 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi all,
Following on from my previous thread-advice for skiing solo I've spent the day weighing up my options. It's really down wether I want a weeks coaching and the hopeful social scene that will go with that, or go for one of the earlier bashes less learning more social.
Both of these companies seem highly regarged, but Snoworks offer more variety in terms of the resorts and programmes on offer. Warren Smith seems confined to Verbier-an epic ski region by all accounts but the cost once in resort could be hefty for eating/drinking out? Snoworks All Terrain or off pistes courses appeal plus the flights and accomdation package seem a good deal.
I saw some previous reviews of Snoworks but these go back a few years. Would love to hear peoples experiences (good and bad) are they mostly attended by other solo skiers??
Thanks in advance!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
It's really down wether I want a weeks coaching and the hopeful social scene that will go with that, or go for one of the earlier bashes less learning more social.
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Solve the problem by doing both!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Add Inside Out Skiing to the list?
The owners are on here, and I suspect a reasonable portion of their clientele, are sH also.
Will be doing that rather than the PSB bash with tuition this year. Had excellent time on both before. Never been on Warren Smith or Snoworks before, but I'd imagine they are similar.
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andy, are you due in Meribel second week in December?
If so then I look forward to meeting you (having warmed up at the PSB  ).
Work wouldn't allow me to carry two weeks' holiday forward to next year so I had to come up with some sort of solution!!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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pam w, I wish! I could be pushing it with my wife asking for 2 weeks but you don't ask you don't get right?!
andy, Thanks, I'll certainly look at them too! Did you go on your own?
ETA
I did come across the company today but they're fully booked on the courses that appeal/suit my dates.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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didn't know anyone the IO course I did before.
don't know anyone on this upcoming IO course either (well other than Rob and Scott).
didn't know anyone on the first sH bash I did either. but of course when I went on the 2nd, I did know quite a few 
yep I'm on the Meribel one in a few weeks. did Sölden before (their first one). contemplated the one just before the Birthday bash, but it was fully booked I think, and quite fancied the San Cassiano one later in the season (only decided against that, because I've been to Sella Ronda 6 times, and going again for the Birthday Bash, and I'd prefer tuition near the start of the season).
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Bene I've done both Snoworks and Warren Smith performance courses and for my money Snoworks are better. They were all some time ago but as I recall nearly everyone there was solo. Snoworks is still Phil Smith's company so I'm sure the quality and ethos is the same and with one exception he only employs full cert instructors and BASI trainers. Might even rebook sometime as he now operates out of La Tania a few weeks a year.
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Raceplate, I was thinking of Snoworks too. Apart from the instruction, how was everything else set up (travel, stay, food etc) when you went?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ALQ, some courses have accommodation packages, some are independent - have a look at the website. He tends to use chalethotels so you've always got someone to eat and drink with and a bar full of other people on the courses so it's easy really. Looks like his main travel supplier is now Mark Warner so the quality should be good. Only downside is that my experience of MW is that they're bloody hard to negotiate with for a cheap single supplement (though they do back down when there's only 24 hours to the flight!) Hopefully he's negotiated a fair rate for a supplement for his attendees.
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I've done both Snoworks and Warren Smith before. Unlike Raceplate I preferred Warren Smith.
Both companies have discounted rates for accomodation. As all the accomodation is catered, and with free wine at meal times, resort prices have minimal impact. As nearly all the people in the accomodation will be on the courses, the social side is pretty good too.
I agree about the single supplement issue though.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Raceplate wrote: |
| ... have a look at the website. |
Yup...got distracted by their VERY interesting blog posts.
They should organise room-shares for solos; I'm sure they'll have plenty of interest from the ultra-keen skier market.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Mosha Marc wrote: |
| I've done both Snoworks and Warren Smith before. Unlike Raceplate I preferred Warren Smith. |
How come? What made the difference?
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| ALQ wrote: |
| Mosha Marc wrote: |
| I've done both Snoworks and Warren Smith before. Unlike Raceplate I preferred Warren Smith. |
How come? What made the difference? |
Depends if you like Braquage or not 
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You know it makes sense.
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| ALQ wrote: |
| They should organise room-shares for solos; I'm sure they'll have plenty of interest from the ultra-keen skier market. |
They do as far as I know?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Spyderman,
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Depends if you like Braquage or not
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+1
My only memory of a week's skiing!
Well, that and being forced to ski Tortin when not a single person in the group was capable of doing it without falling spectacularly. Then sitting in the pub with one of his Instructors (an ex moguls ski champ) who after a few beers tells us the stuff Warren's teaching for bumps is all wrong. Not exactly confidence inspiring.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Raceplate wrote: |
| ALQ wrote: |
| They should organise room-shares for solos; I'm sure they'll have plenty of interest from the ultra-keen skier market. |
They do as far as I know? |
Yes, both do. If your ski school model includes a "technical camp" type approach with an accommodation base, video analysis in the evening, course participants skiing and socialising together, then the issue of single rooms is a major challenge. Many of the people who opt for these camps are keen skiers and will often have a family holiday or ski with friends, but then travel solo for an extra trip when they want some ski coaching. If you have a high proportion of solo travellers on a week like that few hotels/chalets will have sufficient single rooms to cope with the demand. So you do your best to match people up in same sex room shares, and keep the single supplement as low as possible.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Bene, have a look at friendship holidays they do singles holidays and use Mark Warner, when we were in St Anton Snoworks had a course at the same time, i have done the Warren Smith course and thought it was Awesome!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| ALQ wrote: |
| Mosha Marc wrote: |
| I've done both Snoworks and Warren Smith before. Unlike Raceplate I preferred Warren Smith. |
How come? What made the difference? |
Difficult to put my finger on it. When I first started WS courses, they pushed me to ski more difficult terrain than I'd skied before, as a result I felt I moved on quite quickly. Now I like the fact that they're trying to increase my "technique toolbox" so I vary my style of skiing depending on the slope/snow I'm on. There is also a very relaxed feel to it - but that may be because I know most of the guys pretty well now.
With Snoworks, the feel was more of a "normal" ski school and I never really got my head round some of the ways they were trying to teach me. That said, my skiing did improve with them and I learned a style I've used ever since.
When I first started looking at courses to go on, the fact that you got more hours in the day with WS probably clinched it for me.
And I haven't really done much braquage work with WS in recent years either.
Both are good and I'm sure you'll do well with whoever you go with.
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Bene, Have been with Snoworks for the last 5 years and rate them highly - both for tuition and the social side.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Thanks, all food for thought. Sharing with someone I don't know I might have to get my head around! I'll enquire about single supplements. I hadn't noticed that you're getting more hours tuition with WS so will have to factor that in, although Snoworks edging it with a choice of resorts.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Bene, I did the Warren Smith course and I think it was great, tuition and social side. They also do a course in Cervinia, end on November, if you want to avoid Verbier costs.
I am going again this year !
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| Quote: |
Both are good and I'm sure you'll do well with whoever you go with.
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Bene, That is your answer! Both Phil and Emma and Warren and his crew deliver top class products,.
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Bene, I did an All Terrain course with Snoworks in Tignes last year which was excellent, with a fantastic instructor.
It was based in Mark Warner's Hauts Toviere chalet-hotel, which does have some single rooms without a supplement (one of which I stayed in). I think these may get booked up quite early though, but it's still worth enquiring. Otherwise you can opt for a room share with another Snoworks client of the same sex, with no supplement, or pay a supplement to have a twin room to yourself.
I didn't know anyone else on the course/s, but it turned out to be a nice mixture of other solo travellers, couples and pairs of friends. You all eat together each night so it's very sociable, and we had an absolute ball. Many of us skied together on the free mornings/afternoons too. For a solo traveller, it was probably better than a normal chalet holiday as everyone there was skiing at a similar level and with similar aspirations for the week.
For me, three hours coaching a day felt enough, as it was quite full-on. It was nice to spend the free half of the day going off to play and practice our new skills. I think they do some courses which are full day tuition too though.
They've got a repeat booking from me for the coming season anyway.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Ooh, that's weird, an automatic link to MW's website's appeared in my post. Do they sponsor Snowheads or something?
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| Bene wrote: |
| Thanks, all food for thought. Sharing with someone I don't know I might have to get my head around! I'll enquire about single supplements. |
Pack some earplugs
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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three hours coaching a day felt enough, as it was quite full-on. It was nice to spend the free half of the day going off to play and practice our new skills
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I'd agree with that. I think diminishing returns set in after 3 hours. Bene, is there some way of organising a "snowy mountain" holiday, rather than a pure skiing holiday, which your wife would enjoy? That might stand you in good stead for the future. There's a range of things to do - though mostly with a rather active, outdoor, slant to them so if she really hates all that stuff, you might struggle. Snowshoeing is great, not difficult at all on easy terrain, and most resorts have a range of walks you can do, some on your own, some guided. And most also have pisted walks where you don't need snowshoes, just walking shoes. Going up in a gondola, having a vin chaud, or lunch, in such stupendous surroundings, or sitting by a log fire reading a book. All extremely enjoyable (my daughter did a lot of the last, when too pregnant to ski). In the French resort where I have my apartment - Les Saisies - I would estimate that no more than 50% of the winter visitors are skiing or snowboarding.
There are also some "spa" and "treatment" kind of options - they seem expensive, but you can get several for the price of a week's lift pass - as my non-skiing sister in law reminds her husband. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| DCG wrote: |
| Bene wrote: |
| Thanks, all food for thought. Sharing with someone I don't know I might have to get my head around! I'll enquire about single supplements. |
Pack some earplugs |
I'd sleep with one eye and both ears open....... 
Im not particularly outgoing OP. I did/do some instructing for a UK based company, and when you go you get chucked in with others, same when I did my training, they soon get used to you walking round in the buff which was my biggest worry.
You'll soon realise that the potential money saved on sharing you can spend on beer or another holiday. How old are you? I guess it's different depending on your age group.
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Thanks for the info.pam w, I'm not sure whether I mentioned in my other thread but my wife does ski, not as passionate as me but happy to do a week a year but doesn't have enough annual leave and doesn't get her new allocation until April. Also we hope she'll fall pregnant in the next few months and has said although I'm sure it's fine if she did she'd not feel comfortable skiing.
Sorry for the life story......!
Grizwald, I'm 33. I guess I just find the idea of a private roomier appealing. But alien to me the concept of room with a stranger.
CathS, What sort of level were to when you did Snoworks course? I'd appreciate if you'd be wiling to give some detail on the All Terrain course as that's what I'm interested in. My piste skiing is at an acceptable level for me but a week of off piste only may kill me. I'm useless at off piste!
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You know it makes sense.
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Thought the same for my first such bash. They're only a stranger when you arrive at the airport. By the time you've met up and had a pre-flight beer in the airport lounge or introduced over dinner... they're new ski friends And next yr you'll probably be arranging that extra ski trip with them on facebook or something (I did).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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CathS,
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| For a solo traveller, it was probably better than a normal chalet holiday as everyone there was skiing at a similar level and with similar aspirations for the week. |
+1 That's precisely why I used to go on them.
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Poster: A snowHead
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And I suspect that the ratio of "single travellers" is a lot higher on those coaching weeks than on an ordinary chalet holiday.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Bene, from talking to those on the Friendship holidays not all are single, just that their significant other doesn't ski, we fist came across them when I had to pay an outrageous single room supplement at MW in L2D and there where people with Friendship who hadn't paid the supplement but they also did some shares as well, as I mentioned the friendship week matched the Snowworks one in St Anton. On the Warren Smith course there were a number of singles and not all where staying at the Inghams hotel, you could go independent, it's easy to take the train from Geneva contact the tourist office for accommodation .
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Bene, Wozza's course is very 'cool' - you will get to hob-(k)nob with his sleb clients in the FLounge every night - Heston Blumenthal, Suzanna Reid, and of course Big Lol and his entourage.
Hard to put on a price on that...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I have done my learning with Skivo2 (aka Skivolution ) . Nov-Dec full-on in Kaprun (simple hotel) and thereafter Courchevel Le Praz in their own well-catered chalets where Performance skiers and easy-lifers can be equally accommodated in the same week. Top BASI instructors and great ambience. On "ordinary" weeks everyone gets 2 hours instruction per day included , at their own level, and on Performance weeks those opting for this get the full day each day.They claim someting around 90% re-booking/recommendation rate which implies I'm not the only happy customer.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi Bene,
When I did the Snoworks All Terrain, I was in the Level 4 group. I'd done about 10 weeks of skiing at that point and was confident on reds and easier blacks (I think defined as 'adventurous intermediate'). I'd only attempted a little bit of off-piste before. The course wasn't all off-piste, it was probably about 50/50 on and off, as they got us to practice some of the techniques on the piste first, and we also did some steeps and moguls skills on piste. I think the snow conditions also dictated the focus to some extent.
I felt pretty comfortable at that level and the rest of the group felt quite evenly matched. I found I was stronger at the piste skiing than some of the others, but not so strong at the off-piste. The instructor seemed pretty good at mixing things around so that everyone got a confidence boost each day and no-one got too badly spanked! I came away at the end of the week feeling another step-change in my skiing, which was great and was able to tackle stuff on the next couple of trips that I would have struggled with before.
Re. your earlier query about solo skiing, I've also had some great solo holidays where I've stayed in catered chalets. There are some that have single rooms without a supplement (though you have to hunt around for them and generally book early). Booking into a fairly large chalet e.g. 20+ seems a good formula, as it's more likely to be a mixture of different people and small groups rather than being dominated by just one group (you can always check with the operator first), and if there are any unpleasant or annoying characters they tend to be dissipated by the numbers. I've been with LeSki a couple of times and they seem to have a nice very skiing-focused clientele. Always met plenty of skiing buddies; or can choose to ski on my own then have a nice social atmosphere in the evening; or retire to my room with a book if I want a quiet evening.
I think I would avoid a specialist 'singles' holiday like the plague! Sure to be loaded with non-skiing expectations? It's much more relaxed being on holiday with a mixed party of friends/family groups, a few couples and one or two other solo skiers that I've usually found on chalet holidays. Travelling solo shouldn't mean that you fall into some sort of special needs category that requires a segregated holiday!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
Travelling solo shouldn't mean that you fall into some sort of special needs category that requires a segregated holiday!
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Quite so.
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CathS, Thanks so much for your detailed response. I'm working on doing a weeks academy and a weeks holiday now too!
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I and my three skiing friends are looking forward to our warren smith course in cervinia at the end of november, first time together first course for me, after weeks of endless skiing to the horizon. love italy... bello
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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In April I stayed with MountainSun Ltd for three nights in Tignes with a minimal single supplement. I then joined Snoworks for the off-piste course which was mornings. Made it a preyty cheap tuition holiday. Although I did not stay at the MW Chalet which about 50% of the clientele stayed at it was very sociable with after ski drinks and I free skied with fellow clients in the afternoons. Enjoyed the tuition and the skiing.
Have looked at Warren Smith and the thought of the expense of Verbier has put me off. Great area though.
Total Ski & Inghams (same owner) do have reasonable single supplements. You do not have to stay with MW on a Snoworks trip. Search for a single room the week of a Snoworks trip.
The Ski Club Great Britain do specific non single supplement tuition weeks. I am on an off-piste course with the club in April as the dates suited me. Staying in a Mark Warner with a share. Whilst I prefer my own room am ex-Army and have been on many dive boats with strangers. Take some ear plugs. Most people are decent.
Have stayed a couple of times with ClubMed with a negligible single supplement. There is ESF 'tuition' thrown in too. Actually did go with friends but why share for the same price. See Aime La Plagne & Chamonix
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Just come back from a snoworks all terrain course. Loved every minute of it. Didn't know anyone, but dinner was on big tables and we all just sat wherever! Stayed in a MW chalet (single supplement £85)….Am probably a confident level 5 on snoworks scale…
Will definitely go with them again….
Have done Warren Smith in the past - when I still struggled to stay parallel in corners and was just venturing into steeper terrain. Comparing the two - Warren Smith very good for that stage of my skiing, but much more formulaic. Thought that snoworks concentrated more on effective off piste techniques (even though we were on a glacier, but with fab snow), and what worked for the individual, rather than making you all ski the same way…
I would have considered doing an inside out course, as were also highly recommended, but they weren't running one the right week!
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FAQ
