Please talk to me about rental skis

A snowHead

I am wondering what the difference is between different grades of rental ski?
The cheap ones are usually described as beginner skis with the price progression going up with ski ability.

I realise the more expensive ones are probably more expensive skis but surely a wealthy beginner would like a really expensive beginner ski thats really easy to turn and nice to use?
I am an intermediate and usually go for the middle ski option- I am however, not interested in going fast. If I went for the the cheapest skis would they be easier to control and maybe actually better for someone cruising around like me?

The only thing I can think of is that a better ski is easier to control at high speeds than a cheaper ski? Is that right?

I hope you understand what I'm trying to say here- not really interested in the money saving- its just something I've always wondered.

A snowHead

Ski hire varies by shop and resort. Typically the more you pay the newer the gear. If you order the bottom level called beginner/blue/budget etc. this is normally a year or two old. I do not think they give you a 'better' or more expensive ski but I could be wrong Smile

Of course you can order specialist gear too.

On my last trip I pre ordered mid range through the TO as they provided free kids ski hire. My boots were at least one season old, but my skis were virtually new. You win some, you lose some. Year before I ordered mid range direct from shop and got nearly new skis and the man in the shop removed the tags of a brand new pair of head boots for me.

When I was learning would I have noticed the difference is Skis? Probably not.
Would I notice the difference now, Probably yes.

I am no pro, just an intermediate skier.

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<generalization>The rental shops here generally have the premium packages for new and or expensive skis, and budget packages for good skis that are one or 2 years old or new but inexpensive skis.
The price of a ski does not determine how easily you can make it turn. </genralization>
The main factors here (independent of skiiers ability) are the shape of the ski ( radius, sidecut, length etc...) the stiffness of the ski (how much effort is required to make it flex), the stability of the ski (how easy it is to keep it where you want it).
This is a very simplistic view, but if you were to go into Bill And Teds Most Excellent Hire Shop in Morzine for example, and look at what you got for the Competition Package versus the beginner package, as a beginner you may struggle with the competion range (Heavier, stiffer, longer etc...) great for hard packed racing tracks, but a handful in soft bumpy stuff.
Ski hire shops have been renting to all abilities for 60 years now, and the shops that are still going are pretty good at finding the right match of equipment to ability.

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I have for the past few years always had the cheapest skis the hire shop offered, In the past when I had a bit more cash I had my own expensive skis or hired the best, but to be honest I can't tell much difference. I still ski quite hard when I want to and providing the edges are sharp(ish) its fine.

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@Mike-H, was that with Esprit? I have found even with their so called "free" childrens ski hire it has worked out cheaper using either snowbrainer or alpinresorts to book for the family. Sometimes you even get free childrens hire through those middle men. This is often using the same hire shops as they do.

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Last season I lent a rather impoverished near-beginner friend a pair of my skis - Elan Wave Magics. She's a big girl, quite a bit heavier than me and a bit taller and the skis are relatively short. I'm no hot shot skier, and I thought the skis would be OK for her. My mistake. She had some private lessons and after the first one the instructor strongly advised her to get some easier skis, and said the Wave Magics were not suitable for a beginner. So she rented some "Big Easy" skis and did find them a lot easier.

After all it is free

@NickyJ, Yes it was. Looked at the online options for mid range gear and the price was marginally better with Esprit (about £10) when I priced in 2 free kids. Chose to go with TO as they could help during week if kids skis or anything else needed sorting.

However hire price will vary by resort. Looking at Val D for my next trip in March and everything is a lot more pricey.

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I've had hit and miss experiences with top whack ski packages vs bottom end so this year I'm going in cheap and see what I get and if it's crap I'll just pretend I know more than I do and upgrade... Best time was when I got a chance to chat to one of the guys in the shop who took the time to talk to me about what kind of skiing I do etc and paired me up with something he recommended, that did make difference!

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@pam_w- You have proved the assertion correct "The more you pay - the easier it is to turn". Very Happy

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Best skis I've ever hired was due to confusion with the booking on the part of the hire shop - I had pre-booked online, but because my surname is also a common male first name, they figured I must just be an incompetent bloke who couldn't fill in a firm correctly rolling eyes

The looked at me quizzically before deciding to hand over the somewhat longer and more masculine skis they'd picked out. Practically brand new and suited me very nicely Toofy Grin

Again, more generalisations.

But, Beginner skis don't tend to have quite so much technology to them, they are usually soft cored and quite light, aiding turning with little effort allowing the skier to become used to what is required to control the ski. The more you advance the more technology goes in to the equipment, different types of core, rocker, stiffness, weight etc - which, stage by stage, make turning 'more difficult' but as one would have the experience as an intermediate skier to use intermediate stiffer skis, which would be more stable at higher speeds (not necessarily fast, just higher speed) and allow for more aggressive carving/turning/skiing. Advanced/Expert skis are usually very stiff and quite heavy to allow for incredible stability at very high speeds and stable turning.

Within each category there are also other categories, for example. I ski on a Q90, it's not the stiffest ski nor the heaviest but it is reasonably advanced, allowing for All Mountain access - It's stable enough for high speed skiing and stiff enough for aggressive turning/carving a very responsive ski to an aggressive skier and even has a touch of Rocker in the tails. But it's also light enough to not sink in Off-Piste snow and the slight softness allows for some bounce to allow rhythm in the off Piste. The slight softness means I have to work harder to maintain a very aggressive high speed carve but the overall versatility of the ski makes up for the fact it's not a heavy lump only useful for aggressive Piste skiing.

Generally speaking more technology means more money - same with most things really. New gear is more expensive because it's top of the line - like all things - the New IPhone is really expensive and the previous one - not so much any more.

A person would be the luckiest in the world if year after year they have consistently has Brand new ski hire with out paying specifically for it. There are some shops out there that guarantee brand new skis (if you pay a premium) and even open and mount the ski in front of you - but this is over the top and un necessary. You should expect gear to be 1 or 2 seasons old, it's a lovely bonus to get new boots/skis, I mean, new gear has to enter the system at some point and someone has to be first to use it - but remember just because it has been hired in previous seasons doesn't mean it's been skied on every week for the last however many years. A thing can be hardly used but not be new anymore, and that doesn't make it worthless.

You know it makes sense.

I haven't had a package through a tour op. If you hire independently in Austria then mostly the skis are graded by type and all are in good condition. I haven't noticed old high end skis in low cost ranges and if you get the budget range the skis may well be brand new, just a budget model. Lower cost means softer lighter more generic skis and you get what you are given, shops have a limited range to cover body sizes weights and shapes. If you are beginning or just cruising around these will be perfect and it is not worth paying more for a more expensive model which does effectively the same.

If you pay more you get more choice and a wider range of types, radius, width etc and access to more expensive skis, specialist off piste or park skis, race replicas etc. You can usually swap about as well and try out different styles so it is worth it if you know what you want, or want to experiment a bit.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Are the skis that are rented out the same as you would buy retail? I have read that a lot of snowheads seem to try out new model via renting to decide to buy. But I had also heard that the rentals are built differently to take the greater use and punishment they get. Or is that just the low end stuff?

A snowHead

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Thank you everyone for your detailed replies. I am loving reading this while trying to get some work done!
As an intermediate I understand that the more expensive ski (talking mid-range rental here) will be higher tech but still not sure what the implications of that are for me/ and my kids. (I totally get that race/competition ones are different)

are we saying...

lowest level skis will be older and easier to control but less stable at high speed?
medium level skis will have more technology so more stable at high speeds but may be harder to control?

Last year I had the medium level and my daughter the cheapest- she tried my skis and found them very difficult to control as they were much longer than hers (we are similar height and shoe size). I thought to myself - why do I have fancy long skis that are more difficult? (I ski one week a year so would never put any difficulties I was having down to the skis)

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Don't let them fob you off with short carving skis, they do this to make you look like a tourist.

Long and thin is what you need.

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@WindOfChange, oh, I see, it was a joke. Sorry, being thick this morning....

I think the long and thin thing was a joke too..... wink

After all it is free

Damn, I was just waxing down my Rossignol Open 195s Very Happy

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it will also make it easier to swap skis if you have a decent relationship with the shop.

The skis I lent my beginner friend were only up to her shoulder but the instructor still didn't approve.

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Thanks so much- mountain- for taking the time to explain that to me.

That seems clear, If you are going faster/steeper you need a heavier ski.

Hmmm. have to decide if I want to fork out for the teens!

Another factor here is boots too. Cheap ski hire usually means cheaper boots which are often more of a beginners boot - more comfy but less stiff and responsive. In my experience cheaper skis tend to be a bit more flexible but that means they flap about a lot at speed. Expensive doesn't always mean heavier. Some prefer heavy, stable cruisers whereas others prefer light, shorter skis for responsiveness and tricks etc. Then there's the side cut for the amount of carve and some skis seems to be getting thicker for powder. There's a lot out there...
Speak to the people in the hire shop, they are usually quite helpful. If you have an internet phone, why not look up reviews of the skis they're offering you. A quick click and you'll have an in depth review of your ski and the type of skier it suits.

You know it makes sense.

Whenever I've had to rent equipment or been out with friends who needed to rent I've been surprised by how little relationship there is between the price/level paid or reserved and the quality of the skis supplied. At least in france, as pam w says above about relationship with ski shop, it also helps if you can speak french (or know someone who can) and be quite assertive about your expectations (re: equipment). Don't be fobbed off with sub-standard gear if you have paid top whack for it. By the same token, don't expect top-of-the-range stuff if you've gone cheap. Also be aware that you are most likely wasting your money if you pay for high-end stuff but are just starting out -- you don't need it. Most decent rental places will help you select the right equipment, others (minority) will try to make you pay for stuff you don't need.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Keep in mind tho that even low end modern shaped skis are a significant improvement over nearly all of the skis available even 10-15 years ago .. some may quibble with this but I've been on skis for over 40 years and modern equipment is light years ahead of what we had back in the day .. sure the top end stuff is great but the lower end stuff these days will still be pretty good IMHO.

A snowHead

Excellent reading!

A snowHead

For an intermediate I reckon it's 90% in the head, 10% in the skis.

I hired for a good few years in various resorts, direct with recommended shops, or with a SkiSet or Intersport affiliated place pre-booked. Generally there were 3 levels for hire, and I always had the option to swap within that range if I wanted.

Budget = Beginner to intermediate oriented ski choices, generally a year old so they've had a few months constant use. Look a bit tired, but work ok.
Middle = Beginner to intermediate oriented ski choices, generally this season's skis so relatively new.
High end = Intermediate to Advanced oriented ski choices with different use types available (off piste / park / race rep / carve), should be this season's skis.

Fact is, budget or middle options will make little difference for an intermediate, so long as they are well maintained with sharp edges and a good waxing.

Me and the better half are classic examples. We are both average Brit intermediate holiday piste skiers. Can do most pistes but only really venture onto blacks a few times in a week 'to test ourselves'.

We started off both renting budget level skis. I was fastest / best in the mornings, she was fastest/best in the afternoons because she's fitter.

I started reading sites like this in a quest to know more. Convinced myself I wanted to rent better skis (she stuck with budget). I was fastest / best in the mornings, she was fastest/best in the afternoons because she's fitter.

I then bought my own skis cos I'm a man and I want to own my own toys. They look good propped up outside the slopeside bars, I feel good and want to ski more. I offered to buy her some but she didn't want the extra luggage so settled on making sure we got new season skis for her. I was fastest / best in the mornings, she was fastest/best in the afternoons because she's fitter.

In short, don't compromise on maintenance. All hire shops should swap skis and give you a fresh service, whatever level of hire. But for the average skiier, I see no real reason to spend too much on rental. That said, if better skis make you feel better about your skiing, why not? Very Happy

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My wife goes for the colour that matches her ski outfit.

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@cameronphillips2000, I`ve been known to suggest a ski because I liked the colour Laughing

But I have always listened to the experts in the shop and taken what they have advised.

Its best to go in at a not too busy time then there is plenty of time to discuss your ability and the kind of skiing you like to do along the prevailing snow conditions. They are the experts and rarely seem to get it badly wrong.

We have always found shops very willing to swop skis if one of us has not liked a set or indeed because snow conditions have changed.

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Different skis suit different conditions. I had some amazing skiing in Canada on some lightweight skis that were really responsive and great for throwing about. I then hired the same skis in Stowe and found them flapping about in the icy conditions and changed them to something a lot more rigid. You may be lucky enough to be at a resort where there's a testing session going on from distributors or manufacturers. You simply swap your skis for theirs and off you go. I once spent a day skiing the Salomon range. I remember noticing the palpable difference between the different skis.
It would be interesting to see how many people have tried their skis before buying them. I may start another thread.

After all it is free

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I'm intrigued by the "colour length concept" that's invisible to customers: that's technology you don't get on retail skis.

(Or perhaps you do...)

Help!!

Please talk to me about rental skis

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