit of effort, it felt like I was forcing my knees out wards
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hmm - classic problem with New School. Don't push your knees forcibly out, just rotate your feet at the ankles to get them parallel or put your boots close together properly - like we used to - it's so much more attractive !
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@holidayloverxx, yeah, I should read the thread shouldn't I?
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Poster: A snowHead
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2 weeks with 4-5 hours per day private lessons!
....with a qualified instructor?
The school I work for charges €230 per day for a 4 hour private lesson (maximum 2 people).
That was one heck of an investment
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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€230 per day for a 4 hour private lesson
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but not all are that expensive. 5 consecutive days of 2 hour lessons (which is as long as I, personally, could absorb) is €300 in low season with the ESF here - more in school holidays.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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WGAS?
The OP said 4 to 5 hours or private lessons for 2 weeks!... so a bargain at €1200...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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The school I work for charges €230 per day for a 4 hour private lesson
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how much of that does the instructor see?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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WGAS?
.....oooo me... got a link?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Threads like this normally appear in 2 days' time
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Get back on track, people - the guy needs your help
Most probably the snow conditions to blame, especially if it's only on the Poma.
Could be as simple as leaning further back on the lift.....
But if it continues, and you are skiing on skis that are 'soft', then bring your knees together - old school - and present a larger footprint to the snow
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@c44rver, i think most reasonable issues have been covered, so time for snowheads threaddriftfun 
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FAQ
weight's the critical factor, although I will concede that there will be some bio-mechanical differences between someone at 5'4" and 14 stone, and someone at 6'8" and 14 stone. I'm not sure you need any compensation in ski length.
