 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think pedanticism and pedantism are found in some dictionaries.
It is a bit of a pedantocracy around here isn't it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| James the Last wrote: |
| Steve Angus wrote: |
| There is also this culture of 'just off the piste is safe' - that is not necessarily true. |
Greatly encouraged by ski instructors who will generally take their charges just off the piste during lessons.
e.g. http://www.insideoutskiing.com/level.html click on level 8.
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| I am beginning to get to grips with skiing fresh snow just off-piste. |
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There's a difference between 'just off the piste' and 'safe jsut off the piste.' But I suspect you know that and are just trolling for an argument. Again.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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clarky999, James the Last is the reincarnation of rayscoops and I claim my £5.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| fatbob wrote: |
| clarky999, James the Last is the reincarnation of rayscoops and I claim my £5. |
Aah that makes a lot of sense!
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pam w,
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I never pick up on anybody's spelling or grammatical errors
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Actually, despite my name, neither do I (arsey poster or not).
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| meh wrote: |
| James the Last, bit unfair as they're not encouraging people to ski just off-piste but using that as a criteria for a persons self-assessment as to the level they are at. |
Exactly. We don't run specific off-piste courses, but if there's fresh snow we will ski powder on piste and just off the piste if everyone in the group wants to and is capable of doing that. If that is the case we ski on low angle slopes, avoiding obvious terrain traps, gentle tree-skiing, etc, and will talk about some of the obvious things that you should be thinking about when skiing away from the piste.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| But I suspect you know that and are just trolling for an argument. Again. |
A good point, which is well observed 
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| James the Last wrote: |
| Steve Angus wrote: |
| There is also this culture of 'just off the piste is safe' - that is not necessarily true. |
Greatly encouraged by ski instructors who will generally take their charges just off the piste during lessons.
e.g. http://www.insideoutskiing.com/level.html click on level 8.
| Quote: |
| I am beginning to get to grips with skiing fresh snow just off-piste. |
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There's a difference between 'just off the piste' and 'safe jsut off the piste.' But I suspect you know that and are just trolling for an argument. Again. |
Even if I hadn't known it Steve Angus makes the point with the use of "necessarily". I was pointing no fingers, and certainly not at insideout who only use similar wording to the rest of the skiing world (albeit rather better written). But Steve Angus, a ski instructor, is referring to the culture and (presumably) wondering where it comes from and if you ask me, that's a good place to start looking. There was no criticism in my statement. But I suspect you know that and are just trolling for an argument. Again.
| rob@rar wrote: |
| If that is the case we ski on low angle slopes, avoiding obvious terrain traps, gentle tree-skiing, etc, and will talk about some of the obvious things that you should be thinking about when skiing away from the piste. |
Whilst it's obvious that instructors use "safe" terrain and I have no doubt whatsoever that you do talk about such things, no ski instructor who has ever taken me off the piste has ever mentioned anything like that, and I suspect that goes for the majority of ski instructors, particularly when there is a language barrier that means communication goes little beyond keep always ze upper body in ze forward position. Would you have been less sensitive if I'd written:
"Greatly encouraged by ski instructors who will generally take their charges just off the piste during lessons and all too often will make no comment to their pupils about their choice of off-piste terrain, thus suggesting that just-off-the-piste terrain is perfectly safe."
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Wed 7-03-12 13:17; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| James the Last wrote: |
Would you have been less sensitive if I'd written:
"Greatly encouraged by ski instructors who will generally take their charges just off the piste during lessons and all too often will make no comment to their pupils about their choice of off-piste terrain, thus suggesting that just-off-the-piste terrain is perfectly safe." |
Sure.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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In which case I apologise unreservedly for upsetting you with sloppy wording.
I rather hoped we would all agree rather than disagree.
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pam w, Here we go.....I've seen loads more people piste skiing top to bottom wearing said backpacks...and my original post was were they wearing them to look cool or were they worried about the piste???
Man I've rattled some f**king uppity cages today....
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
Man I've rattled some f**king uppity cages today....
_________________
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you only rattled mine by suggesting that you could tell whether people had skied off-piste, or were later intending to ski off-piste, by watching them ski on-piste. It just came across as so disdainful.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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how about buy the equipment, books, lessons etc, then do, as opposed to do, then wish you hadn't.
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Poster: A snowHead
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dazman, The more logical explanation is that they were intending to ski off-piste at some point during the day unless they were disciples of the Church of GSA. Skiing a piste top to bottom means nothing in this context - maybe they were warming up, skiing with others who they would later part from to go off piste, commuting to another part of the mountain etc etc.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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fatbob, surely you could tell that by whether they were wearing climbing harnesses, and the number of gopros they were sporting.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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bobmcstuff, onlytrue believers carry the burden of triple POV with dignity and forbearance.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
| Seen yesterday, gentleman on double rockers (phat), all the avvid gear etc - couldn't do a parallel turn! |
Quote from easiski yesterday on Facebook, there are some about!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
couldn't do a parallel turn!
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OMG how dare he judge a skier's ability without skiing with them for the whole day!!!
It's just so disdainful.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
Even if I hadn't known it Steve Angus makes the point with the use of "necessarily". I was pointing no fingers, and certainly not at insideout who only use similar wording to the rest of the skiing world (albeit rather better written). But Steve Angus, a ski instructor, is referring to the culture and (presumably) wondering where it comes from and if you ask me, that's a good place to start looking. There was no criticism in my statement. But I suspect you know that and are just trolling for an argument. Again.
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You literally said that the idea that 'just off the piste is safe' is encouraged by instructors. There is only one possible way to read that. If you didn't mean that, don't wright it!!
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| You literally said that the idea that 'just off the piste is safe' is encouraged by instructors. There is only one possible way to read that. If you didn't mean that, don't wright it!! |
You're not reading what I write.
If you want to be accurate, I literally wrote that the culture of 'JOTP is safe' is encouraged by instructors. And it is, by instructors acting in the way I mention.
Do you genuinely believe:
(a) that instructors don't take their charges off piste otherwise than in off-piste courses; and
(b) that all - or even more than a small proportion of - instructors make mention of the particular circumstances that makes this bit of JOTP safe, but not that bit?
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(c) that having been taken JOTP in a lesson by an instructor who makes no comment on the risks that a punter is not thereby encouraged into skiing JOTP?
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Wed 7-03-12 15:23; edited 1 time in total
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fatbob, All of them???......including the ones I seen go up the Galzigbahn and then straight into Basecamp at the bottom later on???...or the ones with them triggered in the Mooserwirt or the ones who left them outside the Post Keller at 01:00am buried in snow?...my original point was there's a helluva lot them about this year than previous years, I asked why.....then the forum exploded.
pam w, Are you saying that someone struggling on a minor mogul field could possibly be an off-piste skier??....surely you'd want to have a decent grasp of skiing on the piste before you think about dropping in to the backcountry....or maybe I made all this up.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| James the Last wrote: |
| clarky999 wrote: |
| You literally said that the idea that 'just off the piste is safe' is encouraged by instructors. There is only one possible way to read that. If you didn't mean that, don't wright it!! |
You're not reading what I write.
If you want to be accurate, I literally wrote that the culture of 'JOTP is safe' is encouraged by instructors. And it is, by instructors acting in the way I mention.
Do you genuinely believe:
(a) that instructors don't take their charges off piste otherwise than in off-piste courses; and
(b) that all - or even more than a small proportion of - instructors make mention of the particular circumstances that makes this bit of JOTP safe, but not that bit? |
I've read exactly what written - and you've just written exactly it again. That instructors encourage the idea that 'just off the piste is safe.'
I'm sure plenty of instructors take guests offpiste - it's good for their skiing. I would hope that all instructors going offpiste do make some comments about safety. Personally I'm not qualified to take guests offpiste, but I do make a point of talking about all sorts of safety aspects in skiing at some point over the week.
But either way, no instructor will just indiscriminately take guests on any 'jotp,' it'll be selected, safety/difficulty being one of the criteria. Even if nothing is explained, it surely requires a pretty great leap of idiocy to go form skiing one pitch near the pistes, to assuming that everything near the pistes is safe? I am assuming, of course, that no instructor has said it's all safe. That would obviously be encouraging the belief.
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dazman, of course less than stellar on-piste skiers and ski off-piste. I'd think doing so earlier would make the transition between the two much nicer.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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dazman, I certainly started skiing offpiste, and messing about in the powder, a fair while before I could competently ski moguls.
And there are plenty of offpiste routes from the Galzig that could finish on the piste above Base Camp.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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xyzpaul, Errr she has been a full time instructor for about 25 years so has some idea
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dazman, I've no idea, I too saw a lot of airbag packs in St Anton earlier this year but failed to jump to the conclusion they were being used just for pose value. I'm sure the guiding operations make decent coin by renting them out & by its reputation St Anton, like Chamonix etc will always attract a certain apirational population but clearly people have money to burn if they can drop £600 or equivalent on a pack just to hold some spare goggles and suncream and look gnarly, then leave it lying around outisde while they get pissed. No-one's kicking off on you, it's just a mildly interesting topic for discussion in an otherwise fairly fallow period.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
Are you saying that someone struggling on a minor mogul field could possibly be an off-piste skier??....surely you'd want to have a decent grasp of skiing on the piste before you think about dropping in to the backcountry...
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Are you saying that nobody skis off-piste until they have completely mastered all the on-piste skills? If so, you are clearly completely wrong; you see plenty of not-too-competent people off piste (me, f'rinstance). If you mean they shouldn't ski off piste until they are experts, that's a perfectly valid opinion, which I don't share. As I said above, easiski (Charlotte Swift) regularly takes her beginners off piste because she thinks it's good for them. And I'm sure she's right.
I also agree that lots of people spend money on gear they don't need (nobody needs a 600 euro jacket).
All we disagree about, it seems, is your insistence that if someone isn't an expert skier, or skis entire pistes, they can't possibly be an off-piste skier.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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dazman, you could have avoided those bullying replies by simply changing "clearly" to "possibly" in your original post, i.e.
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But this season I've noticed a marked increase in people wearing Ortovox ABS backpacks...when the they're possibly not off piste skiers.
Is this "on-piste paranoia" or is it a mountainous fashion statement???
Anyone?
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What an interesting thread it could have been 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Maybe there is a new kind of fastidious avalanche that only deigns to cover highly skilled skiers, us punters it leaves alone so we don't need the gear.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I remember the instructor taking us WAY off piste on my second week's skiing - long before I could ski anything more than a gentle blue, never mind moguls.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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My original post was merely an observation which then seemed to turn into some sort grammatical/ski ability witchunt...let's leave it shall we.
xyzpaul, True, thus proving one wrong word in here and the clique police will come on your back bottom quicker than you can say Rodney King...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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dazman, Gets out of hand eh? A fair question/ observation I thought, your OP, a bit of fun/ tongue in cheek! - Some people go off one one dont they?!!
Anyway, I'm totally happy with my ABS rucksack, and my 600€ technical jacket (that I got for £299), and wear a decent helmet..............I must be a diCk maybe in some peoples eyes....plus, my car's got ABS and airbags too..........!!
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FAQ
