 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Gosh - that's shocking.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Bode Swiller, the salomon fitting looks a piece of crap. How can that not bend?
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salomon are doing a re-call on these now.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| milnerhome wrote: |
| salomon are doing a re-call on these now. |
I read that onTGR.
The gf has a pair so I've been watching this pretty closely. AFAIK there has only been one example of the whole unit coming out - with pretty serious results - but even the guy it happened to is still defending the boot as a good compromise boot as a freeride boot with tech inserts.
It's alarming that Salomon saw fit to use such an inferior insert for these boots.
Maybe Smallzookeeper was right all along...
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Just read up on the whole thing to make sure I had the current full story, and I'm glad there's a thread here already. Really scary stuff, I think that even intermediate skiers/people with no interest in the backcountry should be aware of just how badly Salomon have dropped the ball here, and pretty much directly ended one skier's career. Given the limited availablity of these boots, and the amount of failure stories around already, I hope this does the damage to Salomon's reputation it deserves. Personally, I won't be touching another of their products - I realise boycotting stuff is essentially a bit petty, but on a moral level I'm horrified.
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parlor, Who Sir? Me Sir?????
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This should be a simple production problem to solve.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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He posted this photo of his leg:
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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arv, 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, the first post in this thread gives the prognosis which is even more
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milnerhome, shit happened that was from a large trusted ski company, and from the TGR thread, wasn't an unknown issue to Salomon as the boots were made available to the mainstream.
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You know it makes sense.
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arv,
DaveC, ah well Salomon will suffer from the bad press and yeah it was completely out of order that they were brought out, but salomon still produce good gear, and I'm not going to see this and just go off salomon totally.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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What happened in the accident, it seems to be spread all around TGR. Was it a pre-release?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Cheers DaveC, shocking from Salomon.
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I'm slightly surprised he didn't manage to self-arrest at the top of the fall given that his skis had come off and that's not too steep a slope
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A long pitch at 35 degrees feels a lot steeper than you'd think from the number, I can well imagine it being very difficult to self arrest.
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I do know what it feels like, having had to do it myself when I had a pre-release on pretty much exactly that pitch slope. In my case it took a while as I didn't cope well with one ski on and one off - once both were off it was dead easy, and I then stopped in about 15m (I fell about 50-80m in total).
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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This is what Salomon has to say in relation to the issue
"Salomon has been informed of a potential incompatibility when using Salomon Quest Pro Boots and low tech touring bindings (ex: Dynafit, G3 Onyx model, Plume, ATK Race). The same applies to the touring pads which were designed to allow other Quest boots to be compatible with low tech touring bindings. Salomon Quest Pro... Boots are compatible with the other touring bindings compliant with ISO9523 standard. Salomon started an investigation concerning the compatibility of its Quest Pro Boots with low tech touring bindings, immediately after being alerted to this potential problem and these investigations are still ongoing. As a precautionary safety measure, Salomon announces that Salomon Quest Boots having a metal tech-fit for low tech touring bindings (Quest Pro boots) should not be used until further notice, and should be immediately returned to Salomon. For returns, contact Salomon at (801) 624-7581. The same return request applies to the touring pads which were designed to allow other Quest boots to be compatible with low tech touring bindings. There are very limited quantities of these boots and pads in the market. While most of these products were distributed without charge for trial purposes, a very small number may have been sold. In either case, the Quest Pro boots and touring pads should be returned to Salomon by retailers and skiers. Appropriate replacements or credits will be arranged. Any further questions should be directed to Salomon customer service"
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parlor, on the plus side, you have a bird that skis Dynafits. Not got any access to anything mounted with FRs/dukes/naxos or something she could use? Just the pads being recalled...
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There is a huge amount of alternatives to these boots, it's really no bother if the boot is there or not. What will be interesting is what Salomon do about it. Short of paying this guy huge amounts of money to perhaps endorse the product once it has been modified as an ambassador for the recall process, I would say this product maybe doomed from the start, after all it's nothing special and the inside volume is questionable.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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parlor, if she's after a stiff boot I've got to say the Titan's are working out well for me after stretching the forefoot and big toe box. They are super stiff. With the recall she should be able to get something new at end of season prices and get a full refund on the Quests? Assume her Dynafits have some play for any small BSL difference?
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DaveC, after dropping over $3k she can't justify any more purchases in the next few months. We don't have a big enough network here yet to borrow gear when we go for a tour.
She has FT12s so plenty of room if a new BSL is in order.
The big thing *she* is pissed off with is, after skiing the boots for 5 weeks and deciding that they really worked for her, these boots did everything, so she sold her alpine boots. The Quest sole allows her to ski both Dynafit & alpine binders without changing the soles - which is academic at the moment as she only has a Dynafit set up. If she gets a full refund and buys the next best fitting boot then the Garmont Radium would probably be it but then she would need a new alpine boot too!
Maybe BobinCH solution works, she didn't get to try on a ZZeus or a Titan, they didn't have her size. At least then it's still one pair of boots, even if I get to change the soles from time-to-time.
We haven't spoken to Salomon yet, this may have some effect as to the final outcome.
SMALLZOOKEEPER, I find it weird that the inside volume can be 'questionable', because it doesn't fit a certain foot or because it's too far from an average fit? After trying on Scarpa, Dyanfits, Black Diamond & Garmonts, the Sollys were the best fit for her foot. The flex in them is pretty good, I found them stiffer than the Radium. And the soles - hoping that they do worK them out - are a break through actually: DIN Alpine & Tech Inserts, no swapping, no messing around is a big move forward. IMO they were light enough for what is a pretty decent freeride boot. JUST BADLY MANUFACTURED -GRRRRRRRRR!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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parlor, yeah, fair enough bud. I actually didn't realise that the Quest pads were dual purpose, that actually is quite good. Well, could of been quite good, if they didn't have the magic ability to try and kill people. If I have money I'm tempted to dynafit up next winter, and I'm scared of having to find another pair of boots that fit after alpines being such a massive hassle. You planning on being in BC long term?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I didn't think that the pads where dual purpose? I was told they only worked with a binding with a manual height adjustment (Salomon driver bindings etc or tourers such as freerides dukes with an ajustable AFD)
I quite liked the fit of the quest also... must admit I did wear it a size smaller than my normal boots though...
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no offical line from salomon as yet, but the impression i got when i spoke to the guys yesterday was that they were going to remove the low tech inserts from the boots and offer either the alpine sole or the vibram/contagrip sole for touring/freeride bindings
time will tell, still a good boot these issues aside, and as Dan said needs to be downsizes to get any kind of performance out it
we will have some dynafits to put along sided it (with proper inserts!!)
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You know it makes sense.
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CEM, (with proper Alpine Overlap????) 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Even Black Diamond, without any experience of manufacturing boots managed to avoid this problem, to me it looks like a cost cutting job, why not beef those inserts right up?????
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Poster: A snowHead
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, is it just the inserts? The actual hole looks to be sat on rubber on the Quest and anchored in plastic on other boots. Seems like they should accept they've made a miserable job of it and not try and support dynafit - not like anyone's going to have much faith in the inserts now anyway.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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DaveC, It's certainly the week point of the plates, to put the inserts directly in the joint between plastic and rubber is daft. It would appear that perhaps they went for maximum rubber for durability and neglected the stress points. Either way as said earlier the boot is nothing special so if it's available or not will have no impact on the public's choice, better stuff out there from BD, Dynafit, Garmont and Scarpa.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Just looked at the guys x-ray. Almost threw up!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, Parlor's point about being able to support Dynafit or alpine on the fly without mucking around seemed like a valid one - do any other boots do this? I'm not that clued up on AT boots, but really considering a Dynafit setup, especially if the boots work in my alpine binders easily, since it'll work well for touring and spending time on race courses on race days.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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dansmith, there have been a couple of variations of the Quests. The ones that come with the Tech Insert soles are dual use: there is a smooth plastic pad that sits on the AFD and conforms with DIN/ISO and has the tech inserts.
SMALLZOOKEEPER, only Dynafit & BD make a SINGLE boot that is compatible with alpine & AT binders AND YOU STILL have to swap out the soles to make that happen. So no, there still aren't comparibles.
FWIW on my Aeros the inserts are molded in exactly the same place, there is no plastic under the inserts, only rubber of the sole.
Not sure why I am defending them. Well I do, in a nutshell: 1) a real ski boot with reasonable touring capabilities 2) one boot, one sole, two sets of bindings.
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I'll double check me facts, but I'm pretty sure even though there is that bit of plastic where the AFD sits the boot sole is still too thick for a standard binding. Hense why you can get the din sole as an extra and vise versa! I'll let ya know 2mo!
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| parlor wrote: |
Not sure why I am defending them. Well I do, in a nutshell: 1) a real ski boot with reasonable touring capabilities 2) one boot, one sole, two sets of bindings. |
So what is the exhaustive list for 1) these days?
I thought there were some Lange boots in the offing in wider lasts. Dalbello? Is the one boot quiver still an unattainable dream?
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fatbob, I was quite interested in the Dynafit Titan from having a read, but I doubt it's possible to get the exact same performance out of AT boots as it is out of plug/super accurate shell fit alpines - probably wouldn't want that tight a fit for the journey up I assume?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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DaveC, i've come to the conclusion that one size fits all isn't really attainable unless:
1. you are happy skiing downhill in slightly floppy boots
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2. you are happy touring in alpine boots
even things like the Titan don't look great for long slogs or using crampons; remember SZK saying something about the walk mechanism always affecting a boot's pop and there is probably something in that
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| dansmith wrote: |
| I'll double check me facts, but I'm pretty sure even though there is that bit of plastic where the AFD sits the boot sole is still too thick for a standard binding. Hense why you can get the din sole as an extra and vise versa! I'll let ya know 2mo! |
Thanks for your help Dan but I'm looking at the boot in front of me. It's the Pebax Pro version, there are several different incarnations with various offerings, the one *I am looking at* has a touring sole (Contagrip - Salomons Vibram) with Tech Inserts AND a glide pad for the AFD.
DaveC & Fatbob, this from Arno is pretty close to the truth.
| Arno wrote: |
DaveC, i've come to the conclusion that one size fits all isn't really attainable unless:
1. you are happy skiing downhill in slightly floppy boots
or
2. you are happy touring in alpine boots
even things like the Titan don't look great for long slogs or using crampons; remember SZK saying something about the walk mechanism always affecting a boot's pop and there is probably something in that |
It's close though. I'm happy with a bit of extra weight for the weigh up to limit the compromise for the ski down.
I have found in the last couple of seasons that I don't need a plug boot for the type of skiing that I do. Each time I get a softer (especially progressively) flexing boot, once you get used to it I prefer it.
My main complaint with AT boots remains the cuff height - I still like to feel like I am being held in the boot, followed by lack of lateral stiffness / support (which is often a feeling related to cuff height).
Perhaps I need to try the Virus range.
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