 Poster: A snowHead
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| DB wrote: |
| We need to set up a thread called "Strictly Come Skiing" where people put up a video clip and people rate them up to level 13. Of course additional marks would be given for style and wearing sexy frocks (esp if worn by the men). |
Doesn't that give Boris an unfair advantage?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'm all up for wearing a frock (as long as it goes with my new gloves).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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DB It's a pity we can't get sign up to the idea. With the season now well underway I think the results would be hillarious!! 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| OK, this thread has strayed ................ |
Fair point.
If your using skis to move about you must be skiing.
(If there others around be safe and enjoy. As Dexter learnt, 'stick to the code'.)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| musher wrote: |
| DB wrote: |
| We need to set up a thread called "Strictly Come Skiing" where people put up a video clip and people rate them up to level 13. Of course additional marks would be given for style and wearing sexy frocks (esp if worn by the men). |
Doesn't that give Boris an unfair advantage? |
He wouldn't be the only one .....
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I think I must be one of the very few people who is generally pleasantly surprised when I see myself skiing on video.
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Anyone else who finds they look BETTER on video than in their head? I think it's a hangover from my very nervous days (and long hours on a dry slope) but I expect to look like a bag of spanners with limb flailing, but actually find when recorded I look pretty tidy (on piste! Offpiste I'm terrible).
p.s. Insideout folks/megamum - after a quick survey (very scientific study of my colleagues sat within a few desks and my ski group) it seems to be THIS sentence in level6 that makes all the more confident folks peg themselves at a 7 from week 2 onwards "You can always parallel on blues and almost always on reds" - it seems like after week2 most folks rate themselves a 7 as they say 'well I don't snowplough anymore'. If I remove that sentence leaving only
"You are confident on reds unless the conditions are difficult. You can easily get around the mountain but your technique could be better. You may have tried moguls, black runs and the un-pisted terrain at the side of the slope, but you struggled. You may be reliant on turning with your shoulders and lack movement with your legs. Your turns tend to be the same shape and size and don't always match the terrain."
Suddenly a lot of my 7's become 6's...which might be more what you'd expect megamum?
aj xx
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lol - snap eng_ch, crossed in the post 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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a.j., You could have something there, perhaps also coupled with people not understanding what proper parallel skiing is.
Everyone knows what a snowplough is - the pizza shaped drill that many start off with. However, as I understand things, there is an awful lot of making that snowplough narrow and stem turns before people are really fully skiing their turns with both skis properly parallel. i.e. they can say with certainty that they are no longer snowploughing, and by default assume that they are skiing parallel. In view of your observation (which clearly has merit) I would agree, and submit that the loss of a pure snow-plough stance doesn't necessarily mean that someone is skiing parallel. As you say the IOS scale doesn't seem to incorporate that observation, or at least it allows people to think that the default loss of the snowplough means that they are, indeed, skiing parallel by default when they might not be.
In my case I thought I had been skiing parallel for long time and I couldn't even feel the small stem that I still had. Without a video shot of me I would never have believed that I was doing it. You are right that the IOS scale appears to go straight from no longer doing a snowplough (which most people will equate with a full pizza wedge type snowplough) straight to parallel skiing. I would agree with a suggestion that progression in skiing doesn't actually hop straight from one straight to the other - as least not in my personal experience - I can't speak for others. However, I guess such a scale will always have to set boundaries and descriptions somewhere and it has to be said IOS have largely made a pretty damn good job of it.
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Wouldn't get too concerned over semantics or exact words chosen for a level.
95% of the people that say or think they ski parallel almost certainly ski stems, even in several levels above whichever level says parallel, on a bog standard easy red run.
edit: and if I choose exact words, then I could choose level 5,6,7 or 8.
or in other words... more than beginner, but not expert enough to be an instructor, race, etc. or be a natural that grew up on skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Stems, is that what it's called. Then, yes, I think I do this. I kind of think I'm parallel, but I often note a slight wedge.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
I think I must be one of the very few people who is generally pleasantly surprised when I see myself skiing on video.
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The first few times I saw myself on video I was definitely pleasantly surprised (looked worse in my head). As I've begun to see myself on video more often I'm now attuned to these little manerisms which rather irritate me 
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Megamum, Don't beat yourself up about what other people are or aren't doing. Imagine being a time served Jamaican sprinter the first time a teenage Usain Bolt lolloped onto your track.
I'd also say that it doesn't really matter what someone "claims". You can pick flaws in almost anyone's skiing (bar the 13s) - some are a matter of style, personally I dislike the look of a leisure skier who permanently skis in a single cadence of "instructor turns" - always looks unnatural. The real measure provided not acting as a hazard to self or others is whether they are having fun, everything else including progression is cherry on the cake.
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You know it makes sense.
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megamum, you may have a point re we skip straight from obvious plough parallel skiing to mainly parallel. But most people who haven't had video feedback from a knowledgable person don't understand that their "parallel" is generally not very parallel. Keep the skis parallel is a good indicator of how efficient we ski but hard to tell for oneself just how parallel is parallel.
I spent an hour yesterday being followed and getting feedback doing ultra slow parallel turns at a consistent speed. Quite hard to do well and accurately and each person had to make subtle improvements to manage to do it well.
As an example of how parallel is parallel I would expect a Level 2 instructor to always have the skis parallel on blue and easy red terrain. Most L1's cant do that...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
Quote:
I think I must be one of the very few people who is generally pleasantly surprised when I see myself skiing on video.
The first few times I saw myself on video I was definitely pleasantly surprised (looked worse in my head). As I've begun to see myself on video more often I'm now attuned to these little manerisms which rather irritate me
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I'm guilty of that as well probably because I'm hyper-critical ....but I think that skiing can be compared to swans/ducks swimming across a loke, you don't always see the frantic paddling which goes on underneath...
I remember once having had to balance myself out (in what felt like quite an extreme fashion) to keep from falling over when being filmed, only to find that what had felt like a Charlie Chaplin like last second rescue effort to me was hardly noticeable on the recording.
Of course. there are always points of style and technique which are captured which can be improved upon but realistically not to the extent I sometimes feel it is.
(Video footage is also sometimes helpful in deciding which ski outfit to donate to the nearest charity shop...)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'm generally disappointed when I see myself ski. I tend to quite critical and analytical (which is the point of watching I suppose).
OTOH, I'm usually pleased when I look/listen at videos of me playing the guitar. I look calm and controlled (when underneath I'm panicking).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Megamum wrote: |
| I have been amused and interested by the breadth and range of comments on the self rank your skiing thread in The Piste. I could also be easily demoralised by the apparent progression of some people vs. my own hard won fight to look half competent down a red (about 15 weeks on snow and a decent smattering of lessons and still not there). I find my self thinking OK, you can get down it, but is it skiing? Both in relation to my own ability and in relation to the descriptions given by some others. It's just an idle thought process and I dare say there are some naturally gifted people that can ski in two weeks, but in reality how many weeks on verage should it take for the average sofa based one holiday a year punter to get to mid levels (intermediate) on that IOS scale? |
Always a fascinating question...
I remember Bergy saying, "We all suck. Some of us just suck at a higher level."
Then there was Weems, "Is doing what you're doing more fun than skiing?"
I also remember a conversation with Shanzy at Aspen Highlands as we saw a "new" skier skiing by. On his second day on skis, he had skied Highlands Bowl in 18" of powder. Highlands Bowl is serious expert terrain that is accessed by a climb above 12,000'. Of course, the skier was Steve Yzerman, one of the greatest hockey players of all time, and a truly elite athlete.
So, judging by the amount of time on snow is difficult. That said, I find that at least a dozen days a season makes it much easier to truly progress without regression from the previous year. I feel for those who are only able to get a week or so a year. It's very difficult, indeed, to move forward at that rate, and requires solid guidance from a good coach who understands the challenges of long gaps and limited opportunity.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| Quote: |
As an example of how parallel is parallel I would expect a Level 2 instructor to always have the skis parallel on blue and easy red terrain. Most L1's cant do that.
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skimottaret, I find that a very surprising comment, as I would have expected any instructor to be capable of parallel turns on such terrain - it is obviously a more difficult skill than I thought. Consequently, as I think I can now do some nice parallel and steered turns inside, I will aspire to achieve these on the blues and maybe reds on Holiday in a few weeks time. It will give me something to focus on as I know now what I have got to do the achieve them and I will get a sense of achievement if I get close as it can't be easy to do from your statement.  I should be able to 'see' how I am doing from day to day as we are going armed with cameras this year.  |
With your grasp of the challenge of controlling femur rotation in steered turns, I expect you to be able to do this on virtually all terrain. It's just a matter of the DIRT you apply to those skills (DIRT: Duration, Intensity, Rate, Timing). Think through the various terrain and conditions that would change the DIRT for some preparation. For example, deeper snow requires patience (slower rate, longer duration) while groomed and/or hard snow offers more degrees of freedom.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Disclaimer; I haven't read the whole thread, so subsequent convo has been mostly lost on me. Anyway...
Megamum, I understand your frustration. There are, without doubt, people who are naturally gifted - however, I would say that 90% of that 'natural gift' is confidence, and the other 10% is a higher level of fitness due to being young/excitable/both. I personally found skiing easy to learn, and for that I am incredibly thankful to whatever random fluctuations in the space-time continuum made me that way.
That said, I wouldn't ever go so far as to try and guess what kind of skier I am, or how I compare to others. Words are simple, I prefer actions. In other words, people should let their skiing do the talking, unless they have been qualified in the matter through instructor quals.
The key thing is to remind yourself that whatever people might say, they don't matter. Nothing matters except you, the mountain, and pushing yourself to your limits - your limits, not someone else's. if you are trying as hard as you can to improve, then you are skiing as well as you can, and you will only get better. Work hard, don't give up. My personal motto is this - Persistence is the key to success. Keep that in mind 
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rasmanisar, I can manage hard work and persistence, sounds like I might yet improve
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| .....if they elect to not maintain the odd lessons here and there as they continue to ski. I don't ever recall such a conversation with an instructor....... |
Our first instructor was a guy called Mark. Everyone in resort called him Uncle Krusty. He told us on about day 3 that when we arrived in conditions that we weren't comfortable with we had two choices. Spend 100 years working out what other people had already learned or get a lesson with an instructor. He hammered it home by telling us that if we ever got good enough, we would no longer need an instructor. Instead we would need a coach.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Megamum wrote: |
ssh,  OK, I promise to spend some time playing too. 
In fact I want to find some more little ridges in the snow to jump off, I had worked up enough confidence to try just a tiny hop off of a bit of snow the last time I was inside. I've left the ground on an adhoc basis and not by design in the past and it wasn't a good feeling. However, this latest shot of confidence had me find a ridge of snow and purposefully go over it with the actual intention of leaving the ground - not just once, but several times. Now I may only have been 6" off the ground, but it was by design and I was able to land and ski on. I thought this was an interesting lark, because at least if I get used to doing it I might be better able to cope if it happens when I'm out and about. So I need some more fun practice at this skill too! |
Excellent! Feels like being a kid, doesn't it? Not thinking about what could happen if you fell over (who cares, eh?), but just seeking the great sensations...
I was dropping through powder in the trees in a glade called Black Bear at Copper last weekend just looking for the sensations of my skis dropping through powder. What an amazing feeling!
| Thornyhill wrote: |
| Megamum wrote: |
| .....if they elect to not maintain the odd lessons here and there as they continue to ski. I don't ever recall such a conversation with an instructor....... |
Our first instructor was a guy called Mark. Everyone in resort called him Uncle Krusty. He told us on about day 3 that when we arrived in conditions that we weren't comfortable with we had two choices. Spend 100 years working out what other people had already learned or get a lesson with an instructor. He hammered it home by telling us that if we ever got good enough, we would no longer need an instructor. Instead we would need a coach. |
I like it!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I am a relative newbi For me I think it's about enjoyment first and foremost. The more you enjoy something the more you will excel. Secondly if you was to come down the same run you would find it easer each time. This is how I have found it so far Sitting today on the side of a run I have found there are all sorts of skiers out there and I would find it impossible to bench my progression on them. Go have fun ski and ski more 😄
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
If it's steep enough, anyone can...
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Exactly. And if it isnt why would you need to? Just jump turn, you're not going anywhere if you get it wrong!
But abc, you're original statement was cut up snow NOT foot depth wet cement. It's not that hard to drift skis sideways through cut up snow unless its become very consolidated / refrozen but that's not what you said.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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abc, i challenge you to a sideslip-off 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
The more you enjoy something the more you will excel
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I don't think that necessarily follows at all. I love swimming in nice warm tropical seas (having lived nearly 4 years in the Caribbean and 3 in the South Pacific I really CBA with crowded beaches in Spain). But I most definitely don't excel at swimming. I don't swim any better now than I did 40 years ago. We went skiing with friends, once, who had skied a fair bit more than us and they intimidated us by turning up with gurt long skis (though we found out later that he'd bought them in a car boot sale because he was too mean to buy decent ones ) and, quite frankly, they weren't good skiers. She had a nice neat style but was very slow, and he was just all over the place. She would have liked to take lessons but he wouldn't hear of it so she stayed with him. They loved skiing and went every year, but they most definitely didn't excel.
On the other hand, I do think it's hard to put in the time and effort needed to ski well unless you do love it. Why would you bother?
By the way, I just "got down" a mogully unpisted black slope. It wasn't pretty, and it made my legs ache (doing it wrong) but I did feel it called on my skiing skills a lot more than some of the other, easier, pisted slopes I skied this morning. There was nobody else on it and as I went back up the chair the only two people on it were doing worse than I did, so I didn't feel too bad about it.
It didn't occur to me to try to side-slip it - maybe next time I'll give it a go.
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pam w, could you side slip moguls? Presumably you could sideslip down the back of a single one and I guess some sort of controlled forward/backward motion around them might be possible, but surely it would need to be VERY controlled?
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sideslip one way then turn and sideslip the other way on moguls
saw some people go way past the point of needing to side slip at the weekend. was a complete skis and boards off and walk down the edge of the black run. tbf it was Harakiri run, and a bit icy. probably all egged in to it by mates, and none of them could manage.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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you know you are seriously out of your depth with skiiing if you feel safer on smooth ski boot soles!
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I have had it drummed into me that the one thing to never do is take off your skis and walk down. That said there was 50 yards or so in Orelle Mauriennaise on my first EoSB that certain folks may recall However, what I have been told was right, walking down just off piste was far more difficult than skiing it had been and I finished up back on them as the easier option. The final beer was never more welcome!
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FAQ
