 Poster: A snowHead
|
| rjs wrote: |
I thought Buffalo clothing was supposed to be a top layer. Wearing a down jacket over the top of it won't get the air inside the down layer as warm as if it was over a conventional mid-layer garment.
Maybe you wouldn't need as thick a jacket if it was over something else. |
I can assure you on dry cold days it works very well. I've worn this method for a decade. Just 2 layers needed.
Just the rain/melting snow causes an issue.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| snowdave wrote: |
@rjs, Buffalo (& its equivalents) is meant to be base, mid and top layer. The principle is that if you get cold, you add another layer. I have a pertex/pile "shirt" (over-the-head style), and also a "jacket" with a full zip. If I get cold with the shirt, I add the jacket. I usually add a base layer as well, since that's easier to keep clean, but the buffalo recommendation is that you wear their clothes next to your skin.
I've used both layers combined, for a full day of torrential rain, cycle touring along the Norwegian coast. I stayed warm and dry. The only warm/water resistant layers I took for six months of canoeing and hiking in Alaska was two layers of pertex/pile. It looks pretty scruffy, but it works.
Where it fails, just like my mate's paramo, is if you stop moving for a (very) long period of time, or you sit on something wet. Eventually the moisture seeps through. Belaying is fine, as is repairing a puncture. An hour long lunch stop gets marginal. |
I bought one of the Alpkit Buffalo shirt copies to experiment with the concept on the cheap and I have to say it is remarkably effective. The slight issue is that they are WARM so you need the weather to be pretty chilly. But given I sweat a lot when exercising it keeps me drier next to the skin than any other solution I've tried - the wicking is AMAZING.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
@jedster, that’s useful info- my montane copy of buffalo is nearly 30 yrs old and i was wondering what the closest equivalent is nowadays.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
Do you recall the model name by any chance?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
I like some of those, sadly a little too far to travel to try one out.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@king key, that is a nice looking bit of kit 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Scamper, I saw that one in Go Outdoors a few weeks back, but looking into it, it appeared to be more 'water resistant' rather than 'waterproof'. The reviewer in the link seems to have found this. "Lovely jacket, very warm but unfortunately not fully waterproof. Water started creeping through within half an hour of consistent rain.."
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
It claims to have a HH rating of 10k which would be the same as many ski jackets.
Fingers crossed that the reviewer just had a duff one as I bought one (in the sales, with about a hundred quid off) at the end of last season.
Perhaps I'll stand outside in it tomorrow and give it a proper test!! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
It's beyond me why you would wear a down puffer for skiing outside of somewhere like Alaska, but the problem with down is that it doesn't perform at all well if it gets wet, so a 10K rating probably isn't that great if you intend to use it in the rain. You will just get cold and wet and smell like a mouldy goose.
Personally I would be going for some decent quality synthetic insulation, primaloft gold or whatever, it would make a lot more sense.
I've just done a few nights touring in some really cold weather - max of about negative 6 all day, mostly wore a soft-shell over a polartec alpha fleece, and was plenty warm enough when active, and then threw on a light primaloft gold/pertex puffy if needed, which was perfect. Overnight at minus 15 it still just about worked for being outside. Really can't see a use case for a down jacket for active use.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| king key wrote: |
| Do you recall the model name by any chance? |
sorry to be slow - Alpkit Jura Mountain Smock
https://alpkit.com/products/jura-smock-mens
I reckon its very effective in cool/cold dry or damp conditions when you are active (at least bursts of activity). Limitations would be warmer conditions (not a summer garment!) or static in rain.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
@jedster, Thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
I used a down filled jacket with a gortex shell many years ago. Were in Scotland, snowing heavily and I discovered that I had left my shell in the accommodation, so a friend loaned me this warm, waterproof jacket.
Within 30 minutes the down was wet and soggy and I was soaking wet. It didn't leak, but was so warm (at -3c) that I was pouring with sweat. Probably excellent for high altitude mountaineering at minus 30 or 40c, but completely useless near freezing point.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
I've got a Rab Valiance but use it exclusively for winter fishing; not skiing. Primary reason it would be far too warm for me and like all jackets of a similar ilk the pay off is reduced breathability which for skiing means not being able to dump sweat and therefore potentially get even colder.
However. . .I don't see why it wouldn't be useful for those that really feel it; perhaps older skiers exerting less energy or those that like to cruise all day in supercold resorts eg Nordics / USA etc. It certainly IS waterproof and whilst I wouldn't sit out in a deluge for more than perhaps an hour its DWR is more than adequate to handle a bit of snow for a day interspersed with lunch / hut stops etc.
Saw plenty of peeps skiing in my favourite apres puffa in Trysil earlier this year (Mountain Equipment Lightline) which is warmer than the Rab Valiance and that was in -14C and sunshine! Personally like others prefer to go with a lower bulk synthetic puffa (Patagonia Nano Air) and a Goretex shell . . .much more options to control temps and keep comfy
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
It's not cut and dry (excuse the pun 
).
