The more I watch these vids the more it looks like an old film of a mono-ski in powder. Weight back to keep the nose from submarining and lead with the hip to begin the turn. Got to give Tom a real hurrah for his efforts and perseverance and in the right (wrong) conditions they are probably a lot of fun. The price would have to be incredibly keen (read cheap) for me to add them to my quiver. As an aftermarket $100 retrofit to a set of 'rock-hoppers I could be tempted but that would be the most I would be prepared to spend for something so niche. People who spend their winters where the snow is usually just white concrete with a dust of sugar over it may get more use out of them but I can't see them improving their general skiing.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Masque wrote:
The more I watch these vids the more it looks like an old film of a mono-ski in powder. ... but I can't see them improving their general skiing.
....but it is a hard surface in our video, no powder around! The old mono would have no grip and no chance on chunks like these...
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
rungsp wrote:
[...
He has developed a niche product, it seems to work very well indeed in what might be called niche terrain and niche conditions.
...
A famous ski historian (born in UK) said one day that if RaxSkis were available to at least some of ski-enthusiasts in 1930`s and 1950`s
as an alternative to regular long skis, then today`s regular skis (shaped carver and twin tips) would be just niche products for special purposes.
Well, our grand parents would hapilly vote for an easy turning short ski with the best tracking feature, especially in the era of not groomed pistes.
....but it is a hard surface in our video, no powder around! The old mono would have no grip and no chance on chunks like these...
That's not the point I was making, just that the way to ride your things is like a monoski in powder, weight back. tips up, tail sinking and braking and driving from the hip to turn.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Masque wrote:
... that the way to ride your things is like a monoski in powder, weight back. tips up, tail sinking and braking ...
Yeah Masque, this technique is not confined to a monoski. If you are riding a steep and unknown couloir near the fall line (=no jump turns)
you simply have to lift your ski tips. It`s your life insurance, whatever ski you are using. The tails of your skis are then pressing the powder and so braking, but this side effect is rather positive, for you cannot afford very high speed.
The other alternative were jump turns and the danger of avalanche, caused by heavy jumping.
Too much scrollin on iPad, combined with no Vids that work = Can't be arsed.com
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Tom from Austria, Look, you keep talking about extreme steeps and couloirs just how are you supposed to get to them? There's certainly not enough surface area to skin up to these
and if you run into powder . . . which you most likely will off-piste . . . then all you will do is plough a short deep furrow. I'm trying to find a reason to have these that is more than just for novelty
amusement. People here know that I will slide around on all sorts of weird contraptions . . . and own a few of them.
Come along to the eosb and I'll be happy to have a slide and have my mind changed if they are more than what they seem now.
After all it is free
After all it is free
Masque wrote:
...There's certainly not enough surface area to skin up ...
and if you run into powder . . . then all you will do is plough a short deep furrow. ....
Yeah, we got an extremely fat RaxSki model to make you happy in pow, Masque
Are 14cm underfoot enough for you?
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Hahaha he's like a magician just pulling Raxskis out of his hat any chance of any that can take touring bindings?.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Tom from Austria, That was slow and painful to watch (the new-age mall muzak made it worse). We have moved into an age when we have many
skis that can function well in a very mixed snow environment. Yes we have short narrow SL bias skis and then we have the huge backcountry boats that are just
snowboards with a stiffy. The middle ground is swamped with great skis that will perform well in a huge envelope of snow conditions.
And you want us to buy 2 sets of your skis . . . that's not going to happen.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Those two videos make it look like relatively hard work to make pretty slow progress.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
AJQ wrote:
Too much scrollin on iPad, combined with no Vids that work = Can't be arsed.com
Apparently watching some big Rax model, AJQ! Take the tiny Joker with 62cm overall length instead,
it will surely fit in your iPad. Or in your purse. Even better, switch to some Android tablet.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
meandrew wrote:
Hahaha he's like a magician just pulling Raxskis out of his hat any chance of any that can take touring bindings?.
Touring bindings can be mounted on all Rax models, for some brands we have to fill the profiled aluminioum tail before we deliver the skis.
Skinners are a important group among Rax riders.
We have just tried to evaluate who are our customers and testers.
Here the results:
Skiers on piste
this ski lets you turn fast without skidding and love soft moguls and icy spots. You will ski them safely. Some of you will even leave the groomed piste and taste the virgin snow the first time. Old dreams can come true with RaxSki.
Freeriders off-piste
we have invented this ski for ourselves and we belong to you! No "jump turns" around each tree more needed. Just keep your balance and surf or carve effortless down the slope. This means higher performance by new technology.
Beginners at any age
you will find that this light ski will understand you. Just twist your knees and the ski starts turning. No angulating, weight transfer, nothing! Well, your knees and boots control the direction the same way as the steering wheel in your car.
But this ski also got the brake. Just lean back and rear fins start cutting the snow and braking. To your suprise you will not fall back but stop and keep upright.
Children and youngsters
for they are still free from established skiing conventions. They quickly discover the potential of the new ski and learn the unknown technique in no time. RaxSki gives them the opportunity to grow and to ski circles around shocked parents.
Snowboarders, especially the best ones
you would never step in a ski binding but the RaxSki is like the early-days snowboard: a revolt against the skiing establishment. Like a "rocker board" the RaxSki lets you rock on its bent base for easy turning.
Ski touring and backcountry lovers
We pity you, ski hikers suffering in deep and steep snow when you have to descend on your clumsy long skis. Change your material and habits and enjoy the slush!
Ski patrol and rescue service
RaxSki is the WORKHORSE among all skis. Wearing RaxSkis in extreme terrain lets you concentrate on rescue action. They will obey you and come through trees and bushes. They can even carve in grass. Light climbing boots for crampons can be used with RaxSki.
Snowblade, "firngleiter" and other short ski riders
you need no explanation about how to ride RaxSki! It will just track better and let you lean back without a fall.
Telemarkers and mono-skiers
I feel guilty that you are still waiting for our first TeleRax and MonoRax. Rocking on a monoski with huge rear fins could become the ultimate fun in powder.
Car drivers
RaxSkis fit in your luggage trunk. Model "Joker" is as short as a seat.
Wives and girl-friends of ski experts
RaxSki allows you to follow the track of your big teacher in the woods and watch him jumping on his conventional skis
while you are easy carving on Rax fins and wings.
Experts themselves
but that's not an easy mission! Because each of you has skied for tens of years and developed the best material ever. There is not much to be improved! Only the best of you will not feel ashamed to appear with an unknown "armored" ski that is shorter than 180cm.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
All these target groups in all the world and i have never seen a single pair! How many pairs of these have you sold out of interest to ski patrol or ski guides?.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
A pair exists. Saw them in Obertauern.
Quote:
A famous ski historian (born in UK) said one day that if RaxSkis were available to at least some of ski-enthusiasts in 1930`s and 1950`s
as an alternative to regular long skis, then today`s regular skis (shaped carver and twin tips) would be just niche products for special purposes.
Given a hundred years of ski development and evolution, big skis, short skis, fat skis, skinny skis, snowblades, big foots, those figln things, I think there's a reason we ended up with skis in the 150-180ish cm long skis. Because that is the optimum ski for general skiing all across the mountain. If a snowblade with wings was the optimum ski for all round, all mountain use, it would have evolved and become dominant in the 30's or 50's or the peak of skiing in the 70's/80's (or at least as dominant or popular as snowboarding).
Rax is just a niche just like pretty much everything beyond piste, al mountain and race skis.
Having skied a niche, I'll save such niche for the odd afternoon here and there, and stick to all-round skis for all-round skiing.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I certainly ski a 'niche' product But I still can't find it in my heart to want to buy these, I can't see the fun factor of learning a new skill.
Making something easy is not 'always' a selling point . . . though I can see a real + if I were guiding a blood sled down to the first aid station
I might be happy for the speed control and quick turn
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Just to stir the pot a little Is TFA a victim of convention? Is his product suffering from a similar reaction to mine when I saw Windows 8, i.e. we all like what is familiar. I was interested in those short older skis reported on the other page. Now if they had been developed and everyone already rode on Rax skis we would surely view a conventional carving ski with distrust wouldn't we?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Megamum, they are short skis with "lean back to brake" bits of metal on the back. I see no advantage over what I ski currently, and many disadvantages. It's not a case of unfamiliarity, but a case of "what have you done to my beautiful sport".
Megamum, they are short skis with "lean back to brake" bits of metal on the back. I see no advantage over what I ski currently, and many disadvantages. It's not a case of unfamiliarity, but a case of "what have you done to my beautiful sport".
It's a different sport, it's not comparing like for like. The only similarity is that it involves snow and going downhill, but so do snow-blades, snoboards, monoskis and sledges.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
rob@rar, I can see specific occasions when these could be useful, but as you say, they add nothing to recreational skiing other than the occasional novelty day out.
Add to that, with such a restricted and claimed easy technique I can see them contributing to some bad x-over habits to regular skis that could be very dangerous to
an early intermediate . . . there's nothing quite like getting onto your heels on a slope steeper than you are used to
Don't get me wrong, you won't catch me on a set, but I admire Tom's persistence with his product. Maybe the problem is that he calls it skiing, perhaps if he marketed it as a different sport - Raxxing - it would find greater acceptance.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
feef, Megamum, if he called it Raxing I wouldn't have a problem, but in his last post in this thread he claimss every skiing virtue under the sun. Some might admire his persistence, but I think he is wildly over-selling what Masque rightly describes as a novelty day out.
After all it is free
After all it is free
From Jan 2008 .....
DB wrote:
Introduction
========
So anyway, on a wet Saturday morning I met Tom at a motorway service station south of Vienna. We put my stuff into his car and drove south in the rain. I'd guess Tom is about the same young age as David Goldsmith perhaps younger (only Tom is still skiing). Tom had around 8 pairs of Rax edition skis in his boot (give or take ca 10 pairs). The rain certainly didn't dampen his enthusiasm to demonstrate his creations and around 45 mins later we were taking our first gondola ride of the day at Semmering. Semmering is a small family resort with a family run, a few steepish reds and a slightly steeper black. http://www.bergfex.com/semmering-hirschenkogel/
Conditions
=======
The conditions were great ............... for Scotland . A temp of around 4 Deg C with wind, driving rain and intermittent fog. The light was pretty flat too and sadly we never got round to doing a video (maybe next time). There had been a good base that had been snowed on and then rainned on, it was suffering in places though (brown patches). Most runs were mashed potatoes on a bumpy hard base below. It was hard to tell what was just a mound of slush or a hidden ice mogul. Skiers of all levels were suffering, there was hardly a run skied where someone wasn't picking their skis out of the snow - including me but more about that later.
Tom on Rax skis me on conventional skis
============================
I took a couple of runs on my own skis first just to see how Tom rode the Rax skis and examine the terrain before 'strapping on the Rax'. I'd opted to take my wider all mountain skis (90mm underfoot) as they were the only ones that fit my alpine boots (tend to use downhill oriented touring boots all the time these days but Tom didn't have a Rax ski with touring binding). Tom skied pretty much the same as in the video only faster. His Rax skis were near horizontal with the tips out of the snow, when the slope was ca 30 deg his skis were often around 10 deg. It looked unconventional but on the red/black pistes he shot down the fall-line and I needed to pick up quite a bit of speed while committing to the fall-line to get past him. Something I only managed once when there was just the two of us on a steeper piste. On the flater pistes however I was able to put in larger carves whereas the drag on Tom's skis left him behind.
The moment of truth
==============
We go back to the car and Tom hands me the blue ski above. Like his other skis it's an older straight ski that Tom had picked up second hand and modified himself. It was clear this was a one man project, it was his enthusiasm for skiing and not a big company development budget that was driving this. Remember thinking what the hell am I doing? I'd never skied a straight ski before let alone a saw off pair with fins. The butterflys in my stomach weren't helped by Tom confirming in the gondola on the way up that I would be the third person ever to ski the Rax ski. So I click in the old bindings and push off.
The first thing I noticed is that on the flats the fins drag a little. As we descend down a red run my feet start to wiggle from side to side independently. Instead of edging and angulating it was possible just make a turn by twisting flat feet. It was strange and took a bit of time before I could keep my feet parralell but it was easier to stay upright than when I first learnt to ski. Tom was zipping around shouting tips and encouragement. After a short run I managed to stop the skis flapping around so much and started to get a bit of confidence and a lot more control. Now these things don't have a reverse gear, don't try to travel backwards unless you are able to do at least 3 backward summersaults. I only managed a half. Where I would normally curve round on my normal skis and then do a quick little reserve turn at the side of the piste I'd managed to confuse everyone around me by just throwing myself on the floor backwards. Tom was soon there, a few more tips and we were off again.
Later Tom explained it was on the steeps where the Rax skis really came into their own so it was off to the black slope although it was more brown and bumpy in places. Tom explained that straight down the fall line & short turns were what was needed. On normal skis it's something that only a much better bump skier than I would manage but on the Rax ski it was possible. The drag slowed things down a bit and I was having fun until my ski caught something underneath and I was out of the binding - (this may of been because the binding wasn't set up correctly for me). Later I was descending the steeper slopes faster than most of the skiers around but still not at the same pace as Tom. To begin with I was tense and I was begining to feel the strain on my legs so it was time to change back to normal skis before I broke something.
Back to normal skis
==============
In comparison to the rax skis my skis suddenly felt super slippy. I spent the next two runs doing a full on Bode Miller in the back seat. Eventually I found the middle of the ski again but it was unnerving until I did. In comparison the conventional skis acquired a higher speed but the need to turn around bumps etc meant the Rax skis were quicker down to the bottom of a steep hill in mushy bumpy snow. Tom tried a longer 160cm rax si and after a few more runs we decided to call it a day.
Pro's
====
Something different
Excel on steeper slopes where the snow is less than perfect
Quick turning
Con's
====
Doesn't glide like a normal ski/flat piste performance
Can't slide backwards (may be restrictive in certain circumstances)
Skis are short = less surface area = less float (although I didn't test in powder)
Very steep pistes (50 deg+ slope) might be a problem
Conclusion
========
Probably not a total replacement for the conventional ski (at least not for me) but another tool to take out when the conditions warrant it.
Maybe later skis with greater surface area will provide a better all-mountain solution.
Good to see Tom pushing the development of the ski further.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
DB wrote:
From Jan 2008 .....
I am really very glad to hear that you are well of and still active, DB!
In Jan 2008 you were the second skier worldwide to test RaxSkis. The 1st one was my son, just few weeks before.
The RaxSkis you tested were very first prototypes, made of old skis, sawed off behind the binding and equipped with hand-made aluminium fins.
Since then RaxSkis made a long way.
Are you still in Vienna, DB? I would deeply appreciate you could test today`s models. You are the only one in the whole world who can objectively compare our 2008 prototypes with 2014 models!!!! All other partners of ours started later with RaxSki and went on testing all successive improvements up to date. Please do not say no! Your Tom
PS Remarkably we made no photo on that January day so I cannot remember you face
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
rob@rar wrote:
... I see no advantage over what I ski currently, and many disadvantages. ... "what have you done to my beautiful sport".
Let us express the substance of this invention in just one sentence, rob@rar!
The advantage of the new ski control is that normal skiers like you and me can suddenly ski moguls, steep couloirs, FIS slaloms, slush terrain and black lines they would never dare with regular skis.
You are free to consider this innovation harmful, destroying old ways....
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Tom from Austria wrote:
normal skiers like you and me can suddenly ski moguls, steep couloirs, FIS slaloms, slush terrain and black lines they would never dare with regular skis.
Given that Rob is a ski instructor, I wouldn't exactly refer to him as a 'normal' skier... One would hope that he can ski considerably harder lines than the wide majority of skiers.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Tom from Austria, I like to ski well rather than employ poor technique. I believe the Rax skis are inherently limiting - leaning back, skiing in essentially a straight line, simply controlling my speed by using the braking effect of the metal fins is not my idea of fun. I'll continue to use my meager skiing skills with a range of mainstream skis as best I can
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
rasmanisar wrote:
Tom from Austria wrote:
normal skiers like you and me can suddenly ski moguls, steep couloirs, FIS slaloms, slush terrain and black lines they would never dare with regular skis.
Given that Rob is a ski instructor, I wouldn't exactly refer to him as a 'normal' skier... One would hope that he can ski considerably harder lines than the wide majority of skiers.
Sorry for being misunderstood, Rob! Under "normal skiers like you and me" I meant non-professionals, in contrast to paid athletes bringing top performance. Of course I honour Rob with his 29,000+ posts ,
signed
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
rob@rar wrote:
... I believe the Rax skis are inherently limiting - leaning back, skiing in essentially a straight line, simply controlling my speed by using the braking effect of the metal fins ...
Dear Rob
"leaning back" is not necessary on Rax ski. Our advice to all first time Rax riders: use Rax as if you wee on your regular ski.
Lift the ski tips ONLY in case of bad piste conditions, steep slopes or when you like to turn faster than all other skiers/boarders around.
"skiing in essentially a straight line" is just one option on RaxSkis. Our advice to all Rax riders: turn, turn and again turn,
as you as Rax rider are the best "carver" on the slope - Rax means easy turning. Fall line is adrenaline, Rax brings you there...
"controlling my speed by using the braking effect of the metal fins" - of course NOT, the speed is to be controlled by proper navigating(turning)
on the slope. Intentional braking with rear fins should be the exception.
"leaning back" in sense of changing skiers position from forward to backward was strictly forbidden on shaped carving skis in the last 20 years.
Ski tips have to press on the surface!! This rule has changed with the appearance of ROCKER skis
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Wonderful what 30deg of image rotation will achieve - Tom - you should've photoshopped your leashes too
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
forget the leases it's the rest of the outfit that should have had some touching up.. Salmon trousers, nice jumper and yellow helmet and not a blue zip to be found anywhere.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I'm still trying to work out if the person pictured has a really lumpy jumper or an incredibly saggy pair of breasts.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
These look great for stability and speed control for maybe the nervous, the elderly - people who don't want to have to learn a lot of technique etc. maybe not for the die hards and purists but there's a market niche I'm sure.
The idea of being able to get off bumpy snow fast at the end of the day in april sounds bliss.
I wonder if I can try these out in Mayrhofen next week.... Special boots needed?
Maybe the answer for my daughter who cannot find any comfortable ski boots due to the shape or sensitivity of her lower calf!
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Jac Sprat wrote:
people who don't want to have to learn a lot of technique etc.
Sounds like a cop out to me. And these do require technique, just one that is different to conventional skiing, which, let us remember, has adapted over decades to suit. One of my pet hates is people who want to try a sport but apparently can't be bothered to put the effort in to learn how to do it properly, i.e. "I just want to 'have a go'...", or my personal favourite, "I don't care about technique, I'm just having fun". No, what you are doing is carrying out bad practice and potentially endangering your life and the safety of others. Either make a proper commitment or don't bother.
Might I just point out at this stage that I am in no way implying that you are implicated in the above comments, simply that such comments annoy me intensely
Thank you for the last disclaimer - no offence taken as you don't know me.
My partner has Parkinson's and his sking is going to decline from now on... Who knows these could give him new confidence.
I like to have an open mind and try different things.
Tom Are these for hire anywhere in Mayrhofen and do they require special tuition?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Tom from Austria, ok - you have been caught out by geoffers,
That's your credibility you hear sliding into the distance...
After all it is free
After all it is free
geoffers wrote:
Wonderful what 30deg of image rotation will achieve - Tom - you should've photoshopped your leashes too
Geoffers, you are a hidden jewel! May I introduce you to Teton GRAVITY Research as an emerging expert in the gravitation theory?
Yeah, a free hanging lash of the binding shows the direction of gravity.
The only problem is that none of the two lashes is hanging free!
But do not feel discouraged, Geoffers and keep on your gravity research.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Have you posted on TGR yet?
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Tom from Austria wrote:
geoffers wrote:
Wonderful what 30deg of image rotation will achieve - Tom - you should've photoshopped your leashes too
Geoffers, you are a hidden jewel! May I introduce you to Teton GRAVITY Research as an emerging expert in the gravitation theory?
Yeah, a free hanging lash of the binding shows the direction of gravity.
The only problem is that none of the two lashes is hanging free!
But do not feel discouraged, Geoffers and keep on your gravity research.
Tom,
are you saying that the image hasn't been rotated for effect?
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
(the new-age mall muzak made it worse). We have moved into an age when we have many
But I still can't find it in my heart to want to buy these, I can't see the fun factor of learning a new skill.
. A temp of around 4 Deg C with wind, driving rain and intermittent fog. The light was pretty flat too and sadly we never got round to doing a video (maybe next time). There had been a good base that had been snowed on and then rainned on, it was suffering in places though (brown patches). Most runs were mashed potatoes on a bumpy hard base below. It was hard to tell what was just a mound of slush or a hidden ice mogul. Skiers of all levels were suffering, there was hardly a run skied where someone wasn't picking their skis out of the snow - including me but more about that later.
Where I would normally curve round on my normal skis and then do a quick little reserve turn at the side of the piste I'd managed to confuse everyone around me by just throwing myself on the floor backwards. Tom was soon there, a few more tips and we were off again.
,
