@mitcva, I suspect that the loss of summer tourists from the U.K. will have been compensated for by tourists from closer to home, who for obvious reasons have decided not to make plans to travel far afield.
Winter of course will be a different story. Unless the U.K. sinks under further waves, I would expect restrictions to be relaxed. If the U.K. is by then still the “sick man of Europe”, I would expect Austria to prioritise the protection of their elderly and vulnerable citizens, as they did in mid-March, notwithstanding the impact on tourism.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Sadly, I think Austria will suffer this season no matter what. Apres is a large part of the appeal in resorts such as Saalbach, and I don't see how that can continue, given the Ishgl fiasco.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@mitcva, You may well be right, I hope they wake up soon, pretty disappointing atm. What’s right for Vienna is not necessarily good countrywide imv, very conservative approach, but who are we to say, it’s their country!
@mitcva, and @Markymark29,
It’s noticeable that bars and hotels in Saalbach are currently capitalising on people’s preference to be outside. New outside bar areas have opened at Bobby’s and the Hotel Kohlmais (the latter very attractive and well-attended). The HungryDeer and the Wirtshaus/Saalbacherhof have also been busy of late. The Spitzbub opened its outside bar last Saturday and attracted getting on for 100 people on that opening night (with musical entertainment from everyone’s favourite Geordie, “Spacey”, who, like us, has been sheltering here since the winter).
Obviously summer is relatively laid back. It remains to be seen what will happen in the winter, but I expect that there will be a drift towards “external” apres-ski, with bars like Spitzbub and Bauer’s Schialm and the Goassstall doing rather better than say the Hinterhag Alm.
Over 70% of Austria’s skiers normally come from Austria, Germany and the Netherlands, and I would say that those figures are pretty representative of Saalbach. It will be interesting to see what the effect of Covid19 will have on skier flows.
The historical facts and figures are in this year’s International Report on Snow and Mountain Tourism.
https://www.vanat.ch/international-report-on-snow-mountain-tourism
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Fri 10-07-20 18:55; edited 2 times in total
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I'm still getting emails from places we've visited with a "We hope to be able to welcome you soon!" message. From both hotels and tourist offices.
@mitcva, You may well be right, I hope they wake up soon, pretty disappointing atm. What’s right for Vienna is not necessarily good countrywide imv, very conservative approach, but who are we to say, it’s their country!
Ironically Vienna has been more affected/had a bigger hit on tourism than pretty much anywhere else! Around here, the city is definitely down a bit (especially hotel bookings), but the mountain villages are and the more nature-focussed places seem pretty solid. The German market is really the important one there though.
Anecdotally, it seems restaurants are pretty much back to normal, and even most bars seem to be pretty well frequented. But nightclubs and those places who are normally post-midnight destinations are completely screwed. There is also a strong feeling that people don't want to go back to the heavy apres model though, and a desire for more 'nachhaltig' tourism going forwards.
BTW for everyone relying on what the tourism office websites and social media say - I can very reliably say they have no inside info, no forewarning, and learn about updates at the same time as the press report them.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
clarky999 wrote:
There is also a strong feeling that people don't want to go back to the heavy apres model though, and a desire for more 'nachhaltig' tourism going forwards.
Yes, I have heard this too. Not just as a result of 'Ischglgate' but also a desire to move away from attracting the 'Benidorm' crowd, and the negative image that brings.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@clarky999, who are these “people”? I suspect that there will continue to be a market for the renowned Austrian apres-ski parties, especially in outside bars where it is easier to maintain a safe distance.
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Quote:
As far as the German language media is concerned there is little difference between the two male, blond haired Anglo Saxon leaders!
Are we talking about the two Leaders born in New York and were both US citizens until a couple of years ago.
Why do people from the UK get called "Anglo Saxons"? Do the people from other nations get called after one set of their invaders? Surely that term should apply to german peoples.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Quote:
Quote:
As far as the German language media is concerned there is little difference between the two male, blond haired Anglo Saxon leaders!
Are we talking about the two Leaders born in New York and were both US citizens until a couple of years ago.
Why do people from the UK get called "Anglo Saxons"? Do the people from other nations get called after one set of their invaders? Surely that term should apply to german peoples.
As far as the German language media is concerned there is little difference between the two male, blond haired Anglo Saxon leaders!
...
Why do people from the UK get called "Anglo Saxons"? Do the people from other nations get called after one set of their invaders? Surely that term should apply to german peoples.
In the uk it's a PC gone mad way of saying white man.
It's a tricky question because history is written by the victors.
Turks were originally from Central Asia (Turkmenistan, turcomen tribes) and conquered/invaded what was Anatolia.
India is from Hind which is old Persian for the people living around the Indus River in Sindh, which is no longer in India. Not sure when it became a religion though. (Not a good example)
France is named after the Frankish invaders who were originally from areas now in Germany. Used to be called Gaul by the Romans.
Cambodia named after invaders from India.
Northern England was invaded by an ancient warrior tribe from Ireland called the Twatts, but the name never stuck (well, not officially).
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I think some resorts will be worse affected than others without us. Obergurgl, for example, is a favourite of mine. When I was last there in Feb 2019 with Crystal I was speaking to the tour rep and she told me between them and Inghams and a couple of other T/O's that on average they take about 600 Brits to Obergurgl every Saturday. There are also several BA scheduled flights per day out of LHR & LGW. I've met lots of the habitual same hotel, same week for many years type of UK visitors on my holidays there.
I'm not sure what the bed capacity is there but I've a notion that Brits take a sizeable chunk of it. They will have a hole to fill if we can't go.
The other aspect is if broken habits. A lot of folks go back to a place because they know and like it enough that they're not prepared to risk a new place that they might not like as much. If that's forced on them and they find they like the new place just as much or more then Austria or maybe some states of Austria will just compound their losses.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
All this speculation is very interesting, the situation is that you can go. Up to 30 September the UK and a number of other countries need a COVID test which needs to no more than four days before you arrive, this is in place until 30 September .
Will Austria revise these rules who knows, will the English government change our rules in the coming weeks or months who knows .
My reference to the English government is that the other home nations set their own rules.
Think the Austrians are tough, look at Hungary for non EU folks, F1 are going there and its jail or large fines if you break the rules.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@AL9000,
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I wonder if there will be a flow away from N. America in favour of Alpine destinations?
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@tatmanstours, hope all those brits don’t decided to come to Austria
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@radar, most Brits go to France, and long may that continue. One thing’s for certain, the flows will be different this winter. Also I expect that more people may decide to drive, rather than fly. Car parking may become more of an issue.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@clarky999, who are these “people”? I suspect that there will continue to be a market for the renowned Austrian apres-ski parties, especially in outside bars where it is easier to maintain a safe distance.
Locals, and a lot of them! Not just regarding apres ski, but 'Massentourismus' in general. There's quite a strong feeling among many here that Tirol has sold out to tourism/overtourism a bit too much... And tbf, when you compare much of Tirol to the rest of Austria (particularly Oberösterreich and Steiermark, which I've been appreciating much more the past couple of years, but also Vorarlberg), they have a point. Obviously not just a Tirol thing - Hallstatt is much the same.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I reckon the austrian apres oompah is a bit of an age thing.This last few years ive noticed that the profile of the week holiday skiers is getting older( like me) and with a bit more disposable income like a more comfortable accomodation and lift system ,however this hasnt meant that the apres bit has declined in fact I would go so far to say that the apres from time of lift closure to time for dinner has become more vibrant if changing in emphasis and this is where the spending power is .Im not so sure there will be that much of a sea change or if it does alter the numbers going will decline . The numbers of younger folks is gradually getting smaller as a % of guests .It is becoming apparent to me that those of the older generation who are fit active and are of a mindset to crack on are starting to outnumber the younger new kids on the block, but then it could just be me ,( there seems plenty of older skiers but where are the older snowboarders) france doesnt float my boat ( dont like s/c nor the chalet holiday}italy other than the dolomites is pasta on snow switzerland is a tad !!overpriced !! so austria it is until the new normal kills it ,or me
After all it is free
After all it is free
Quote:
Locals
I suspected as much. Meanwhile the bar owners and holiday-makers will continue as normal - or as far as allowed.
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Decision on Apres Ski this season will be taken at National Level in the Fall (Oct/Nov)
Kurz has already promissed the situation that happenned in Ischgl
"Will not happen again"
This season Apres Ski will be highly regulated.....
Indoors...seated only
Outdoors..limited numbers to allow free lines for waiter service....
Music down..(imagine like xmas or ash wednesday or good friday)
Many joints will just not open next season....or they will only operate as restaurants..
I suspected as much. Meanwhile the bar owners and holiday-makers will continue as normal - or as far as allowed.
Well yeah, of course they will. Doesn't change the fact many won't be sorry if they can't, which is all I said.
Apologies if that observation has offended you
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Until there are effective vaccines the traditional apres ski model must be off the table - people shouting out songs while pissed in densely packed environments. Now that goes for the Chambre Neufs, Folie Douches, Yucatan Bars and GLCs of this world as well as the Moosers, Hinterhags etc.
Maybe some needs to be thinking more laterally - what about cordoning off a sports field or stade and having a socially distanced mini rave every afternoon.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@clarky999,
Quote:
Apologies if that observation has offended you
Of course not, why on earth should it? I’m as keen as anyone - probably keener than most - that Austria should adopt a safety first policy. It will also be interesting to see how it all pans out. All I was commenting on was the difference that I‘ve observed (and am currently observing) between what the locals say, and what those who have an interest in the more social side of the tourist industry, as providers or customers, say and do.
One thing is certain: firmly enforced rules will have to be introduced, as the current mentality seems to be that this particular area of the Alps is an oasis, where people can relax and take a holiday from pandemic precautions and restrictions.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Dave of the Marmottes, great idea your mini rave one - St Anton FC pitch as an example. They could utilise that surely, and set up water cannons to hose the place down after they’ve left because none of the lads ime know how to use a urinal based on how much they foul the streets. It’s long been a view of mine that the likes of MW and KK in Anton fill them up with alcohol to the point that the vast majority are completely off their faces and then they slide/ roll down to town to make a nuisance of themselves bringing the place a bad name and stinking the town out.....how can that be? I know it’s great for MM and his business but surely he’s a ski racer done well not above being answerable for what havoc he brings to the town after 7pm? Last 2-3 years have been bad. Needs sorting and this may sort it....
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
outside bars are great in march cant see them being a draw in the depths of jan.If as suggested above all sitting down inside on limited numbers after skiing the atmosphere will be lost, despite being in my 60s the thought of sitting in the hotel/accommodation siping cocoa does not inspire me to consider booking .
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@ski for fun,
Quote:
outside bars are great in march cant see them being a draw in the depths of jan
And yet the likes of the Goassstall, the Schwarzacher, the Spitzbub, Bauer’s Schialm, the Soul House - all outside bars with apres-ski entertainment, with heaters, attract people all season.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
yes I agree ,great fun in a crowd with the heaters and music but if all socially or rather anti socially distancing not so, all spread out table service no live entertainment cant see it being as much fun ,the local pub in my village is finding that the trade which has only been open a few days is dying off as the rules are ending the pub banter that most went in for , no standing at the bar no chit chat as its difficult when all 2 metres apart on seperate tables. and then the giving of your name and address just in case someone turns out to be infected a few days later and you could end up in isolation and no work etc is not helping
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Perhaps rather than bickering about whether apres ski partying is a good idea it would be better to wait to see who might actually be allowed access to the resorts in the first place......
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Markymark29, + 1. I was under the impression that this was a speculative conversation about what kind of apres-ski scene we might expect in a few months time - not “bickering”.
It’s currently at the forefront of my mind, as it’s become apparent that very few restrictions are now being enforced here in Saalbach. On the last two Saturdays we’ve attended very busy and convivial “apres-soleil” parties at the Spitzbub - each time getting on for 100 people in attendance. Live music is permitted outside until 10.30pm; after that many people piled into the small interior bar, (but apparently names and phone numbers had to be taken by the bar owners).
From my observations, people are hugging, kissing, shaking hands and conversing as normal. After living through the severe lockdown a couple of months ago, and becoming used to wearing masks and touching elbows as a greeting - even at one stage having our shopping done by volunteers and delivered to our door, the current laxity of precautions is a vaguely concerning contrast. Although the current infection rate is still very low, it only takes one incoming, infected tourist to set things off.
If things are carrying on pretty well as normal at this stage of the pandemic, one can easily imagine things getting out of hand in the winter.
In the last day or two I’ve chatted to people from the U.K., Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands. I spent most of today (Sunday) at a mountain restaurant, where a party got going in the evening - singing, dancing, etc. to all the usual apres-ski party songs. Again no distancing - people getting very friendly and hugging and shaking hands with complete strangers. Frankly it’s quite shocking to me to see how laid back most people hereabouts now seem to be; I don’t want to give the impression of being a killjoy, but I’m trying to be vigilant, minimising bodily contact, washing my hands after shaking hands, avoiding crowded spaces, and trying to steer Mrs TT in sensible and safe directions - not always easy when she’s had a Prosecco or two.
I can easily imagine it being like this in the winter, but obviously much can change, so we’ll see.
Incidentally we have more friends arriving in the next couple of weeks - two families driving down from the U.K., and a couple driving from Portugal.
Some of our British friends have just been on an excursion to Vienna and the Wachau wine region. They said that the only place where they suddenly and abruptly became aware that restrictive measures were being enforced was as they passed through the “Deutsche Ecke”, just south of Salzburg. Apparently in this corner of Germany, they were admonished for entering a service station shop without masks; but everywhere they went in Austria the atmosphere was very relaxed.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
It's noticeable from the TT (Tiroler Tageszeitung) feeds received that CV-19 infections are on the increase in Tirol.....perhaps then looking ever more unlikely that entry restrictions without test will be lifted, which renders in unlikely we will be going end August, i'm unwilling to spend 300€ for our tests and worst case have to leave it until last minute to let people down re our accommodation booked. Also the possibility of quarantine on re-entry to UK would make it impracticable, need to be at work, so perhaps need to accept that this summer is a no-go and move on and get something booked on the Scottish islands instead.
Anyone else in similar situation, what's your thoughts?
But Nicola Sturgeon said yesterday that its still possible that Scotland may put restrictions on the English crossing the border, so that may not end up being an option either.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
On the other thread, about Hintertux glacier skiing I think, a couple of weeks ago the fact that Jet2 flights from Manchester to Innsbruck were available starting July 15th. was seen as a promising sign. They do not come up in their schedule now, just a December start.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@jafa, in her dreams....
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@Markymark29, We are in a similar situation and have now decided to head to Garmisch-Partenkirchen instead. One worry I do have is about the easyjet flights I have booked. I am wondering if they may cancel the flight if only a few seats have been taken, that would turn into a total pita trying to get hire car and hotel deposited back. Also hotels in Gapa seem to be more expensive than Austria.
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
@tatmanstours, after a small spike in cases in Salzburg (34 in and around the city, 17 further afield), people noticeably seem a little more nervous today compared with the last couple of weeks. Many more people wearing masks and keeping their distance. I guess that's all it takes for people to remember that the risk hasn't really gone away.
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