 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Misused apostrophe?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Ryan Personal Accident is not generally a big deal but nice to have. Personal Liability is the important one if someone decides to sue you for losses following an accident. Your home insurance may provide some cover but you might find it very limited when on holiday.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Understood and thats what I was clarifying - I (and I think others) had originally understood that as no medical cover in 'funparks'.
So as long as I don't land on some numpty stood/sat in a landing I would be OK. On second thoughts thats by no means a given....
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I noticed that the Ski Club was advertising their insurance in the Metro today with a 10% discount with the code Metro10 (i think...) if anyone is interested in that kind of thing.
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@Richard_Sideways, nice one, thanks, might actually pull the trigger on that one.
At the moment it's between the SCGB and 247 travel insurance who's offer seems really great.
The only thing which is stopping me from going with them is that no-one seems to have claimed form them yet?
We don't really know what kind of pudding they would turn out to be, until someone (unfortunately) actually eats it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Layne, I find it hard to take any company seriously if they can't use an apostrophe correctly in important documents.
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247 is PJ Hayman, the previous SCGB insurers.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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PRE EXISTING MEDICAL CONDITIONS
For anyone who is struggling to get cover for pre-existing medical conditions at a decent price, I recommend taking a look at www.eurotunnel.com/uk/traveller-info/insurance/. Their standard winter sports travel insurance is by no means the cheapest, but you are covered for most pre-existing conditions (with no extra premium and no need to disclose). They only exclude cover if (a) you are unfit to travel (in which case, you are unlikely to want to go skiing) or (b) you have an unstable medical condition or (c) you have been diagnosed with a terminal illness.
They cost just over £100 for annual cover for a family of four, and I'm willing to pay this because it is the only travel insurance policy I have ever read where I feel confident that I don't need to disclose any elements of my medical history and I won't get whacked with a big extra premium. (I was once told that it would be an extra £80, just because I have high cholesterol, despite there being no symptoms of any actual cardiac problems!.) The exclusions are unambiguous and based on the current situation, not medical history that I might have forgotten, so I can feel confident there's nothing that could provide an excuse for the insurance company to wriggle out of a claim.
You do not need a Eurotunnel ticket. Their call centre will happily sell you insurance without even asking whether you are a Eurotunnel customer.
The Winter sports add-on covers up to 17 days. Re off piste, it covers skiing within the ski area boundaries of a recognised ski resort and following ski patrol guidelines. They will cover Mountain search and rescue services when deemed medically necessary.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Thanks everyone for this very helpful thread. I took out annual insurance with Ski Club last September but after having a very minor TIA (mini-stroke) in December I am told that I am no longer covered for what is now a "pre-existing condition". They will refund 50% of the premium if I cancel the policy. I have already booked an off-piste holiday so now I have to shop around again for a policy that will cover me. Or I take the risk myself. Or do you think I have a legitimate claim for cancelling the holiday as a result of illness? Presumably I would need a doctor's letter stating that I should not go skiing. I doubt if the insurers would accept that their withdrawal of cover is an adequate justification for cancelling the holiday. The holiday was booked with Ski Club on condition that I have insurance at least as good as the Ski club policy, which turns out not to be as good as I had hoped.
So far I have found only one insurer (Freedom Insurance, underwritten by Axa) prepared to offer cover but the premium is more than double what I paid for my current policy and hill walking is covered only up to 2500m. ( I squeezed the Ski Club up to 3000m). Snowcard wouldn't cover me at all. I'm continuing to search.
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So if I read this right you booked a Ski Club holiday and purchased Ski Club insurance. It is a condition of the holiday booking that you have insurance at least as good as the Ski Club policy but they have now withdrawn cover for a condition which has arisen since you booked. So you can no longer comply with the condition of the booking of having cover at least as good as the Ski Clubs policy because they have withdrawn cover for a certain condition and comparable alternative cover is not available (in particular the altitude limit may be particularly important on an off piste holiday in Europe where in several resorts the lifts go way up to and over 3000m). I think I would go back to the Ski Club direct and tell them that you wish for a full refund of the holiday price or an extension to the insurance policy to cover this pre-existing condition at no more than a modest financial uplift. I would copy this to the insurers as well as writing direct to the Ski Club. There is a lot of wriggling here which ill behoves the reputation of the insurers and indeed the Ski Club if they support the insurers stance. I think it outrageous that the Club would stipulate a specific level of insurance cover as a condition of booking and then allow their insurers to withdraw cover for a specific condition which has occurred since you booked the holiday and purchased the cover.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Jehu, As @FFIRMIN, says, it seems a bit rich that you are covered by SCGB insurance until something goes wrong!
I had a similar health problem to yours and got covered by Staysure. It covers off-piste skiing with a guide - not that I venture off-piste myself. Not cheap - about £120 for an annual policy, but better than not skiing. Since then, i have had more serious problems but they still cover me.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| tangowaggon wrote: |
With previous annual policies, I have never told the insurance when I am going (not sure if you are meant to?) so, if you have already been skiing up to the limit (24 days in this case) without a claim, then have another trip and have a claim, how will the insurance know that you have already been away?.
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Now that's an interesting question...
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Poster: A snowHead
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@FFIRMIN , Just to clarify, there is no height limit for skiing - just for mountain walking, which we do in the summer. It is somewhat bizarre that insurers think it is more risky for me to be walking in summer over 3000m than skiing in winter in exactly the same place. Maybe it's because rescue could take a lot longer in the summer?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It's not worth risking lying to insurers. If as part of the claims process they asked how many days skiing you had had during the policy year and you lied ( and they subsequently found out) then at best your claim could be declined and at worst you could be charged with insurance fraud ending up on the Insurance Fraud Register with all sorts of repercussions..
Might sound boring but utmost good faith applies.
Insurance fraud costs us all on average £50 a year and in 2014 130,000 cases were uncovered
Dont do it and let me have my £50 back which will buy a few lunches in some lovely mountain huts
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| koru wrote: |
PRE EXISTING MEDICAL CONDITIONS
For anyone who is struggling to get cover for pre-existing medical conditions at a decent price, I recommend taking a look at www.eurotunnel.com/uk/traveller-info/insurance/. Their standard winter sports travel insurance is by no means the cheapest, but you are covered for most pre-existing conditions (with no extra premium and no need to disclose). They only exclude cover if (a) you are unfit to travel (in which case, you are unlikely to want to go skiing) or (b) you have an unstable medical condition or (c) you have been diagnosed with a terminal illness.
They cost just over £100 for annual cover for a family of four, and I'm willing to pay this because it is the only travel insurance policy I have ever read where I feel confident that I don't need to disclose any elements of my medical history and I won't get whacked with a big extra premium. (I was once told that it would be an extra £80, just because I have high cholesterol, despite there being no symptoms of any actual cardiac problems!.) The exclusions are unambiguous and based on the current situation, not medical history that I might have forgotten, so I can feel confident there's nothing that could provide an excuse for the insurance company to wriggle out of a claim.
You do not need a Eurotunnel ticket. Their call centre will happily sell you insurance without even asking whether you are a Eurotunnel customer.
The Winter sports add-on covers up to 17 days. Re off piste, it covers skiing within the ski area boundaries of a recognised ski resort and following ski patrol guidelines. They will cover Mountain search and rescue services when deemed medically necessary. |
It's interesting that the policy is underwritten by Allianz and their own policy has the following statement:
Exclusions relating to your health
1 You will not be covered for any directly or indirectly related claims (see note at the end of this section) arising from
the following if at the time of taking out this insurance or booking your journey (whichever is later), you:
a are being prescribed regular medication;
b have received treatment for or had a consultation with a doctor or hospital specialist for any medical condition
in the past 12 months;
c are being referred to, treated by or under the care of a doctor or a hospital specialist;
d are awaiting treatment or the results of any tests or investigations.
2 You will not be covered if you travel against the advice of a doctor or where you would have been advised not to
travel if you had sought their advice before beginning your journey.
3 You will not be covered if you know you will need medical treatment or consultation at any medical facility during
your journey.
4 You will not be covered for any directly or indirectly related claim if, before your journey, a doctor diagnosed that
you have a terminal condition.
5 You will not be covered if you were waiting for medical treatment or consultation at any medical facility or were
under investigation for a medical condition when your policy was issued.
6 You will not be covered if you are travelling specifically for the purpose of obtaining and / or receiving any elective
surgery, procedure or hospital treatment
Seems more restrictions apply which worries me slightly, but it is good value.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Jehu, personally if I'd had a tia 1 month ago I wouldn't go anywhere near altitude where there is less oxygen and physical exertion at even the most basic level is more strenuous than normal. Bear in mind that there is quite a lot of increased risk of a stroke if you've had a tia and the potential consequences of that , and I'd just let skiing wait until next season.
I am quite surprised a doctor will sign off a ski trip under these circumstances.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Point taken about the fact it is walking rather than skiing at altitude which is a point made by someone else on here. I note that the Ski Club policy covers just this point on page 8 where it says that the insurer, if advised of a medical issue after the policy is issued may decline to cover that condition, withdraw cover, amend terms or seek additional premium. This is at odds with the Ski Club holiay booking requirement and you are caught between the stones. Since alternative insurance is available from another insurer albeit at a much higher premium I think at very least the Ski Club insurer should refund 100% of the premium already paid due to its link with the Ski Club as holiday provider. Alternatively and as Digger the dinosaur says above personally I would be seeking a letter from doctor to say that it would be unwise for me to ski this season for the reasons set out by Digger. This is especially so since you have said this is an off piste holiday which is likely to involve some walking up hill and clambering over rocks at altitude (Ski Club off piste holidays nearly always do!). On this basis it is not the withdrawal of cover for the relevant condition which has brought about the cancellation but the condition itself. I would be pretty certain no medic would endorse the idea of you undertaking strenous high mountain activity during the forthcoming season. I think the answer to your question - should you take the risk yourself - has to be no and on that basis alone if not willing to take the risk yourself then you know the answer to why you should not go at all so soon after the TIA. If you give yourself a full season without going up to significant altitude without any recurrence of the TIA you will likely find that next year you will be able to get affordable cover once again. Let us know what you decide to do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Oh dear, I had assumed exercise would be good for preventing strokes! I'll see what the specialist says on Monday. 
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I think exercise per se is good but it is the altitude issue which is the potential risk factor. All the best with your decision making but dont let the Ski Club or their insurers brow beat you!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The cancellation of the policy without refund of premium would not be as draconian as it sounds since you have made a claim for cancellation of the holiday so the full premium would be due in the light of the [cancellation] benefit paid out. The upside is that your wife has cover for the year. Personally I think the policy wording and the way the insurer is applying it is outrageous and this is speaking as someone who was a lawyer within the insurance industry. The policy wording allows for very significant wriggling by the insurer in the event of an insured suffering a medical condition after the policy is bought but before the insured goes on holiday. The very purpose of travel insurance (or indeed any insurance at all) is to provide a measure of comfort against the risk of a range of events occurring. You pay your premium for that peace of mind but when you do suffer an illness which may affect your enjoyment of or even ability to go on a specific holiday they then decline cover for that condition shifting the worry back on to the individual if they choose to proceed without cover for the condition or requiring them to get alternative cover elsewhere but without a concomitant refund of premium from the first insurer. As an American would say "this sucks".
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LV= have a policy which clearly states that "Once you have purchased cover you don’t need to tell us of any changes to any insured
person’s medical health during the period of cover. This includes if a medical condition or any symptoms develop after your policy was issued or if a pre-existing condition you’ve told us about changes in any way. "
I wish I had bought their policy! It also explicitly covers "mountain search and rescue" which I had to seek written confirmation was covered by Ski Club. I will now be writing to them again! Cruises are automatically included by LV=, but excluded by Ski Club. Caveat emptor!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Jehu wrote: |
LV= have a policy which clearly states that "Once you have purchased cover you don’t need to tell us of any changes to any insured
person’s medical health during the period of cover. This includes if a medical condition or any symptoms develop after your policy was issued or if a pre-existing condition you’ve told us about changes in any way. " |
That's a good feature. On the other hand, their definition of pre-existing medical conditions is typical of most policies and illustrates why I prefer Eurotunnel:
"If at any point in the life of anyone to be insured they’ve suffered from:
* a heart condition
* a breathing condition such as asthma
* a circulatory condition such as strokes or high blood pressure
* a gastrointestinal or digestive tract problem
* a bone or joint condition
* any form or type of cancer"
Some of those are very wide.
Any breathing condition, at any time in your life? Forget that you had mild asthma when you were a kid and they might say you aren't covered.
Any circulatory condition? What if you have high cholesterol, but you don't disclose it because there are no actual signs of it doing any harm and it isn't itself an illness? But the insurer disagrees? Or what if you once fainted 30 years ago and they argue this was a sign of high blood pressure?
Any gastrointestinal problem? So, do you have to tell them about every time in your life that you got the trots, or about that funny pain you had in your tummy for a couple of days, a few years ago?
Bone/joint conditions. So, do you have to tell them that your knees occasionally ache?
Very few of us are so healthy that a list like this would not require the disclosure of lots of minor ailments. If you don't disclose, or you forget some from 30 years ago, could it mean the insurer can wiggle out of a claim? Not in every case, I'm sure. Perhaps some of those things don't need to be disclosed, but who knows? I prefer to be sure I'm fully covered. So I prefer a policy wording that has a much narrower and clearer-defined exclusion and does not require me to remember 50 years of medical history.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| tarrantd wrote: |
It's interesting that the policy is underwritten by Allianz and their own policy has the following statement:
Exclusions relating to your health
1 You will not be covered for any directly or indirectly related claims (see note at the end of this section) arising from
the following if at the time of taking out this insurance or booking your journey (whichever is later), you:
a are being prescribed regular medication;
b have received treatment for or had a consultation with a doctor or hospital specialist for any medical condition
in the past 12 months;
c are being referred to, treated by or under the care of a doctor or a hospital specialist;
d are awaiting treatment or the results of any tests or investigations.
2 You will not be covered if you travel against the advice of a doctor or where you would have been advised not to
travel if you had sought their advice before beginning your journey.
3 You will not be covered if you know you will need medical treatment or consultation at any medical facility during
your journey.
4 You will not be covered for any directly or indirectly related claim if, before your journey, a doctor diagnosed that
you have a terminal condition.
5 You will not be covered if you were waiting for medical treatment or consultation at any medical facility or were
under investigation for a medical condition when your policy was issued.
6 You will not be covered if you are travelling specifically for the purpose of obtaining and / or receiving any elective
surgery, procedure or hospital treatment
Seems more restrictions apply which worries me slightly, but it is good value. |
Even with the extra bit that you highlight, that's still quite a good exclusion, because it is only based on your current situation or the last 12 months. If I bought this policy I would be absolutely certain that I would be covered.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@JanieS, that policy doesn't cover off piste without a guide.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Amazing how rules on pre-existing medical conditions (PEMC) vary so much. The Nationwide policy has a very unclear rule. It has three layers of rules. It has an initial disclosure when you open the account, then extra disclosures of any new conditions when you book a journey and then further disclosures if certain specified new conditions arise before you leave.
The rule for the initial disclosures is the strange bit. It says that before you book any journey you "can" phone them to tell them about a condition. The word "can" would, taken literally, suggest this is optional. I would imagine they intend that you are not covered for anything you don't disclose, though that isn't what the policy actually says. (Contrast with the rules on the 2nd and 3rd level disclosures, which say this clearly.)
Also, no explanation of what they mean by "a condition" in that initial disclosures rule. Does that mean just conditions you are currently suffering or also anything you suffered in the past (and if so, how long ago)? Does it include even mild conditions, like a wart on your foot, or is there a seriousness threshold?
There's way too much ambiguity for my liking. I'm finicky about this.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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The SCGB PEMC rule isn't too bad, as it only goes back more than 2 years for a few specified things that, on the whole, are serious enough that you would definitely remember having them.
However, it requires you to phone for screening if you have ever had a "breathing condition, including asthma". In the past, I've found that they still want an extra premium even though it is 40 years since I had any asthma. And I've also found that once you are in screening, they don't just want to know about the thing that triggered the need for screening; they want to know about any condition you ever suffered.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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They only cover up to €10,000 of medical treatment. Most UK policies would cover €1m or €5m.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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My quote for MPI for:
Destination: France
Package: Annual Multi Trip Wintersports Standard (AMT)
Introducer: Main Plan Online only
Delete Cancellation Cover
Delete Personal Effects and Money Section
Premium: £132.87 against £101.59 last year.
~30% increase ain't good but still a decent price given their arguably clearer off piste cover and the market place.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Custard the Rabbit wrote: |
| @Layne, I find it hard to take any company seriously if they can't use an apostrophe correctly in important documents. |
I totally agree. If they cannot be bothered to proofread and correct their own documentation properly they do not deserve to be taken seriously.
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BUMP
This from MPI brokers
| Quote: |
Many policies either exclude this or limit skiing ‘off piste’ to be with a guide.
It is our view that this is impractical as one can ski ‘off piste’ unwittingly and in certain circumstances it is possible to ski on a ‘pisted’ run which is designated ‘off piste’.
It is due to this type of confusion that we at MPI Brokers have negotiated with underwriters that there is no such exclusion or limitation in this policy. There is, however, a general requirement, common to all insurance, to behave in a sensible manner.
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and a sensible medical declaration, is why I insure with https://retail.mpibrokers.com
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Another MPI customer here.
I didn't want a limit on the number of days I could ski, or be limited to off piste with a guide.
The quote was good when you compared it to equivalent cover.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Considering getting the Knox extension to the AAC worldwide cover (emergency medical, transportation between hospitals and repatriation limited to the first 8 weeks of any trip with the basic AAC cover). Will compare quotes with MPI first. Long live the EHIC scheme!
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Just tried an on-line annual multi-trip worldwide non-Americas quote from MPI. Being over 50 increases the annual premium by £75 
Although the technical cover looks good, the various add-on upgrades could easily double the policy cost.
On a separate note, I’m actively avoiding any insurer who uses Allianz as claim handlers. When I tried to claim via SCGB insurance for resort/piste closure. Which is pretty much the least fraudulent claim you can make, they wanted full financial details of everyone on the trip including all bank accounts/credit cards etc. They didn’t seem to care about the letter from the lift company stating that the resort was close on that particular date. I guess it is part of their policy to prevent people claiming rather than helping them claim. Their default starting position appeared to be “You are trying to carry out insurance fraud, so we need collect evidence against you”, rather than “Please forward details of your hotel, liftpass and closure confirmation”.
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FAQ
'and resume off-piste next season.
