 Poster: A snowHead
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Villars was full of complete knobs using slower skiers and my disabled daughter as slalom poles.
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I once used a school group as slalom poles. To be fair, the kids were all dressed up as giant traffic cones and kept lining up down the middle of the piste. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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An overwhelming case for taking kids out of school and/or skiing at Easter - and possibly Christmas. If I could only ski at half term or New Year in crowded resorts I'd take up another hobby. I'm afraid that when my kids were young we always went in those cheap, quiet, weeks in early January. But we've had that discussion before!
At least one Snowhead who is a great fan of Les Gets will not go there at half term because of the crowds.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| cstreat wrote: |
| Sorry to contradict the PDS fan club, but I visited Avoriaz last Jan, so low season; Morzine sat in a soup of smog, and Avoriaz and above Chatel simply had too many skiers for the area; overpriced and over populated; Champery had some more space, but was even more expensive. To be fair, Les Gets and Morzine had little snow, but this is the weakness of the area, where low lying, over built areas flood into higher resorts. Personally, I think it has become a victim of its own popularity, being one of the first stops from Geneva, and by car from NW France, UK, Belgium, Netherlands etc...... there, someone had to say it ( flamesuit on !) |
You don't need your flame suit. But I will say that you can't judge a Ski area on one visit - There are just so many variables.
I do think that if steps aren't taken soon then it will become a victim of its own popularity, there is so much building going on that it won't be long before the spirit of the place is destroyed. But, who is to blame for this? developers... You'd have thought they might've learnt their lesson from what happened in Spain, but they just look elsewhere. It does break my heart when in the off season I see the orange pegs come out for land which is being sold/submitted for planning but they won't stop... no matter how much they build. They sell the land off one piece at a time to keep the demand (and therefore the price) high then build apartments. Sometimes the infrastructure is pushed too far and it's difficult to get around town.... But the French do love a crowd - where ever you go.
I can't see too many places left to build on in Morzine, and in Les Gets I've seen countless projects start, even Le Biot, and Seytoux etc are becoming victims to themselves... once cute little hamlets they're now glorified building sites. Chatel also has it's 'fair' share of building projects going on.
At the end of the day people ARE buying them, so the demand must be there for the property.... you rarely buy in a ski resort if you don't intend to use it in some way shape or form... so if you are buying, then so are other people... who are also here to ski = busy pistes at busy times.... simple maths.
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Also, I've seen bad behaviour in plenty of other Ski Areas I've been to - It's not right to think it's just a problem in the PDS because the ski Area, or an individual resort is popular...
Like any ski area, and as I've said before, you have to know where to go to avoid the runs that get crowded, therefore attract more people likely to cause problems - I ALWAYS avoid chamoissiere becasue it's so full of crazy people, that being said Mr Mountain Addiction made the arguement that we should head over there (last week), so off we went... There were so many straightliners, and people speeding that I daren't move. In fact Mr Mountain Addiction narrowly avoided serious injury when he was the down hill skier, carving and controlling his speed when a crazy person skiing at very high speed cut him up as he was engaging a turn (V dangerous) so, we caught the guy up and explained that as Mr Mountain Addiction was the downhill skier (and as nobody has eyes in the back of their heads) that he had right of way and was entirely with in his rights to turn where he needed too, saw fit, or just where he wanted.... the offender treid to argue that Mr Mountain Addiction had cut him up by turning in front of his path, when the offenders father joined the conversation and chastised his son for not giving the skier 'en aval' right of way... It's simple arrogance to not acknowledge mountain rules, even though there are posters and signs saying 'control your speed', or 'the downhill skier has right of way'....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Mountain Addiction,
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I ALWAYS avoid chamoissiere becasue it's so full of crazy people
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I agree with that - since the new lift was put in which made it a bit too easy to get there it has become too crowded by far. We tend to go over there only first thing in the morning, and then leave as soon as it starts to get busy. We have some friends coming to stay in March and the wife is no longer skiing having had her leg very badly broken on the Chamossiere two years ago when she was taken out by someone from behind.
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@Mountain Addiction, It`s a fair comment that you cannot judge on one visit; if I had had half a meter of fresh I would probably be telling all and sundry what a great place it was. Bad behaviour does happen everywhere, but it is more statistically more likely to happen in a mainstream "pop" resort of a large size, simply because of the type and number of clientele that it attracts. I visited most of the French mega resorts with my kids when they were growing up, at peak times, and this led me to smaller resorts with cheaper passes, no queues, and locals who were glad that you had visited ( on the whole ! ) In the last 2 years, in the Maurienne, I have witnessed more development, and more visitors......it seems nowhere will stay quiet and undeveloped for long. January and early March are the only times that I would consider nowdays.
Like the seaside, anywhere that is easily accessible attracts the masses, whose interests are based on convenience and range of choice for all of those factors outside of the core activity; accommodation, dining, nightlife, spas, etc..... so a fair proportion of us travel / walk over the next headland to find some beauty and solitude, and next thing you know, we`ve ruined it !!
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| Scrumpy wrote: |
| Is this one effect of all the recent developments in ski technology? I have noticed a lot of people skiing a lot better in recent years, but also a lot more skiing fast and not in full control. I think that the new skis enable many novices to think that they can manage without lessons far sooner than in the past and they just become a liability on the slopes. |
the over grooming of the slopes does not help either
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I've only been to the PdS in quiet weeks, but the general standard of skiing was  awful. I guess it attracts a low of French people who don't live near the mountains, but as they 'come form an alpine nation' think they can actually ski.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@clarky999, and plenty of poor British skiers too - big TO numbers in the "quiet weeks". One of my French neighbours, ruefully ruminating on the difficulty of renting his (lovely) gite in mid January, told me categorically that "French people don't ski in January". Clearly not true, but...... that's why genuinely French areas are so spectacularly deserted in mid January.
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@tangowaggon, I agree, i do wish they would leave some blue slopes to bump up, but people complain. Les carroz tourist office has been advertising they groom everything more, less bumps as thats what people want.
For the past 3 years les carroz is even grooming a black (was red, but always mogulled) all the way down, they usually groom the top of them and then leave the lower. It is entertaining at times watching from gron chair that goes over it. A few people straight line the top and then either try a really huge hockey stop when it flattens out or its very often a total yard sale.
A recent issue perhaps seems to be that rockered skis catch edges less easily so perhaps make it easier to straight line stuff??
At new year our next door neighbours, were complaining that the slopes were not being groomed at lunchtime!! like resorts they had been to in Austria, didn't ask where and they would not be coming back as it got too bumpy later in the day!! (plus the food on the mountain was too expensive....which it is!)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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So either the skier in the video made the natural error of looking at what he wanted to avoid so hit it, or he was doing some big sweeping turns saw the boarder and was going to sweep right and decided not to so turned further up hill to slow down but in doing so cocked up...
poo-poo happens.
But answer a skier a question... Why was a boarder sliding down the hill like that? It looked like a nervous creep down rather than sweeping turns...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Dave of the Marmottes,
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Unbelievable the monkey in the video. Would have been left in no doubt as to what sort of c* he was and possibly I'd have confiscated one of his skis and gone somewhere inaccessible with it.
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The guy made a mistake. It wasn't obvious that he was doing anything wantonly reckless to cause it, juist a poorly chosen route, inexperience and an inability to stop.. To have called them a c* and confiscated one of their skis might have been overkill. Of course, it's extremely annoying when somethingf like that happens but it didn't appear as if any harm was done. These things are always going to happen occasionally. It would be an unusual skier who could say they had never caused a collision of any sort. Within reason I think we have to be tolerant of these sort of incidents.
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@Dave of the Marmottes,
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Unbelievable the monkey in the video. Would have been left in no doubt as to what sort of c* he was and possibly I'd have confiscated one of his skis and gone somewhere inaccessible with it.
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The guy made a mistake. It wasn't obvious that he was doing anything wantonly reckless to cause it, juist a poorly chosen route, inexperience and an inability to stop.. To have called them a c* and confiscated one of their skis might have been overkill. Of course, it's extremely annoying when somethingf like that happens but it didn't appear as if any harm was done. These things are always going to happen occasionally. It would be an unusual skier who could say they had never caused a collision of any sort. Within reason I think we have to be tolerant of these sort of incidents.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Unbelievable the monkey in the video. Would have been left in no doubt as to what sort of c* he was and possibly I'd have confiscated one of his skis and gone somewhere inaccessible with it. |
Yeah yeah, course you would
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I was skiing last week in PDS and it was busy but not unusually so for a peak week. There were some skiers skiing too fast and out of control but isn't that always going to happen? Have experienced worse in Ski amade-Sunday locals. Not everybody can ski in control at all times, certainly last week there were a few sneaky slick patches which caught us all out! Biggest danger last week were more experienced skiers re-entering the piste from off piste at speed, idiots stopping in the middle of the piste to chat and skiers starting off without looking up the slopes.
The skier in the video looks very inexperienced and just 'lost it'
Considered and appropriate response by boarder.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Just down to simple multiplication I suspect?
Say for arguments sake 1 in 10 users is a risk
10K skiers in a resort- 1000.
Half term week say there's 30k then there's 3000.
Accidents happen but it's horrible being taken out by other users of the slopes. My advice is to ski off piste-it's safer 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| ... Would have been left in no doubt as to what sort of c* he was and possibly I'd have confiscated one of his skis and gone somewhere inaccessible with it. |
Well, that would be only if he was physically smaller than you or you had a group of mates with you, I would venture to suggest.
It's hardly a civilized approach and I hope if you did have a bunch of mates they'd point that out to you.
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| The guy made a mistake. It wasn't obvious that he was doing anything wantonly reckless ... |
This.
The video shows a tiny prang between two beginners. Either of them could have easily avoided it. Neither appeared to have the ability to stop or change direction, as they both saw it coming yet did nothing. If that's not entirely acceptable, then you're in the wrong sport.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Saw someone throwing up whilst on a chairlift today....is this bad behaviour?
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Philwig, totally agree not malicious and these prangs are almost an unavoidable part of learning to ski, particularly if skiing during a busy week. (Unfortunately sometimes cause injury) however I'm not sure the skier had the ability to avoid the collision!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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....is this bad behaviour
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not necessarily @mayr, it happened to my son (34 at the time) Christmas 2013 on the Chavannes Express - he was struck by one of those bugs that just suddenly hits you, was most apologetic to us, his fellow travellers, and managed to keep it onto a bit between the pistes towards the top and not onto anyone. This was not alcohol related, although many incidents probably are.
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@Pamski, This chap apparently puked last year on a ski holiday. Today, the light was a bit flat and we were at a height where altitude sickness can cause issues to some. Glad he was on the chair ahead and we weren't in a gondola needing a snokel!
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| Zorrac wrote: |
@tangowaggon, I agree, i do wish they would leave some blue slopes to bump up, but people complain. Les carroz tourist office has been advertising they groom everything more, less bumps as thats what people want.
For the past 3 years les carroz is even grooming a black (was red, but always mogulled) all the way down, they usually groom the top of them and then leave the lower. It is entertaining at times watching from gron chair that goes over it. A few people straight line the top and then either try a really huge hockey stop when it flattens out or its very often a total yard sale.
A recent issue perhaps seems to be that rockered skis catch edges less easily so perhaps make it easier to straight line stuff??
At new year our next door neighbours, were complaining that the slopes were not being groomed at lunchtime!! like resorts they had been to in Austria, didn't ask where and they would not be coming back as it got too bumpy later in the day!! (plus the food on the mountain was too expensive....which it is!) |
On the birthday bash in the sella ronda, it was a really good week, BUT, the area is goomed to death. If a black run is a difficult run for advanced and expert skiers, there are NO black runs in the Sella ronda, it was almost worth staying in the hotel till 3pm when at least there were a few bumps to play with. Offpiste and under the chars are the only interesting bits of skiing to be had. Even if they left just a handful of the "black" runs to go natural, the area would be so much better.
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Banning the use of helmets would also make tbe slopes a lot safer (runs for cover!!!!!)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Half term Hooray Henrys. Skiing during British school holidays anywhere where there are British TO's means a substantially increased risk of being wiped out by muppets. Avoid.
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Banning the use of helmets would also make tbe slopes a lot safer (runs for cover!!!!!)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@tangowaggon, Didn't quite get that, sorry ...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If you hunt down my review you'll find a resort that's within an hour of an airport, has 120kms of piste and NO British TOs go there. Last week I heard an English voice once. It has a real old town at its heart and is not a rip off. I saw no idiocy on piste all week and skiing with 2 kids I'm always going to be a little defensive.
But in order to try and keep it like that you'll have to go and find where I'm referring to 
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| irie wrote: |
| Half term Hooray Henrys. Skiing during British school holidays anywhere where there are British TO's means a substantially increased risk of being wiped out by muppets. Avoid. |
Only times (2) that I have been wiped out was by French youfs.
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You know it makes sense.
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| pam w wrote: |
| An overwhelming case for taking kids out of school and/or skiing at Easter - and possibly Christmas. If I could only ski at half term or New Year in crowded resorts I'd take up another hobby. I'm afraid that when my kids were young we always went in those cheap, quiet, weeks in early January. But we've had that discussion before! |
Ditto. We have grandchildren now and the same applies.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@grazzenger, Scottishland.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Have to agree with a previous poster and we find Andorra a perfect antidote to half term.... Valnord rather than Grand Valira but have just had a very chilled week. Hope you can get to go and accommodation prospect at times you want to ski... If peak weeks aren't when you need to be skiing it may be best avoiding!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Half term definitely although the piste didn't look particularly crowded for half term, which one was it?
While the proportion of idiots and out of controls may not vary with the season the fact that there could be 3 times as many idiots on the same piste as you at half term does seem to increase the chances of being taken out. Even if there are three times as many potential targets "Murphys Law" does dictate that it will be you that is hit. I am sure that the proportion of idiots does increase at half term thereby increasing probabilities.
Every ski resort has its advantages and disadvantages, the PDS is generally low and snow cover is always a risk although the snowmaking and snow management is good throughout the whole area. Apart from Avoriaz the whole area is based around small (although expanding) villages and typified by lots of the local businesses my members of the same extended families, among others Baud comes to mind for Morzine/Les Gets and Rubin for Chatel. High French resorts tend to be purpose built soulless concrete jungles and although are more snow sure appear to be much more at risk from lift closure due to high winds.
@pam w,
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An overwhelming case for taking kids out of school and/or skiing at Easter - and possibly Christmas. If I could only ski at half term or New Year in crowded resorts I'd take up another hobby. I'm afraid that when my kids were young we always went in those cheap, quiet, weeks in early January.
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Totally agree, once we learnt that, we never went at half term again somehow our kids were always sick for the first full week in January. Even these days with the potential to be fined for absence the net savings in cost and massively increased enjoyment I well worth it. Away from the peak weeks especially the beginning of January the area is beautifully quiet and we have experienced many occasions when we appeared to be the only people on the mountain, not true I know but it felt like it. Having said that my wife has been "taken out" when there were only three people on a long clear wide section of piste. The out of control idiot, who was French in this case, just missed me and sent my wife sprawling. Fortunately no injury, just a massive blow to her self confidence.
If Chatel is still on your list of possibilities then you need to go again, and preferably get some expert local guiding to show you the best ways around the area and the best places to ski when it's busy.
If we were considering buying our first choice of location would be somewhere within reasonable walking distance of the Linga lifts as this gives great access to Lindarets, Avoriaz and beyond and with the new lift connection to Super Chatel great access to Torgon, La Chappelle, and Morgins. Also the complete round trip through Switzerland.
I almost forgot the other main reason for not doing half term, cost, we had two weeks in January with another week booked for March and our total accommodation cost for the 3 weeks is less than one weeks cost at half term.
Good luck with your chalet hunt
By the way
@tangowaggon,
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Banning the use of helmets would also make tbe slopes a lot safer
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Totally agree, helmets make people feel safe. People who feel safe take more unnecessary risks.
Ban helmets, make people feel unsafe so they take more care.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| graeme wrote: |
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Unbelievable the monkey in the video. Would have been left in no doubt as to what sort of c* he was and possibly I'd have confiscated one of his skis and gone somewhere inaccessible with it. |
Yeah yeah, course you would |
I might well do as innocent looking collisions can cause nasty knee injuries.
In penance today I was being over cocky last run of the day and found myself going through a rope narrowly avoiding a roll of race fencing and finding myself head down in a snow cannon well with my skis still attached on top of a fence. Had a brief moment of" this is what being buried in an avy feels like " until I tried twisting my head the other way away from the pad.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Half term is actually better for us, but our circumstances are a little different. We have a friend with an apartment in Soldeu that doesn't charge us any more for half term and the biggest thing is that there are lots of English kids in ski school, our 7yr old daughter loves ski school and the friends she makes. She would be unhappy bunny if we did not put her in ski school.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@tangowaggon, call me a wimp, but I enjoy the nicely groomed pistes in the Dolomites. 
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@Dave of the Marmottes, agreed. What on earth was he trying to achieve when OP's other half was quite clearly at the extreme left of the piste. Absent her would he have taken himself off the edge of the piste? Barmy...
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| pam w wrote: |
| @tangowaggon, call me a wimp, but I enjoy the nicely groomed pistes in the Dolomites. |
Same here - I need them now, as i am skiing on borrowed time with my knees.
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| NickyJ wrote: |
| pam w wrote: |
| @tangowaggon, call me a wimp, but I enjoy the nicely groomed pistes in the Dolomites. |
Same here - I need them now, as i am skiing on borrowed time with my knees. |
I would never say stop grooming altogether, just leave a handful of pistes to go natural, eg where a black and red start and finish at the same point, leave one of them "natural", or, if a run is very wide, only groom half of it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I can't understand why people choose to come to France during French half term etc when Italy is so much quieter and a hell of a lot cheaper!
Here in Serre today (Sunday) it's mobbed again, with idiots all over the place and when you come back down off the hill it's just as crazy.
We park up very early for first lifts and when I come back it's astonishing how people have parked forcing you to do a 10 point turn to get out!
And another rant whilst we're at it !
We were going a fair way off piste (long traverses) and today avy risk is 4, and the muppets are merrily following us, whole families with young kids and not a care in the world.
Though have to admit some of them can ski powder fairly well even on piste skis as they've been doing it for ages.
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@Weathercam,
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I can't understand why people choose to come to France during French half term etc when Italy is so much quieter and a hell of a lot cheaper!
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Very good point. I suspect there are vast numbers of British skiers who have yet to discover Italy as a skiing destination. France offers so much and so conveniently that you actually have to push yourself the extra mile to Italy. Once there you do indeed spend the week wondering why you haven't always skied there 
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FAQ
