I suspect quite a few posters on here would have had me lynched.
I think very few, if any would be critical of you.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
inchhighj wrote:
I was also taken out by a skier from behind/above in Whistler, (I'm certainly no beginner either though but was taking it quite mellow on the green at the end of the day) where the green runs weaving down the hill on Blackcomb quite frequently cut through blue and red runs. This reminds me somewhat of the arcade game Space Invaders. Where this happens there is a sign FOR THE BEGINNERS, or people at least still with alot to learn, which says before the junction "LOOK UPHILL AND GIVE WAY". Tad bizarre me thinks, which is the reverse thinking of experts or intermediates should be responsible for any below or in front of them??
i'd say those are warning signs rather than signs changing the skier's safety code
just because i am by default in the right because i am downhill doesn't mean i don't pay some attention to what is going on behind me due to an instinct for self-preservation
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
rob@rar, I would hope you are correct in thinking as you do, however with just my word on the circumstances, no other witnessess, and had the girls parents not seen the whole incident i'd have been stuffed then and stuffed on this forum too.
Thats my opinion anyway .
Is this sort of post on this thread roga, or are you generalising? If it is i missed it and i apologise.
Sorry I think you may have missed my link (the "this thread" bit is a link in the post above), I wasn't referring to this thread but another one where people are posting their on piste speeds as clocked by GPS, some as I recall are claiming speeds of 60/70 mph - in short the sorts of speeds racers get up to. Whilst doubting the accuracy of their GPS eqipment I also have to say it worries me that people seem to think it is acceptable to straightline it down pistes that are used by other people at these sorts of speeds (I don't care if they look empty, someone could ski onto them or initially not be visible). Anyway, judge for yourself: here (that's a link by the way )
Quote:
Roga, everything is blindingly obvious when you are in full possession of the facts, but what if
1. the girls parents didn't see me hit from behind.
2. I had been alone with no witness to events
etc
I suspect quite a few posters on here would have had me lynched.
Not at all, there's a lot of hypotheticals but it's often clearer what the full circumstances are when you see an event 'live' than when you see it on video. Fact is though that once we know all the facts it's clear who is to blame, I don't really see your point other than you think there may be more to some of these events than meets the eye initially and people might sometimes get the blame unfairly, that's kinda life is it not?
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
roga, Now read your link and it's not good reading to be honest.
My point is that when you say, "once we know all the facts" thats the most important part for me. The facts and all of them. There may be more to some of the vids than meets the eye, although they do seem clear cut. I was just using my own experience to demonstrate that not every incident is what it may seem. If you had looked up just after i swore loudly, at the start of my accident, all you would have seen was some idiot englishman obviously out of control and about to crash into a little girl. If you see what i mean?
I take your point that life isn't always fair, which is fine when it's not yourself on the receiving end of said unfairness!
Anyhow apologies for missing your link earlier i must read these threads a bit more thouroughly!
if
1. the girls parents didn't see me hit from behind.
2. I had been alone with no witness to events
etc
I suspect quite a few posters on here would have had me lynched.
Indeed, but that's a different point. (It's not unusual for posters on here to jump to conclusions in the absence of evidence. )
OK, let's modify even further because for all I know, that winky remark may have been directed at least in part, at me.
In the 3rd video, a downhill racer who is unaware of either the lack of protective netting and the packed T-Bar to his right, swerves wide to avoid the small child out of camera shot who is heading towards the slalom pole marking his next turn. Even being a highly skilled and competent athlete, not a self-centred, risk-taking, aggressive type of racer but the gentle, considerate, altruistic type of racer worshipped here here on snowheads, he is simply unable to find edge purchase on the banana skin so thoughtlessly tossed away by a T-Bar riding snowboarder just a few minutes earlier. After the collision for which both the irresponsible course planners and a snowboarding yobbo were to blame and where he was just another victim of circumstance, after losing his skis, the skier rights himself, digs his boots in, self-arrests, looks around and takes stock of the situation. He sees the shame-faced look on the snowboarder sliding towards him who says "sorry about the banana skin, hope you're alright but don't worry about me because I'm OK, just save the child !!" and then magnanimously springs out of the way so as to prevent injury to the snowboarder, stands up, leans on his poles to steady himself from his own pain before bravely calling uphill to alert the small child to the danger from above.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
geoffkay wrote:
roga, Now read your link and it's not good reading to be honest.
Glad I'm not the only one feeling that way
Quote:
My point is that when you say, "once we know all the facts" thats the most important part for me. The facts and all of them. There may be more to some of the vids than meets the eye, although they do seem clear cut. I was just using my own experience to demonstrate that not every incident is what it may seem. If you had looked up just after i swore loudly, at the start of my accident, all you would have seen was some idiot englishman obviously out of control and about to crash into a little girl. If you see what i mean?
I take your point that life isn't always fair, which is fine when it's not yourself on the receiving end of said unfairness!
I absolutely take that on board and we've all been in similar positions - one of mine was being rear ended by a car who shunted me into the back of another car, I intially had the bloke in front shouting and screaming at me before I managed to get a word in edgeways and tell him what had happened. More difficult on a slope to point out what has happened when everyone is scattered in heaps but not impossible I'd say.
This brings to mind a TV advert from a few years ago for a national newspaper, first off IIRC you see a black youth run at an old lady and push her to one side and your probable (I think this is the advertisers intention for sure) first thought is she's being mugged or attacked, then you see a caption suggesting you might want to get the full picture and then the same scene again but from a wider and fuller perspective - old lady is under some scaffolding and some bricks fall off heading for her, the black youth spots this and runs at her to push her out of the way and save her from potential injury - fuller picture, completely different perspective!
Quote:
Anyhow apologies for missing your link earlier i must read these threads a bit more thouroughly!
No probs
After all it is free
After all it is free
geoffkay, I am sure that if your incident had been a road crash the one hitting you would have been at fault. I guess the problem on a ski run is by the time there has been a knock-on event/s the original clutz in it all can be on their feet and long gone.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
roga,
Quote:
This brings to mind a TV advert from a few years ago for a national newspaper, first off IIRC you see a black youth run at an old lady and push her to one side
For The Guardian, from at least 30 years ago judging by the car in the ad.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
roga wrote:
I absolutely take that on board and we've all been in similar positions - one of mine was being rear ended by a car who shunted me into the back of another car,
does that mean you were too close to the car in front to stop in time after the initial shunt on you ?
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
rayscoops,
Quote:
does that mean you were too close to the car in front to stop in time after the initial shunt on you ?
A Joke i hope ray!? How far behind do you stop then? far enough to be able to stop if shunted by a mini or perhaps a 28 tonne lorry
This has also happened to me, i was stationary at a junction and got twatted out into traffic, not a fun experience i must say
Geoff
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Megamum, You are spot on. I never even saw him or her, and neither did my friends- they were too busy watching my antics i suppose!
Geoff
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Julian T, ah that's the one - blimey remembered most of that wrong but the essence of what I said is there!
rayscoops wrote:
does that mean you were too close to the car in front to stop in time after the initial shunt on you ?
Nope, it means I was stationary at some traffic lights and was in a Mini (a classic one) and the idiot was in a far larger car so pushed me some way forward ... anyway I'd rather not relive it all if it's all the same to you - the point was not the traffic accident it was the principle of who is to blame and who gets the blame straight after something like that!
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
roga, you were not at fault as you were stationary at some traffic lights, but in moving traffic I beleive you have to leave enough space between you and the car in front so that if you are shunted you will not hit the car in front - and if you did hit the car in front then as I understand it you are liable
... geoffkay I am not sure how appropriate that is to your skiing scenario though
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
rayscoops, Ray, if you were driving at 27 mph and some nutter collided with your car from the rear at 50mph you would be thrust forward and out of control.
If you subsequently struck another vehicle you would not be to blame. To blame you for the consequences of some other nutters actions would be daft. To use your argument further, then in the case of my skiing incident i would be to blame for not being far enough away from every other piste user when i was walloped from behind
Geoff
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
roga, Crikey roga are we living some sort of parallel lives?
Quote:
I was stationary at some traffic lights and was in a Mini (a classic one) and the idiot was in a far larger car so pushed me some way forward ... anyway I'd rather not relive it all if it's all the same to you
This has also happened to me, i was stationary at a junction and got twatted out into traffic, not a fun experience i must say
Geoff
You're not currently sha@@ing Kelly Brook are you by any chance. Cos i'm quite looking forward to that bit if you are.
Yours in hope Geoff
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
geoffkay,
I wish!
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
geoffkay, maybe you should address the issue with your car insurer
rayscoops, I think that, perhaps, the deals which the various insurance companies might strike in the event of a concertina accident (which could be complicated, say, by one or more of the drivers not being insured, or by a lack of evidence as to the real cause of the accident, or who hit whom first) or what might happen to your no claims bonus, is distinguishable from strict liability. It's well established that if you drive into the car in front of you, without 'help' from behind, the prima facie liability for all damage is yours; I don't think that's the case if you are the blameless ham in the middle of the concertina sandwich, though you might well still lose your no claims bonus in the resultant mess and/or inability to prove that you were in fact totally blameless.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
A bit of a tongue in check post, but I recently stumbled across this:-
Seil Bag Bicycle Safety Backpack Features Wireless LED Lights For Signaling Drivers
The Seil Bag Bicycle Safety Backpack is a sleek rucksack that might just save your ass on the road one day! This bicycle safety backpack flashes the direction you're going to turn, either left or right-hand side ,via LED
Aside from high-tech signalling backpacks, perhaps a simple hand signal to indicate the direction you intend to you (when it is not so obvious) may help in some instances - I think this has been mentioned in one of the earlier posts
rayscoops, Ray i have been in an rtc that entailed being hit from behind and then me hitting someone else in front whilst moving. In other words i was the man in the middle. My insurer at that time did not see it from your point of view, and neither i assume did the other drivers insurers. by which i mean no loss of ncb for me. therefore i trump your daft angelic smiley. Be told.
Geoff
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
geoffkay, ok you have me trumped !! but you do seem to have an alarmingly high general collision rate
Its a reoccurring event that I am seeing more and more as people venture off-piste then rejoin. Yes of course they dont all have the same outcome but dangerous nonetheless. Thoughts?
Also its another reason why I have now bought a helmet. I got wiped out last Feb in Sansicario by a skier that was rejoining the piste on a blind corner. He went straight into the side of me my skis snapped off and my momentum threw me down the slope, i'm glad it was only a moderate red. He apologised but I bet he never learnt from it... I did!!
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
andyfella, Aussie guy was a total tool and deserved the anger from the guy he hit, if it'd been a little kid he might have been facing a serious charge given it looked like US or Canada.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Fatbob, totally agree! I was in the same situation a year back. I was lucky.. others arent!
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Quote:
perhaps a simple hand signal to indicate the direction you intend to you (when it is not so obvious) may help in some instances
It hasn't happened many times, but I'd be telling a lie if I said that I'd never done this, esp. when exiting Maitaz and wanting to cross the grand melezees where they all speed down to the transarc to get to the chantel lift area on the far side of that rat run in Les Arcs
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
rayscoops, Ray, just 2 in 31 years mate. i dont think i'm too bad a risk!!
Off to westendorf in half an hour so no more from me for a week or so. bye
Geoff
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Rejoining pistes at speed, especially coming out from the forest, can indeed be dangerous.
I'll admit to having done it once (hadn't realised there was a piste that close) and emerging way too close to someone uphill...fortunately he was in control and avoided me but in that instance I felt like an idiot. Since then I check 10 times.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
geoffkay wrote:
rayscoops, Ray, just 2 in 31 years mate. i dont think i'm too bad a risk!!
Off to westendorf in half an hour so no more from me for a week or so. bye
Geoff
plus the ski ones enjoy
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
rob@rar wrote:
Dr John wrote:
And I didn't read their reaction as laughing at someone's misfortune, rather nervous laughter at a very very close shave.
If someone had come that close to me, out of control and at that speed, I would have been quite pleased that they had taken a bit of a tumble. I would like to think they might see it as a learning opportunity and not repeat the same behaviour. And I might have had to stifle a bit of a giggle when somebody comes a cropper from acting so stupidly.
I had a very close shave on my last day of holiday in Mayrhofen and had my ski's run over by a very pretentious looking french woman all kitted out in some very expensive kit, hairing it down a busy run on a day with very flat light, lots of moguls and a lot of very hesitant skiiers on their last runs home. This woman had narrowly missed someone making a very cautious but erratic turn (as later noted by my boyfriend) earlier up the slope and lower down skimmed the side of me seriously unsteadying me and then wiped out just in front after hitting a large chunk of snow.
Once I had got over the original "P'd off, what the hell was that stupid woman doing" reaction, put her skis down next to her and scooted off to join my OH waiting lower down for me, I can honestly say I laughed watching her struggle to stand up and dust herself off. It just totally felt like it served her right for acting like she was the business, nearly taking me out (when I dont have the most confidence anyway) and not taking note of the fact that nobody could see more than an arm's length in front of them and were all taking it easy.
I have to say I didn't laugh in front of her, was more incredulous at what a numpty she made of herself!
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:
I can honestly say I laughed watching her struggle to stand up and dust herself off. It just totally felt like it served her right
I'd have laughed too. You don't imagine there are many French skiers in Mayrhofen.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
fatbob wrote:
andyfella, Aussie guy was a total tool and deserved the anger from the guy he hit, if it'd been a little kid he might have been facing a serious charge given it looked like US or Canada.
To change the perspective - what if the Aussie guy had been a woman or little kid - still in the wrong but would they have warranted being attacked ?
To be honest I felt myself feeling quite sorry for the Aussie guy (he was probably not that old either) because he seemed really sorry and apologetic (and hopefully learned a lesson) and imv the other guy was too aggressive and was being quite a bully. I wonder how snowHeads would have reacted if the Aussie guy was their son - would they have left the other guy lay in to him ?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
rayscoops, I'm not advocating the pushing etc which in any event was all a bit handbags but he deserved the tonguelashing given that the guy was probably in a bit of shock at being clattered (& equally a bit of an back bottom probably). I don't see why a woman or child wouldn't have deserved some equal verbals. The problem is if no-one gets hurt it all ends up being a bit of a laugh doesn't it?- his mate filming clearly thought so as he's seen fit to post the video up on a "comedy" website.
Of course no-one deliberately hits someone else so the "I didn't mean it" does sound like a bit of kid's apology though. He still didn't consider that when tanking down blind and out of control onto a piste whether there was anyone coming.
Try skiing with a six year old, then you realise quite how many idiots there are on the slopes! Any of these incidents mentioned, could kill my child (in fact I wonder what on earth I am doing letting her on the slopes atall).
However, she is steady, in control, can turn in an instant and stop as quickly (if not quicker!!!) than me. But we always ski with one of us a little way behind to - like an other poster has said - to create that 'bubble', better one of us get hit first to break the momentum of the misile!
Not sure what the answer is, more policing?
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Thought I'd chuck this into the mix to see what rights and wrongs snowheads see....
Winterhighland, Brilliant - not tempted to film for longer and set it to a Benny Hill soundtrack?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Winterhighland wrote:
Thought I'd chuck this into the mix to see what rights and wrongs snowheads see....
Rights ? There are no possible rights. They're all mugs & muppets. It's just a perfect illustration of why going to Cairngorm on a Saturday in the middle of the season is plain wrong.
After all it is free
After all it is free
Quote:
It's just a perfect illustration of why going to Cairngorm on a Saturday in the middle of the season is plain wrong
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
fatbob, kept it quite short and it was the only video clip I took i yesterday, battery was running very low in camera. New(ish) camera doesn't take to being left in cold car!
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
moffatross wrote:
Rights ? There are no possible rights. They're all mugs & muppets. It's just a perfect illustration of why going to Cairngorm on a Saturday in the middle of the season is plain wrong.
LOl, and therein endeth the lesson!
I suspect if you stuck that lot on/around any lift at Glencoe the carnage could be even greater!
That area can be a total nightmare with inexperienced skiers/boarders getting off the t-bar and more inexperienced skiers/boarders arriving at the bottm of the zig zags - add in to the mix comedy snowploughers trying to escape from the Cas t-bar queue above, clueless people letting go of the lift bars too soon and you've got the makings of a total disaster.
I'd hate to admit how long ago I was a beginner at Cairngorm but one of few things that's etched on my memory from way back then is a fear of that lift, especially the offloading area. I well remember the fear I had of the routes to the left of the tow, both of which offer steep (or so it seemed to me at the time) and narrow routes down to the beginner slopes below. Add in a bit of ice and you've got the makings of even more carnage!
Funny thing is I was thinking about my memories of Cairngorm from way back the other day and strange to say virtually all my recollections of the Cas side are of wind, rain, rocks, ice and very hairy moments whereas the Ciste side is totally diferent with sunshine, blue skies and fantastic snow - quite bizzarre because there must have been a mix of both on both sides but I guess the lower Cas was where I mostly began and so I have these fearful memories of being barely in control and then add in dodgy conditions and it's etched on the brain forever. I graduated onto the Ciste side once I could ski better so have no memories of nightmare days, just have the memories of lots of great skiing and fun times - probably why that side remains my favourite to this day. Have to say I have some pretty fun memories of the White Lady too (after getting over my fear of it when a school mate broke his leg there 3 seasons running), especially all those cool dudes whizzing down the moguls in the spring sunshine late in the season and the lunchtime crowds around the old Shieling and Ski Club hut admiring their prowess - hot dog man!
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
)
but you do seem to have an alarmingly high general collision rate 
