 Poster: A snowHead
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Haha, this is just too much, so we can’t go to Andorra then
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| up4it wrote: |
| Haha, this is just too much, so we can’t go to Andorra then |
Too much?
Teens can still fly to Toulouse with vaccinated parents. I think most TOs do this but its normally cheaper in H/T to go via Barcelona.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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“now cannot have the second jab for 12 weeks so we are effectively goosed I guess?”
Did you log positive test with nhs? If so yes. I would never advocate breaking any rules but if they isolate then test negative then have vaccine then travel there’s no increased risk of spreading covid to anyone.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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No, didn’t log it with the NHS
The gap is for safety isn’t it?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Their own safety that is
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Obviously I’m only chancing he won’t get heart inflammation so I can have a holiday
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@up4it, Chances are tiny. If you worried about that, then you'd never let your kids walk to school in case they got hit by a car or climb trees in case they fell out. Or indeed, go skiing. We got our two their second jab last weekend but had made the decision not to log a positive with the NHS if they had got infected beforehand. The original reasons for not giving jabs within x weeks was to prioritise vaccinations to those who really needed them whilst we had limited supply, and stretch out protection from antibodies. No need to give someone with plenty of infection antibodies, even more of them from injections.
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Up4it, every other country I’ve heard of seems to be giving second jabs to teens after 3-4 weeks, and jabs after recovery at similar intervals. I like to think we’d have heard by now if there was a noticeable increased risk associated with that, especially from the US where they have given millions more jabs at much smaller intervals and are now happily jabbing under 12s in the same way.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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And don't forget that we have probably already jabbed hundreds of thousands of teenagers in the UK soon after them catching Covid, simply because so many of them will not have even known they were infected, and if there had been a health issue we'd have heard about it by now.
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| snowhound wrote: |
| @up4it, Chances are tiny. If you worried about that, then you'd never let your kids walk to school in case they got hit by a car or climb trees in case they fell out. Or indeed, go skiing. We got our two their second jab last weekend but had made the decision not to log a positive with the NHS if they had got infected beforehand. The original reasons for not giving jabs within x weeks was to prioritise vaccinations to those who really needed them whilst we had limited supply, and stretch out protection from antibodies. No need to give someone with plenty of infection antibodies, even more of them from injections. |
We've not had limited supply of vaccines at any point since we've started doing kids in the UK, none of the dosing timescales have resulted from vaccine supply issues they've been clinical decisions (whether they are right or wrong).
The myocarditis/pericarditis risks are indeed tiny, but there is data showing that they can be elevated by second doses, particularly in close proximity. https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj-2021-068665#:~:text=Conclusions%20Vaccination%20with%20mRNA%2D1273,significantly%20increased%20risk%20among%20women.
The key paragraph from this paper:
"Another explanation could be that the median time interval between first and second doses was longer in Denmark (median interval of five weeks for BNT162b2) than in Israel and the US (three week schedule) The longer interval between vaccinations in Denmark could dampen an immediate vaccine immune response. Finally, fewer Danish residents have tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 than residents in the other two countries,18 which might have led to fewer immune reactions, including myocarditis or pericarditis, owing to pre-existing immunity against SARS-CoV-2 (as described previously)"
I stress again- the risks are extremely small, but there IS a change in risk if you choose to put vaccines in close proximity, and it is thought that the mechanism of action will be similar for infection as for vaccination.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And the key words there are "could be" i.e. that's a hypothesis for further study, not proven through statistical peer reviewed conclusions from this paper/data. They are comparing 3 and 5 week gaps between doses, rather than the 12 we're having to wait for. Also it's not a comment on the impact of having one of those doses, whilst having asymptomatic covid. This last point being @Up4it 's point of concern.
As mentioned millions of kids around the world will have received a second dose whilst unknowingly positive for covid. If there had been significant spikes in cases of myocarditis caused by this, it would have been spotted and a policy of testing immediately prior to the second dose to catch people implemented. I'm sure I read the risk of myocarditis is far far greater from contracting covid than it is from the vaccine (in addition to the point made above regarding ski/flight/driving risks).
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Thu 20-01-22 9:43; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@snowdave, But we have had limited capacity-nurses, booking slots, venues-to deliver it. Risks to everything in life but myocarditis seems tiny and temporary, compared to the risks teenagers take every day as part of every day life.
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In terms of timing, the JVCI state that the gap can be lessened to between 8 and 12 weeks in cases of new variant or spike in figures. My son is at 11 weeks post first jab now and I might take him to a walk in clinic and see what happens. My argument is that face masks are about to be done away with at school and the virus is circulating so I want him protected.
I read about some American doctors (their kids have the jabs in quick succession) and their view was to wait 8 weeks even though they could do it earlier. Trouble is whether any clinics will allow it - can but try.
With regard to jab after infection, I've read many comments from people who have left it 28 days after infection. The key thing is to isolate but not report the positive case to the NHS.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Kettonskimum1971, Agreed, final sentence. And leave the jab until as late as possible post infection but still in sufficient time to go skiing!!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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And allow time to request your NHS paper doc to confirm the two jabs and QR code (up to 7 days to receive after requested)
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Kettonskimum1971 wrote: |
In terms of timing, the JVCI state that the gap can be lessened to between 8 and 12 weeks in cases of new variant or spike in figures. My son is at 11 weeks post first jab now and I might take him to a walk in clinic and see what happens. My argument is that face masks are about to be done away with at school and the virus is circulating so I want him protected.
I read about some American doctors (their kids have the jabs in quick succession) and their view was to wait 8 weeks even though they could do it earlier. Trouble is whether any clinics will allow it - can but try.
With regard to jab after infection, I've read many comments from people who have left it 28 days after infection. The key thing is to isolate but not report the positive case to the NHS. |
a walk in centre will gladly provide a 2nd jab after 11 weeks have passed from the first dose, our daughter was 11 weeks and 3 days when she had her 2nd
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| up4it wrote: |
| Obviously I’m only chancing he won’t get heart inflammation so I can have a holiday |
i would recommend talking this through with your GP or qualified vaccine administer rather than listen to advice from the non medically trained people on here - it is your child's health after all
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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The qualified vaccine administrator won’t give a child a second vaccine if he/she has only has only just recovered
I can see the risks are tiny but to those advocating taking it, are you discussing it with your teenager beforehand or pressing on to save the holiday?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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It is a minefield. Kids originally could have their second jab after 4 weeks. Kids with vulnerabilities can have theirs after 8 weeks. No end of kids would have had a jab having had Covid or just had Covid but never knew.
I know kids who had a jab and then caught Covid within a week of the jab (which throws up a whole can of worms as to why then you can't give a jab once recovered as it's the same situation but in reverse).
But, we're abiding to current rules. Current rules also state go back to work and don't wear masks but not everyone agrees with them. If Omicron had gone the other way (really bad) then kids may have gotten second jabbed sooner.
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@CV, - can you link where you apply for the covid pass letter online please - I can't seem to find it and my gp surgery receptionist tells me they are too busy to help with this... I have tried to find it but searches come up with nada - I am a self confessed numpty when it comes to the digital era but would be v grateful for a point in the right direction - 14yo gets 2nd jab on Saturday and we need to be ship-shape for half term.... thanks
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@MHskier, thank you so much 
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| sarahklt wrote: |
| @CV, - can you link where you apply for the covid pass letter online please - I can't seem to find it and my gp surgery receptionist tells me they are too busy to help with this... I have tried to find it but searches come up with nada - I am a self confessed numpty when it comes to the digital era but would be v grateful for a point in the right direction - 14yo gets 2nd jab on Saturday and we need to be ship-shape for half term.... thanks |
don't order it too early as only valid for 30 days from the time it is printed
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@andmelffion, ooh thanks for that too
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I don't know how to add a screenshot, but my wife has just sent me a copy of a letter from the Department of health that says that as of 3rd February, teenagers from 12-15 will be able to get direct access to the NHS app and will be able to show their Covid history (including recoveries and vaccines). I'll see if I can upload it.
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The relevant paragraph is
'In addition, we have continued to develop digital options to faciliate travel for eligible children. From 3 February, 12-15 year olds will be able to use the NHS app www.nhs.uk to access their NHS Covid pass. This will include their Covid vaccinations, and evidence of natural immunity if they have tested positive less than 180 days prior to travel"
it's from Maggie Throup
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You know it makes sense.
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JCVI advice on the interval of 12 weeks for 12-15 year olds is explicitly because of the need to prioritise vaccinations for older age groups. It is not because of any perceived difference in risk from the vaccine between an interval of 8 weeks or 12 weeks.
For 12-15 year olds "The interval may be reduced to at least 8 weeks between doses if the emerging epidemiological data supports this (and those aged 16 to 17 may also be offered their second dose with an interval of at least 8 weeks)."
"The overall intention of the measures advised above is to accelerate the deployment of COVID-19 vaccines before the peak of any impending Omicron wave.......Persons of older age, or who are in COVID-19 at-risk groups are likely to remain at higher risk from serious COVID-19; therefore, vaccination should be prioritised accordingly."
I do not see any problem with anyone arguing to have their child vaccinated after an interval of 8 weeks, the only reason current approach is to wait 12 weeks is to free up capacity to boost older age groups. And to be clear the capacity s more limited by resource (people) that availability of vaccine, and frankly even that is less of a constraint now.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| The_Gate wrote: |
The relevant paragraph is
'In addition, we have continued to develop digital options to faciliate travel for eligible children. From 3 February, 12-15 year olds will be able to use the NHS app www.nhs.uk to access their NHS Covid pass. This will include their Covid vaccinations, and evidence of natural immunity if they have tested positive less than 180 days prior to travel"
it's from Maggie Throup |
If that comes good, that's fantastic news!!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Think I am still going to request it via 119 for half term week
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@The_Gate, thanks, think I am - like NickyJ - going to request as well as soon as the 5 days are up.... 3rd feb sounds very close to half term to take any risks. We were in the Arlberg last week (children free!) and was simplest to whip out the paper evidence each time it was asked for rather than fiddling with the app....and I will probably print it a few times as I can imagine the bits of paper going the same way as errant gloves, snoods, socks.....
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| wibble44 wrote: |
| The_Gate wrote: |
The relevant paragraph is
'In addition, we have continued to develop digital options to faciliate travel for eligible children. From 3 February, 12-15 year olds will be able to use the NHS app www.nhs.uk to access their NHS Covid pass. This will include their Covid vaccinations, and evidence of natural immunity if they have tested positive less than 180 days prior to travel"
it's from Maggie Throup |
If that comes good, that's fantastic news!! |
+1 from me!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| sarahklt wrote: |
| @The_Gate, thanks, think I am - like NickyJ - going to request as well as soon as the 5 days are up.... 3rd feb sounds very close to half term to take any risks. We were in the Arlberg last week (children free!) and was simplest to whip out the paper evidence each time it was asked for rather than fiddling with the app....and I will probably print it a few times as I can imagine the bits of paper going the same way as errant gloves, snoods, socks..... |
you don't neccessarily need to wait the 5 days - our daughter's second jab was at 5.30 on a Thursday evening any by 6 am on the Friday her records were already showing she had had the 2nd dose so dependong on your timescales you may be able to ring 119 to order the letter the day after your child has had the 2nd jab taking into account the 30 day validity obviously
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| The_Gate wrote: |
The relevant paragraph is
'In addition, we have continued to develop digital options to faciliate travel for eligible children. From 3 February, 12-15 year olds will be able to use the NHS app www.nhs.uk to access their NHS Covid pass. This will include their Covid vaccinations, and evidence of natural immunity if they have tested positive less than 180 days prior to travel"
it's from Maggie Throup |
This could help me with the minefield of testing in France - does anyone know for a pass sanitaire for a 14 year old if 1 vaccination jab and recovery from Covid (+ve at Xmas) will qualify them to get the pass ?
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I suspect they will introduce the same system in England as Scotland already have, where you can download their vaccine cert directly from the web rather than waiting for it to be posted. I don't think this includes a QR code for proof of recovery yet so interested to see what they do.
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| Vessigaud wrote: |
| The_Gate wrote: |
The relevant paragraph is
'In addition, we have continued to develop digital options to faciliate travel for eligible children. From 3 February, 12-15 year olds will be able to use the NHS app www.nhs.uk to access their NHS Covid pass. This will include their Covid vaccinations, and evidence of natural immunity if they have tested positive less than 180 days prior to travel"
it's from Maggie Throup |
This could help me with the minefield of testing in France - does anyone know for a pass sanitaire for a 14 year old if 1 vaccination jab and recovery from Covid (+ve at Xmas) will qualify them to get the pass ? |
There's a thread here discussing the current Pass Sanitaire requirements and the potential imminent changes to them:
https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=158101
The link in the first post is to the French government site explaining the requirements.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| zikomo wrote: |
JCVI advice on the interval of 12 weeks for 12-15 year olds is explicitly because of the need to prioritise vaccinations for older age groups. It is not because of any perceived difference in risk from the vaccine between an interval of 8 weeks or 12 weeks.
For 12-15 year olds "The interval may be reduced to at least 8 weeks between doses if the emerging epidemiological data supports this (and those aged 16 to 17 may also be offered their second dose with an interval of at least 8 weeks)."
"The overall intention of the measures advised above is to accelerate the deployment of COVID-19 vaccines before the peak of any impending Omicron wave.......Persons of older age, or who are in COVID-19 at-risk groups are likely to remain at higher risk from serious COVID-19; therefore, vaccination should be prioritised accordingly."
I do not see any problem with anyone arguing to have their child vaccinated after an interval of 8 weeks, the only reason current approach is to wait 12 weeks is to free up capacity to boost older age groups. And to be clear the capacity s more limited by resource (people) that availability of vaccine, and frankly even that is less of a constraint now. |
Son had 1st jab last Saturday, the official paperwork on the vaccine actually states a gap i recall of 4 weeks, but as said the guidance has been continually changed, and given that at least where we are in the NE the session he went to was strictly for 12-15 year olds.. and there was no one there on a Saturday afternoon…so resource to administer is possibly less of an issue. Looking at for example the gap applied in rest of Europe for this age group is shorter than ours. I also see the french now driving to 5 years up, and 12+ for a booster (god help us all if that’s mandated by rhe senat with this new law!)
Ps great news ref the access to app for 12+ fingers and toes crossed - as still finding it a nightmare with our unhelpful GP surgery
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I have emailed (in French) the local pharmacy to me in the French Alps for our holiday. They will issue my son with a Pass sanitaire/vaccine pass for 36 Euros. My 12 year old son has had one vaccination and he has also had Covid. We have details of the jab from the GP and a letter saying he has had Covid and recovered, we have the positive PCR test result and another LFT test proving recovery. I will be emailing them the documents and collecting the pass in resort. If you have not already done so email your local pharmacies. If we can get a QR code from the NHS app then brilliant and that will simplify things, but if not you could be able to a pass from the local pharmacy.
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FAQ
) we're going to try a walk in centre again tomorrow evening - different one - at 11 weeks and 2 days. Again it will be a v polite request at non peak time and if it doesn't happen c'est la vie.
