Easyjet had to get 36 Passengers for Geneva leave aircraft before take-off!

A snowHead

Hurjam, Welcome to Snowheads also

. Since you and neveragaineasyjet doubtless have items of mutual interest to discuss Toofy Grin

, you may both be interested to know that there is a PM (Private Message ) facility on Snowheads that lets you send messages to each other. Just click on the Send/Read Messages icon at the top RH corner of this page, then in the new page that opens select the New Post icon on the LH side.

A snowHead

I wrote the comments above before I read the post of neveragaineasyjet. It sounds quite probable to me that ten tons extra was loaded instead of one ton. Responsibility for such an error may lie with more than one person. We have all made mistakes.

Monium, has a very good point. I worked for thirty odd years for a TO's airline. We never offloaded passengers to solve this kind of problem.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I was also on the easyJet flight from Birmingham to Geneva on Boxing Day (arriving home yesterday)having spent the whole week without any luggage and constantly phoning easyJet and Geneva airport to track down our bags. I was finally advised on Saturday, 1st Jan (the day before I came home) that our bags had been located in the airport and were available for me to collect on my return the next day. Despite the problems with too much fuel and the 4 hour delay in persuading 36 passengers to get off the plane with no guarantee of a flight the next day, my main gripe with easyJet is that at no point did the pilot tell us that our luggage was not on the aircraft. We only discovered this when we were standing at the carousel in the baggage reclaim area. The cabin crew even had the nerve to wish us a pleasant onward journey - were they taking the p***!!

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It looks like a bad call to have offloaded 36 passengers and ALL the baggage, rather than 56 passengers WITH their baggage. The decision might have been taken on the spot, or higher up. Again, there would be commercial implications. On a PR basis, the alternative decision would have been better.

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notsoeasyjet,

It may be an idea to post your situation on the Flightmole website - mainly concerned with delays and cancellations but there are some quite bright cookies on there who may be able to point you in the right direction.

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Thanks for advice

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

neveragaineasyjet, what an awful situation - I hope you are rightfully compensated

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neveragaineasyjet, see 1st post at the top of this page - Alastair Pink has explained how to send a private message

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neveragaineasyjet,

snow reports

Sorry to hear how awful the trip was for everyone impacted by this, I was unfortunately unable to access the West Midlands reports and the original post did not seem to match my experience, as I was under the impression this was the flight on the 27th and not the 26th, and could not find any other details on the internet.

Apologies for any confusion caused by my first post.

You know it makes sense.

In a nutshell, the case against easyjet, for those who made the flight, is for delayed luggage. At present the rules are governed by the Montreal Convention - Your Travel Rights has a page which discusses this. Note that a claim must be made within 21 days of delivery - personally, I'd get it in within 21 days of the flight, to be on the safe side.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

iirc Geneva charge the airline based on the landing weight of the aircraft.

Maybe they just offloaded everything to save time, after all time is money, and nowhere more than in aviation!

Welcome to the new folks who were unlucky enough to endure this (non) flight.

10 tonnes of fuel is not a trickle, and would take a while to load on.

I flew with Air Berlin in 2010 (non ski related) at could not fault them at all, and they were considerably cheaper than EJ too.

Just checked what ski resorts they fly to from the UK.

Gatwick - Salzburg, Vienna and Munich (not 1st choice dest, but Innsbruck can get diverted there anyway)

Stansted - Innsbruck, Klagenfurt (?), Salzburg, Vienna, Zurich, Munich

If you need to go somewhere in Germany that the main uk carriers dont go near and you can get to Stanstead AB are your folks, 17 German airports from Stanstead.

http://www.airberlin.com/site/start.php?LANG=eng&all=1&MARKT=GB

Better planes, better service (by a mile...or should that be km) and a better price.

Disclaimer: I have only flown with them once (well twice as it was a return ticket rolling eyes

) and found them faultless. 1-2 flights is not ideal for recording trends Laughing

A snowHead

Defuelling wasnt an option i was told by the captain. I specifically asked him this face to face. "Birmingham airport doesnt have the equipment for that as it is too small an airport." - does anyone know if this was complete BS as well.....???

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I would be a little surprised to hear that defuelling is absolutely impossible at BHX. But there are increasingly more local restrictions. Time was likely to be a real pressure, particularly with respect to the jet curfew at GVA, and the possibility of the aircraft and crew being out of position. Speculation about reducing weight to reduce landing fees is complete nonsense. a) It doesn't work that way. b) No airline would consider it worth doing.

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So now there are 3 of you in touch. I hope you get some satisfaction. Good luck and I hope you'll let us know what happens.

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ItsSnowJoke, I have flown with German Wings on business, and found them OK. I see they carry skis free. They fly to Zurich, Salzburg and Munich from Stansted - and also fly from Manchester and Edinburgh.

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After all it is free

I'm fairly certain some jets can't take off from some airports with a full load of pax and luggage. Flew Ryanair to Fuerteventura (part of "package" organised by OH, which I suspect was a "packaged" flight + hotel deal that would've had no "get me home" rights had Ryanair been difficult). This plane (out of bournmouth) and 3 rows of prime seats near the front blocked off and not allowed to be occupied - flight was otherwise packed, and we spent a LONG time fuelling. I would guess that the flight was towards the outer edge of the range of the plane - hence time spent fuelling - we also used most of the runway to get into the air - presumably hence the empty seats being more or less at the front, to help the nose come off.

Certainly didn't help my nervous flyer position, but it was all fine!

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geoffers,

http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=71248#1677591

Do keep up! wink

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doh!!

I've been trying to avoid reading this thread for yonks, but curiosity took over & I just had to take a peek

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geoffers,

We've all done it! Very Happy

Randomsabreur

You know it makes sense.

I was once asked to leave an EJ aircraft.

Our flight was delayed for 3 hours so we sat at the bar at Nice, drinking beers. The small bar was only 30 feet away from our check in area and whilst we were the only ones drinking, we had all four stools at the bar. It was myself, another company director, a Home Office forensic psychiatrist and a Ferrari salesman. All sensible chaps, keen to get home. We had 3 pints in the 3 hours and made the fatal mistake of taking the front seats when boarding the aircraft.

A stewardess said she could smell drink on us (no flies on her, then) and the next thing was the captain asking us to leave the aircraft as the stewardess considered we were drunk. We tried to reason with him (the stewardess could not be reasoned with and was best ignored) but he wouldn't go against his crew member and the Police arrived very quickly. They gave us the chance of leaving or being arrested.

Our bags were unloaded from the aircraft and arrived back at the carousel quite quickly. We walked over to BA, explained what had happened and asked if they would fly us back. They sent over a manager to talk to us and he agreed that we were certainly not drunk and they would to fly us. An hour and a half later we were taxying out on our BA flight and the EJ flight was still sitting on its stand. One of my friends, who flew a lot, thought the crew may have gone over their time and replacement crew would be required to fly the aircraft.

The morals I learnt are a) don't drink at airports b) always leave a flight if asked to or offered compensation to. The flight has problems and you are better off being at a distance from them.

ETA - I suspect the flight being discussed *had* to leave without the luggage as their was insufficient time/staff to re-load it before it's crew went over their time limit. The compensation for your luggage arriving late is up to €1223 per item checked in, so you should be able to recover all costs incurred from buying replacement clothes and renting equipment.

EJ have handled this badly and their actions are likely to cost them much more than having laid on a second aircraft to take the passengers, with the first one taking the hold luggage and, so, being under its MTOW.

Last point, being that heavy with extra fuel would mean the aircraft would not be able to take off and comply with the noise restrictions around the airfield. These will require the aircraft to throttle back quickly and cruise climb out, dramatically reducing the noise foot print. Geneva has more than enough runway to land heavy (it needs more speed and more runway) so this wasn't the problem, nor are their any charges based on the actual weight of the aircraft. They always pay based on the maximum it is certified to weigh at take off, according to Boeing or Airbus of whoever.

Good luck with the claim.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

Barshaker
ETA - I suspect the flight being discussed *had* to leave without the luggage as their was insufficient time/staff to re-load it before it's crew went over their time limit. The compensation for your luggage arriving late is up to €1223 per item checked in, so you should be able to recover all costs incurred from buying replacement clothes and renting equipment.

How do you recommend starting this process...??? I would happily donate the extra cost i didnt stomach to a fine charity...

Easyjet need a crack on the wrists. Ive heard nothing good about this airline since ive told people. I live in New York now so dont have the pleasure of using them often...

neveragaineasyjet - are you listening to this compensation.....???

A snowHead

Slightly related - once, flying EJ Luton - Faro after pushing back from the stand the Capt'n came on to announce the news that the high number of golfers on board with clubs in the hold meant we would have to land at Porto to refuel as we couldn't get all the way in a oner. I was surprised to hear that the plane couldn't make the shortish trip and thought there must be some cheap fuel on offer at Porto!?

Which reminds me, the one time I have flown to Calgary we were greeted at check in with the news that due to an aircraft change we needed to stop for fuel at Goose Island or somewhere like that. It was a frozen wasteland apart from charter aircraft taking off and landing. Again, reckoned there was some cheap fuel being bought? Maybe there's a less interesting, more logical answser though...

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

My daughter's EJ flight to Geneva on Christmas Eve was delayed when they had one passenger too many. They asked everybody to check boarding passes, counted heads several times, and eventually found one plonker sitting dozily with earphones, who should have been on another flight (he shouldn't have been allowed on, obviously - he wasn't the only one not paying attention). He was chucked off, and the plane took off.

One of my husband's nieces, on the way back from honeymoon in the Caribbean, got on the wrong flight in Jamaica and was horrified to be welcomed to the flight to Washington when she wanted to go to London and had to be back at work next day. She was told firmly to keep quiet and that it was too late to abort the flight, but to her (barrister) husband's acute embarassment she got out of her seat and had hysterics as they taxied to take off and they were eventually put off the flight, to get the right one.

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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Years ago we flew Manchester to Orlando on a 757. This aircraft can't do this without refuelling and was scheduled to land in Bangor, Maine. I know my geography and when the pilot came over the Tannoy to anounce "that due to a strong headwind we do not have sufficent fuel to reach Bangor" - my life-vest was deployed and my hand on the toggle before he announced............ " so we shall be landing in Gander, Newfoundland to take on fuel.

BTW, Gander makes Grenoble Airport look like Terminal 5

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Frosty the Snowman, Gander is an unusual airport, around 1940 it was the largest airport in the world and even today runway 03/21. is believe it or not a designated emergency runway for the space shuttle, it's busiest time was from WW2 to the early 70's when almost all transatlantic aircraft stopped to refuel there including those going from the USSR to Cuba, so whilst it may have primitive facilities for passengers these days it's runways are probably a lot better than those at many other airport including Grenoble

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bar shaker, most of what you say is right, and I was sorry to read about your experience. I would put that down to what I call "Airport Fascism." A lot of people put on a uniform, and believe that gives them the right to start ordering other people about. I know. I was an airline pilot for thirty-eight years, and retired recently after twenty-nine years as a captain. The clue is in my username.

However, some of your deductions (clearly made from good information) are simply wrong. It is perfectly true that Geneva has a long runway, and there would be no performance restrictions on landing at any conceivable weight. But if you care to look at any tabulation of Maximum Take-off and Maximum Landing weights for passenger jets, you will see that the MLW is usually about 20% below the MTOW. These are not performance limited weights, but structural (design) limit weights, and they make fairly pessimistic assumptions. It will be apparent to you, that the difference is such that it amply exceeds the planned fuel consumption between BHX and GVA. Thus the effective restriction on departing BHX would be the MLW plus the trip fuel. This is the normal scenario on all shorter flights. And unless there was some special performance issue at BHX that day, it was certainly the restriction that applied. You can forget the noise issue. Modern airliners can satisfy noise requirements at all legitimate weights. The MLW can be exceeded, but only in an emergency. The unfortunate captain of the subject Easyjet flight was having a bad enough day already. He would not have thrown away his career by departing with the intention of invoking an emergency procedure to land overweight.

For the rest, we are all speculating. Time was clearly a major constraint. The reports on this thread suggest that, in taking on extra fuel, (probably for APU use during an ongoing delay, or to cover the possibility of re-routing to get round a slot restriction) an overfuelling error was made. This does happen. The reports also suggest that offloading ALL the luggage was an honest attempt to mitigate the problem, and get most passengers to their destination on the same day. Unless there is evidence to the contrary, I would accept that the whole situation arose out of an error, and that all attempts to remedy it were made in good faith.

Ski Tyke, conspiracy theories are almost always wrong. But equally they are almost impossible to disprove. Paranoia rules.

Hurjam, neveragaineasyjet, notsoeasyjet, I hope you get satisfactory compensation. But, if EZ hide behind their T&Cs, well, that is the deal, isn't it? When the public buys a ticket for £9.99, they don't say, No, it's not enough. You have to cover your costs in the event you are called upon to compensate us. Take more! The travelling public is in collusion with the low cost operators. They have driven down the cost of air travel, but made it a harder-nosed business. You have to look carefully at the conditions, and insure for yourself, if you think you need extra cover. Please don't think I am unsympathetic; I'm just pointing out the facts. No, I did not work for Easyjet.

After all it is free

Even at 250, it was probably cheap at the price, until things went wrong. Wasn't it?

I hope you recover your expenses. But looking at EZ's conditions, I am not sure you will. Good luck with the claim.

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Easyjet had to get 36 Passengers for Geneva leave aircraft before take-off!

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