 Poster: A snowHead
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think it through and what makes sense to you and how you ski...
For me, always straps as I really don't want to be scrambling around to go and get one...................unless in tight trees or in a situation where it will be better that they don't get snagged...
It can be quite disconcerting skiing some stuff without a pole...as I had to do quite recently when I snapped a fibre one in half
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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FlyingStantoni, ive only used a guide once (skiing the v.blanche) and he told us to strap up.i suppose its like wearing/not wearing a helmet,sunglasses or goggles.its personal experience/preference and wont get resolved.what i cant believe is that this topic is now on its 2nd page
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I was told not to use the straps for fear of wrist injuries by our instructor in Tignes. Ever since have not used them and it does save faffing around at the top of lifts.
"6) Preventing hand and wrist injuries
Ski poles can influence thumb and hand injuries. When a skier falls on an outstretched hand that is holding a ski pole, the pole can cause a tear of the ulna collateral ligament of the thumb. The best way to prevent this injury is not to use the straps and drop the poles when you fall."
http://www.sportsperform.co.uk/ski_perform.php
For dry slope I am going to look at changing the handles on the children's poles.
"Using ski poles without platforms or saber handles decreases your chance of injury"
http://www.assh.org/Public/HandConditions/Pages/SkiandSnowboardInjuries.aspx
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| pam w wrote: |
| but the "correct" way to hold them (as demo'd by various instructors over the years) is to put the hand through the strap, letting the pole dangle from the lower hand/wrist, then bring the hand down around the strap and hold the handle (so the two parts of the strap are under your hand. |
Anyone with any Nordic skiing experience will recognise this technique. I'd just note that the strap should be tight at this point. You should be able to let go of the pole but not have the grip fall away from your hand. If you want to get maximum force when poling/skating, this is the way to do it. Personally, I rarely use the straps in this way when downhill skiing, as I am not really intending to do much poling/skating. If your objective is just not to lose the things when skiing, do whatever you want. When downhill skiing, I usually "enter from above" and then just grip the pole, tightening the strap to a reasonable point. I don't really see why one method should be any better than any other in this case.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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i have recently gone back to using straps and now i feel positively "naked" without them. the absolute best skier i have skied with used them. lots of guides will tell you not to use them, but there are a lot of guides who probably aren't the first people you would consult when looking for technical input on skiing
that said, it's a matter of personal choice - i just wish people wouldn't tell me not to use straps for whatever reason like i haven't heard all the arguments a 1000 times before [/rant]
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| Arno wrote: |
| the absolute best skier i have skied with used them. |
I'm sure he'd still be the absolute best skier if he didn't use them too 
Personally I don't use pole straps and haven't lost a pole in the last 25+ years. Obviously I've dropped a few, but always managed to retrieve them quite easily. I've always found skis harder to retrieve in deep snow than poles. From my own experience poles tend to end up on the surface not that far away from the shunt. Skis can end up miles away and often buried. Ultimately I'd rather lose a pole than risk wrenching my thumb or shoulder apart.
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I think without exception my guides (sample of about 25) have told me not to use straps in guided terrain - specifically in trees and avalanche areas, and could see little use for having them elsewhere. They would normally suggest cutting the straps off altogether. I have seen a few who still had straps on their poles, and they would be the more free-ridey types rather than the full-on mountaineers-who-ski. I ski off-piste with the straps, but without using them, but then normally do use them for mogul fields (or have to stop half way down particularly energetic runs when I finally work out that skiing the bumps with your hand half way down the shaft is less than ideal). After a number of years skiing everywhere strap-less, on the occasions that I do ski on-piste I do now do so with straps on.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Away from potential avalanche terrain, this strap or not strap thing comes down to basically what is the risk of catching a pole on something and doing yourself a nasty injury if the straps are on. I like to have them on as it means i can let go of the pole to take photos or do other things without having to stick the pole in the snow, but if I am skiing in a very confined space or on limited cover close to a snow fence here I take them off, and always on lifts. The thought of having a pole stick on a snow fence with straps on going up a poma is 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| beequin wrote: |
"6) Preventing hand and wrist injuries
Ski poles can influence thumb and hand injuries. |
Both of those things were written by someone who doesn't know how to hold poles correctly. If you hold poles and you have straps on correctly, there's no way you can hurt your thumb. Believe me in 20 years of competitive skiing I was falling a lot... with high speed, with low speed, on course, off course... basically if there's any possible way how to fall, I did it  And I never, not even one single time, had issues with my thumbs or wrists.
If your straps are on correct way, your poles get released and hanging around your wrist, without giving any pressure to your thumb. But if you put them on wrong way, then that's not really reason to ski without them or to tell straps can cause injuries. Instead of suggesting stupid things like skiing without straps, they should be rather suggesting how to use straps properly. It would help much more
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| primoz wrote: |
| beequin wrote: |
"6) Preventing hand and wrist injuries
Ski poles can influence thumb and hand injuries. |
Both of those things were written by someone who doesn't know how to hold poles correctly........ |
The author of ski-injury's information is Dr Mike Langram
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| Mike is currently a board member and UK National Secretary for both the International Society for Skiing Safety and SITEMSH (The International Society for Skiing Traumatology and Winter Sports Medicine). When he's not on duty at the medical centre, Mike spends time working as the doctor for the local CairnGorm ski patrol. |
I think he probably knows about the various methods of holding poles.
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Don't you just hate those "I have been smoking for twenty years and I don't have cancer. primoz, you can hurt your thumbs or wrists with or without straps. I take my view and you take yours as to whether to use straps, but to say that I or the sites specified do not know how to use straps is just prejudice (and insulting). And to be fair to achilles, the ski-injury site does not come down strongly on one side or t'other and gives a guide to use.
Yes, it is personal preference and yes I and others may be wrong, but please leave out the "I am God" argument.
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You know it makes sense.
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| beequin wrote: |
| ....... And to be fair to achilles, the ski-injury site does not come down strongly on one side or t'other and gives a guide to use........ |
Quite. I raised Dr Langram's qualifications only in the context of him knowing what he was writing about, contrary to the impression given by primoz.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Working as doctor, on ski resort or in hospital or for some national ski team, has very little to do with skiing itself. It has a lot to do with consequences of skiing and ski injuries, but it doesn't tell much about his skiing knowledge. During my years on national team, I had pleasure to work with many team doctors and/or physios, and 99% of them, had no idea about skiing. They were great doctors and/or physios, but they had no idea about skiing technique, and quite few (I could probably say most of them) were not even skiing themself, even if they were spending 200+ days/year with us on ski resorts around the world.
So sorry to say this, but this qualifications which you write about dr. Langram don't tell much about him being able to hold ski poles properly or not
PS: Beequin I agree... You can hurt your thumb skiing. It's no big deal. But in 99.9% of cases this has nothing to do with poles and/or straps. Biggest part of thumb injuries comes from hitting snow with thumb at wrong angle, not because of strap spinning your thumb wrong way.
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Poster: A snowHead
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primoz, 
| Jonpim (in another thread) wrote: |
Interesting stuff.
Maybe we should have some references.
Dr Mike Langran is the UK Secretary of the ISSS: International Society for Skiing Safety.
The ISSS have international congresses every other year.
The last one was in 2007 in Aviemore, organised by Mike Langran.
Proceedings of that meeting here.
Well worth reading.
The next meeting is in Garmisch-Partenkirchen April 26 - May 2, 2009.
Mike Langran runs ski-injury.com |
Despite your assertion, I do indeed think that a skiing medical practitioner, who sees skiing injuries at his medical centre throughout the season, works with the local ski patrol, researches ski injuries and keeps abreast of international opinion just might know what he is talking about.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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again, preference, but you are more likely to snap a pole strapped, IMV.. so, you evaluate and decide.
A few guides have told me to unstrap at certain places and you take note of that. When and where..for me. as mostly you'll be thinking what will happen if whatever happens...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Jonny Jones, It sounds like you weren't tree skiing then. What I call tree skiing is dodging about between fairly close packed trees. It couldn't be a run.
I use the strap where I am nervous about dropping a stick down a long steep slope and having to retrieve it, or if I have to pole on the flat - but otherwise not (I hardly ever ski a piste). You never know where there might be avalanche danger off-piste. The avalanche I was in was somewhere where we had been told we were safe and didn't need to go one at a time. There have been horrific injuries from poles in avalanches (I am told).
I drew a pic of how to use strap but there is now a photo - oh well, I'll put it on anyway:  click to enlarge
However, although it can be a very good exercise to do without poles they are important to help initiate turns, especially on steep slopes, so I certainly wouldn't advocate not using them, even if your skiing isn't very advanced - you will need them later.
Edit: Oops- the Jonny Jones bit was the end of page 1 - didn't notice there was a page 2.
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Wed 15-04-09 12:25; edited 2 times in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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what is the best way to hold poles?..with your f*****g hands.. gaper
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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snowpatrol,
Now, now, no need to be so nasty. Maybe you'll need some advice some day, like how to start a sentence with a capital letter?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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There is an answer to this whole debate
Leki, quick releases (the old yellow ones, not the new red ones)
Best of both worlds, poles attached for everyday stuff and gentle falls, poles will pop off in a heavy fall. Also super easy to ping em when using lifts and just holding the grips pops the triggers back in. If your off piste and dont want straps, just take off the strap bits.
Had mine 5 years now and wouldnt change em for the world. They work are comfortable, durable, safe.
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Smokin Joe,
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If I stick my poles in my boot bag will I be able to take them on an Easyryan flight as hand luggage ?
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Only if you are extremely short or have extremely large feet
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Blimey, I didn't realise the straps were for use whilst skiing.... two pages of invaluable information.
I thought they were just to hang the poles over your ski tips with at the restaurant....
Question is, should I hang them both over my own skis or one over mine and one over my friend's skis??
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Ski Tyke wrote: |
| Blimey, I didn't realise the straps were for use whilst skiing .... I thought they were just to hang the poles over your ski tips with at the restaurant |
Ski Tyke, ... that's the only reason I haven't cut the flaps (sorry, straps) off mine too.
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Good grief. Two whole pages on how to hold a stick.
You lot are completely mental.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Thanks. I ought to provide a link to the origin with apologies to the author:
http://xkcd.com/
Some great cartoons there!
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You know it makes sense.
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snowball, that's a very nice drawing. 
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FAQ
