 Poster: A snowHead
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| red 27 wrote: |
| bart_bdv, you are Hercule Poirot and I claim my 5€ |
Hehe sorry I don't completely understand. I'm a Belgian yes, but why do you claim €5?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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rob@rar, Boywonder is in VT all of this week. No skiing today as lifts closed. I'll get it straight from the horses mouth tomorrow exactly what conditions are like.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Ignore me bart, a silly english joke... newspapers used to run a competition in summer with a £5 prize the the reader who could identify their staff repoerter on a busy seaside resort promeande by approaching him and say "you are whatever-his-name-was and I claim my £5"
Back on topic, do you think "disaster" might be a little too strong a word to describe a windy day in Val Thorens? Please thank your friend for her lovely description of the branches falling on the wooded runs - most poetic! 
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| red 27 wrote: |
Ignore me bart, a silly english joke... newspapers used to run a competition in summer with a £5 prize the the reader who could identify their staff repoerter on a busy seaside resort promeande by approaching him and say "you are whatever-his-name-was and I claim my £5"
Back on topic, do you think "disaster" might be a little too strong a word to describe a windy day in Val Thorens? Please thank your friend for her lovely description of the branches falling on the wooded runs - most poetic! |
Well if one day you have beautiful slopes full of powder and the next it is all blown away (off piste at least), the word disaster immediately comes to my mind. Maybe a bit too drastic, skiing will still be possible without problem, but it still feels like a shame...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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bart_bdv, Yes I see what you mean - a disaster for your friend hoping for more off-piste, not a big deal for piste-skiers like me who go over there in 4 weeks time! 
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| Quote: |
Yes I see what you mean - a disaster for your friend hoping for more off-piste, not a big deal for piste-skiers like me who go over there in 4 weeks time!
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I'd be more worried about the hairdryer developing in the next few weeks if I was you. 
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| red 27 wrote: |
| bart_bdv, Yes I see what you mean - a disaster for your friend hoping for more off-piste, not a big deal for piste-skiers like me who go over there in 4 weeks time! |
No not a disastre for piste skiers. Im sure the piste bashers and snow cannons will assure that pistes will be ok. The piste conditions in 4 weeks time will any way depend more what happens the week before you go there (fresh snow or not)
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bwg, bart_bdv, Thanks guys - all good, no worries really it's the best start to the season in my memory. Foehns will come and go like always, but at least we have a base. 2 years ago the PdS was closed until Jan 12th as they hadn't had a flake!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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red 27, how true, friends in Serre Chevalier (where we were skiing), were getting texts from friends in Les Gets, and not very happy ones either.
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But this wasn't a foehn, was it? That's for later....maybe.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Helen Beaumont, Yes, I still shudder at the thought - we were booked in Morzine. Had a cracking 4 days in the end but it was a close one.
pam w, Yes this was a violent Foehn today according to Meteo France 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I'd evidently misunderstood then, as the forecast was for quite a bit of snow, as well as the wind - I thought foehn winds were always dry. You live and learn. What I don't understand at all, looking at snow-forecast for Val Thorens (I have a niece out there at the moment, hence my interest) is that at the end of the week/weekend the freezing level is said to be 2500 metres, but the MAXIMUM temperatures at 2300m minus 12.  How does that come about? There's very little wind in the forecast.
http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Val-Thorens/9day/bot
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| Quote: |
the freezing level is said to be 2500 metres, but the MAXIMUM temperatures at 2300m minus 12. How does that come about? There's very little wind in the forecast.
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I would assume that's because a low level inversion develops as high pressure builds, and by the end of the week the upper air temps across the alps look likely to be quite warm.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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pam w, Ha! the answer is in the website - surely your time on the the weather thread with Brian and Carled has taught you not to look at snow-outcast.com? 
frosty you may need to translate 'cack' into Flemish
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Poster: A snowHead
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red 27, No, I treat it (especially 9 days!) as just another source of infotainment. However my own observations over 6 seasons suggest that so long as you realise it's just a computer generated forecast, ignore the quantities of snow forecast and just look at the consistency, and a general trend, it's quite useful. The detailed 2 day forecast is a good planning tool and it's rarely way out at over that timescale. I'd be interested to know, though, how the model (and, say what you like, computers don't get their sums wrong) generates those numbers. bwg, an inversion would produce lower temperatures in the valley than higher up - but how can a freezing level of 2500m equate with a maximum temperature of minus 12 at the same altitude (and no wind to speak of).
I don't think the answer is "in the website" - I expect that there's a perfectly sensible explanation, it's just that I don't know what it is.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
bwg, an inversion would produce lower temperatures in the valley than higher up - but how can a freezing level of 2500m equate with a maximum temperature of minus 12 at the same altitude (and no wind to speak of).
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The GFS output is tiled, and for each tile there is I think no concept of valleys and peaks, so the inversion would apply evenly across the tile. I'm not 100% sure that this is what is going on, but the GFS forecasts I produce show a similar effect.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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pam w, This is what it says on snow-forecast.com about why feezing levels and temps being out of sync
"Somethimes the free-air freezing level can be at 2000m but at 0m it can still get below freezing at night without cooling a 2000m column of air (there simply isn't time). Free-air FL's are stable and, critically, it is the free-air FL that determines if snow or rain will fall."
Not sure how that works during the day though??
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| pam w wrote: |
red 27, No, I treat it (especially 9 days!) as just another source of infotainment. However my own observations over 6 seasons suggest that so long as you realise it's just a computer generated forecast, ignore the quantities of snow forecast and just look at the consistency, and a general trend, it's quite useful. The detailed 2 day forecast is a good planning tool and it's rarely way out at over that timescale. I'd be interested to know, though, how the model (and, say what you like, computers don't get their sums wrong) generates those numbers. bwg, an inversion would produce lower temperatures in the valley than higher up - but how can a freezing level of 2500m equate with a maximum temperature of minus 12 at the same altitude (and no wind to speak of).
I don't think the answer is "in the website" - I expect that there's a perfectly sensible explanation, it's just that I don't know what it is. |
Snow forecast is based on just 1 model, namely GFS. It's an Amrican model and not so fantastic for predicting snow quantities in the European alps... If I remember well the quantities there are modeled for 3000m, which is not the same as at 1000m...
There are also a lot of bugs in the automatic interpretation of GFS (what snow forecast does), so don't be surprised of wierd results like maximum of -12 at 2500m, with a freezing level at 2500
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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May I suggest migrating this interesting discussion to the Weather Outlook thread where I'm sure others will be able to assist?
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| bwg wrote: |
| Quote: |
bwg, an inversion would produce lower temperatures in the valley than higher up - but how can a freezing level of 2500m equate with a maximum temperature of minus 12 at the same altitude (and no wind to speak of).
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The GFS output is tiled, and for each tile there is I think no concept of valleys and peaks, so the inversion would apply evenly across the tile. I'm not 100% sure that this is what is going on, but the GFS forecasts I produce show a similar effect. |
You're approximately right. Anyway don't worry inversions mid-december are no problem for the snowpack. the sun is too low and doesn't shine long enough to to have a big impact (unlike march-april)
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skiing sucked today in the meribel valley, most lifts shut due to high winds at altitude... snow great lower down but little lift access
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Well the wind has lifted in VT, still fairly windy above 3000m, and still a little overcast, but certainly an improvement on yesterday. Pistes seem to be in very good shape, the odd bare patch here and there but there are plenty of snow drifts to sort those out. (These really are few and far between). Off Piste looks really stripped, lots and lots of exposed rocks...
Took quite a while to get the lifts running this morning, so some pretty bad queues, which have lessoned a bit now. Still not the usual compliment of lifts running, and 3V link is currently closed.
A lot of blasting this morning, especially on the Westerly aspects of Peclet (delayed opening of the Peclet Gondola), not surprising really...
I wonder how Corch and Meribel faired? I really don’t think this has been the disaster that *some* feared!!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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After my coffee break and post this morning, I headed back out with the intention of skinning up something, anything, yesterdays storm kept me off the mountains all day, and I wanted to get away from the masses. (Some pistes were like a human slalom, but the gates were moving all the time!)
Skinned up Mont Du Fond which gave me a great overview of VT and Le Men. VT doesn’t look so bad from that height; the areas that look like they have really suffered are Caron, Mont Brequin, La Masse and above Le Men (on the VT side of the valley). Saying this, the pistes are in fine condition and those that I have covered this afternoon have all been great. Not all of the off-piste is ruined; some sheltered areas certainly seem to have caught the windblown snow.
Typically just as I arrived at the top of Du Fond, they opened the Funitel! I did think it was a little windy up there for the masses, and the weather beacon reports the wind speed at over 17m/s (about 60km/h I think)! The wind has also started to build up in the resort again…
On a cheery note, looks like there is going to be another firework display tonight (there was one for the Ox-Bridge Varsity last week), as I saw a guy setting up just below the Knife & Fork this afternoon….
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skied courch today and all the couliors were almost stripped of snow due to the high winds yesterday. upper pistes were difficult with windslab, loose powder and some sastrugi on sides. small avalanche on the side of combe saulier although risk only 3 looked hairy to me in lots of places.
pistes not as good as yesterday due to wind loading and drifting but still v good for this time of year
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You know it makes sense.
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Hurtle, snow which looks like frozen ripples in water. Formed by wind blowing along the surface of the snow, leaving a wind crust wave pattern. Not nice to ski on.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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rob@rar, thank you. 'spect skimottaret will lob that into the Glossary!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Pretty much the same here in Les Men,
All the links and upper lifts shut all day,The wind last night moved a lot of the snow about.
La Masse was open all day to the mid station and there was some off piste which was ok if you knew where to look.
Thought about skinning up from the mid station to the summit and decending via the Lou valley but was talked out of it as would have been alone 
Anyway lets hope it's better tomorrow !
Regards Mark
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Rob@ar. I hate to admit but I was right yesterday. A meter of fresh at Val d'isere and almost nothing at 3V. Another 80 cm tomorrow and almost nothing for 3V. Maybe a bit more on wednesday but after that dry weather for some time. I wanted to go to 3V in January, I think Im gonna rebook it to val d'isere...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| bart_bdv wrote: |
| Rob@ar. I hate to admit but I was right yesterday. A meter of fresh at Val d'isere and almost nothing at 3V. Another 80 cm tomorrow and almost nothing for 3V. Maybe a bit more on wednesday but after that dry weather for some time. I wanted to go to 3V in January, I think Im gonna rebook it to val d'isere... |
So the season is over in the 3V then?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| bart_bdv wrote: |
| Rob@ar. I hate to admit but I was right yesterday. A meter of fresh at Val d'isere and almost nothing at 3V. Another 80 cm tomorrow and almost nothing for 3V. Maybe a bit more on wednesday but after that dry weather for some time. I wanted to go to 3V in January, I think Im gonna rebook it to val d'isere... |
So the season is over in the 3V then? |
Haha no it's not, just being a bit pessimistic, I'll get over it!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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bart_bdv,
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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It's a shame that the off piste chaps had such a bad time with the absence of snow - it was all on the pistes  Along with the entire population of VT curtailed to just the low level runs in all but a few places. By mid morning Deux lacs, Plein Sud, Moutiere, Portette (surprisingly), Cascades, Caron, and finally funitel peclet opened, but Tete Rond and Christine were closed leaving the only option as the Beranger (Which looked  from the lift) or Lac Blanc reds (something we didn't discover until you were up there! Still it's another red under my belt Lac Blanc was however, damn windy right at the top (rather like that wind in the video of Les Menuires on the other thread).
Snow coverage on the pistes was good (with the odd snowdrift to catch the unwary skier (me) out) BMF_Skier reckoned that I resembled a snowy version of meerkat emerging - hope no-one saw me  The skiing and snow, where it was, was v.good - if crowded, with that lovely 'crunchy' sensation as it compressed under the skis.
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News from Boywonder in VT. Winds have dropped, loads of snow, visibility improving, but links still closed.
Anybody out there look for a huge Royal Navy White Ensign on the slopes and you'll find him
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FAQ
