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Tips to improve /speed up my transitioning?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I am pretty new to skinning and am sometimes shocked and embarrassed at the time it takes me to get my skins on and prepare myself for uphill.
This year I bought myself some skin bags which seem to help.
Any tips you may have to speed things up would be much appreciated.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I feel your pain. I'm cr** at getting skins on and off too. And putting skis on my backpack is equally un-speedy.

I'll be watching this thread for tips.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I can recommend the G3 Love Glove Embarassed, as an alternative to plastic cheat sheets, and a skin bag. It makes removing, folding, and packing skins much easier in my opinion.

https://us-store.genuineguidegear.com/products/love-glove

There are online videos of how to use them, but be careful what you search for, as you may get unexpected results Shocked


Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Wed 14-03-18 19:40; edited 1 time in total
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At least you're both admitting to it - so chapeau for that

Do you know the French do not have a word for "faffing" and the Americans don't really have a word either.

As for tips - if you know you're doing a day tour from a car park etc - put your skins on before you leave your home, pretty obvious but you'll be amazed at those that don't.

Little carabiners are great for keeping gloves out the way as you put skins on.

Try and have a set process - skins go on first and then adjust the binding to pull the brakes up, just in case you drop the ski and it goes its own way.

Try and work out where the wind is coming from and put skins on with your back to the wind.

Do not take the cheat sheet off - leave it on as you put the skin on so it can't glue to itself - pull down hard from the tip and stretch the skin pulling the sheet off as you put the skin on.

Putting skins on is not usually a faff it's taking them off.

I place skin upside down and rip skin off taking note of the wind again, once off place ski horizontal upside down, placing it over the other ski to make it flat then place skin on ski and put sheet back on and fold skin up.

Prior to all this, if at all cold get your layers on first and if possible use thin gloves.

But it is difficult and seems to only come with experience and not too sure about tips.

Like you say be interesting to see what others might say.

In deep snow best to keep one ski on at all times and make sure your bag and poles are well secured.

My OH at times amazes me how quick she can be Puzzled
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
If it's windy, I take the skin off with the ski on the ground. Pull about a quarter of the skin off the ski and stick the cheat sheet to that and then continue to pull half the skin off and stick the remainder of the cheat sheet in place. Then, stick the two halves of the skin together as the remaining half of the skin is pulled off. Hope this makes sense.
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Colltex Whizz skins = no cheat sheet faffing
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@spyderjon, try telling that to my mate who was using them a couple of weeks ago who had nightmares trying to use them twice on two climbs on the same day!

Had to resort to cable ties to hold them on!

And the dude in question is quite experienced.

Same guy also managed to break both of his dynafiddle bindings over the course of two weeks!

Though have to admit to having had no probs with my coltex but only use mine in spring snow. His probs were in very deep powder
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@FoofyNoo,

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLGA8RmHpTUF-mn0Kgum77vdofS8_AGD9G

Really good series of videos for touring tips
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Quote:

As for tips - if you know you're doing a day tour from a car park etc - put your skins on before you leave your home, pretty obvious but you'll be amazed at those that don't.


Most people don't put them on at home as manufacturers advise against it - https://www.genuineguidegear.com/life/video/climbing-skin-myth-putting-skins-home-vs-trailhead
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@Weathercam, never had problems with Scott / Colltex whizzskins in spring snow or pow pow.

There’s a special secret technique for gale force wind transitioning I was shown by the Powfinder General. Works every time.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@Sharkymark, have you done two climbs in a day ??

Like I say he was having all sorts of issues, KenX also witnessed it.

As for not putting skins on at home, me and the OH must have done it many many times, without any issue, though could be we're maybe more biased to Spring touring and warmer temps.

That said this season still yet to really do a spring tour as it's just cold snow, cold snow with some concrete thrown in as well Toofy Grin

Just looking at my stats now on 30 days of putting skins on so far this season!!
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Once skins have been used a few times and have lost their out of the box super-stickiness, I've found they're just fine to stick sticky side together without using cheat sheets between them. The mountain coldness, some powder snow stuck to them, or a bit of moisture on them means they're nowhere near so tacky as when you're at home and they're dry so there's no damage done. Furthermore, stuffing them down the front of a jacket or into a big pants pocket saves the faff of taking off a pack. It's not photogenic having a big bulge at your belly or below your hip, but it doesn't half save some time.
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
When using skins regularly fold the ends in to the middle and stick the skin to itself. Don't use cheat sheet etc. Both the ends should be about stuck to the middle of the skin. Flatten it out.
Putting the skin on- put back of ski in the snow. Front of skin on ski- at this point very little glued surface should be visible. Pull the skin down the ski. It goes on pretty easily and isn't too long a glued surfacw in the wind at any one time.
Taking off reverse the process.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Drop 5kg

The time saved onbthe up will far outweigh the transition savings
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

http://youtube.com/v/4COxe-miIJs&t=154s

This video is pretty good for this. Removing skins with skis on your feet definitely speeds you up, although I only do it somewhere unexposed/ steep as there is the chance of a fall doing it (especially when you are learning). Other benefit is that no snow gets in the pin holes on your boots (if using tech bindings) so less likely to pre-release when skiing.

I also don't bother with cheat sheets, but it depends how gluey your skins are I guess?
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Used to do the taking skins off with the skis still on trick when skins were straight and didn't have tail clips, it was also easier to just stick straight skins together. Not tried it with wider shaped skins with tail clips, I'm not sure I'm still agile enough either.

How do people find the skin socks? Are they any better than cheat sheets?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@FoofyNoo, spend a week with an impatient guide
PM me if you want the name of the guide!
who continually warns of impending doom if you don't get a move on.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Gämsbock, Laughing
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boarder2020 wrote:
Quote:

As for tips - if you know you're doing a day tour from a car park etc - put your skins on before you leave your home, pretty obvious but you'll be amazed at those that don't.


Most people don't put them on at home as manufacturers advise against it - https://www.genuineguidegear.com/life/video/climbing-skin-myth-putting-skins-home-vs-trailhead


i mitigate this problem by putting my skins on in outside temps at home before loading into truck , i do like it when you arrive at trailhead already "faffed" and ready to rock on Very Happy
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@Gämsbock, not just guides, why do you think my OH is so quick Toofy Grin Toofy Grin Toofy Grin
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@Weathercam, I was tempted to comment but you beat me to it Very Happy
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Gloves - I see people being unable to do things due to a lack of dexterity caused by large of gloves or lobster style mitt/gloves. If you're skinning up try using a really thin pair of gloves or better yet go without. If you need somewhere to store gloves while you transition stuff them inside your jacket while you do things, keeps them warm out of the snow.

Backpack - Buy a simple backpack, less zips and buckles and compartments the less faffing.

Powder - Make a stable platform to put on your skis. You'll probably struggle a little less If you stomp down the snow around you with your skis on prior to taking them off and then stomp around with your boots.

Tech boots- mark centre point of the dynafit inserts holes so you can line them up easier.


The main reason people are quick is that they have mileage and muscle memory so simple way to get faster is ski more !
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Thanks all.
A lot of very useful tips .....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
What's the rush though?
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@Mike Pow, ok not a problem for you in Japan but the "faff factor" can impact overall timings when Spring ski touring and getting the snow pack transformation correct - and not least major golden rule to be off the hill before the potential of south facing slopes sliding.

Think @KenX, recalls when I was getting stressed at the faffing going on as I was more than conscious of timing of the route I was taking them on and how it was important to get over a certain ridge, ironically Col de La Pisse.

45 mins can make quite a difference - but just wish currently we'd be having those issues Sad
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Weathercam wrote:
@Mike Pow, ok not a problem for you in Japan but the "faff factor" can impact overall timings when Spring ski touring and getting the snow pack transformation correct - and not least major golden rule to be off the hill before the potential of south facing slopes sliding.


understand the need to travel safely on snow.

But as I suggested earlier, dropping 5kg in bodyweight or equipment, or both will have a much larger impact on time over the course of a ski day.

This will allow for a relaxed transition from tour mode to ski mode with a chance to grab a bite and a drink, and take in the surroundings.

That's what a touring day means to me anyway Smile


Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Wed 4-04-18 13:27; edited 1 time in total
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
To me also.
Hopefully my partners at least take a few minutes relax and enjoy the view and a sip of drink at the top, even if they can't be bothered for a little snack.

Simple way to deal with the avalanche hazard on sunny slopes is just to set your bedroom alarm 5 minutes earlier on special days when that's key.

Ken
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Sometimes it's not that easy, especially taking people out on their first couple of ski tours.

So loosing 5kg etc does not come into it - and I try to advise on what to take etc

A Spring tour, as the days get longer and depending on the route could well start at 08:00 - if someone turns up late, and then faffs you could loose half an hour, then if you're doing two ascents which involves another transition and faffing / relaxed attitude continues you could well loose another chunk of time and that can be the difference between skiing sweet corn and sludge the second descent, though on the whole with first / second timers tend to avoid doing two transitions.

If friends are not use to climbing you have to calculate that you'll be going at circa 200-300m an hour and allow for rest breaks, so that climb you're use to doing in a couple of hours could well end up taking three hours plus.

A good route should allow for different aspects to take into account timing, and sometimes luck does help, and I much prefer to get to the transition point (summit / col ) with time in hand to wait for the snow to transform., but does not always happen.

And tours on the whole that start early in the morning tend to finish around lunchtime so it's not a day, though of course depends on the aspect of the route.

The more you tour the more you get your own "systems" going as it were and referring back to the OP he was asking how to speed up, where as now we're discussing more the impact of loosing time.

And I don't mind admitting I'm not the most patient of people so that does not help and I will select who I'll take up the hill on the basis of how I think they might manage themselves, and it seems to work.

But don't get me started on people following you to the extent of invading your space!!!

Anyway like I said wish we were having those issues currently rolling eyes
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Yes it's worth thinking about saving time on transitions -- especially for a tour with several of them, like a couple of years ago when on the traverse of Pic du Rif, Dome de Monetier, Glacier Tabuc -- when my partner did remark upon my longer delays (and also said that it was thus a good thing that I was pretty fast while actually skinning up).

Weathercam wrote:
> I will select who I'll take up the hill on the basis of how I think they might manage themselves, and it seems to work.

My experience is that the biggest and most difficult "slowness" to manage with partners is lack of skill and confidence for skiing _down_ in difficult snow. Wasting two minutes per transition is small stuff compared with that. Slowness skinning up can be managed by me carrying some weight from their pack, or connecting together with an elastic cord so I can help pulling them, or by adjusting the objectives of the tour.

But once you start back down, if my plan was to be back out to civilization in a hour, and I discover one partner is flailing on downhill turns, not so much I can do to help. Memorable especially with bad weather or warm avalanches closing in.

Ken
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
kenr wrote:

My experience is that the biggest and most difficult "slowness" to manage with partners is lack of skill and confidence for skiing _down_ in difficult snow.
Ken


Surely that's part of the trip preparation and you should know before you go - both ability and likely snow conditions.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@Mike Pow, don't think logic features much in @kenr's, planning Toofy Grin
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Weathercam wrote:
@Sharkymark, have you done two climbs in a day ??

Like I say he was having all sorts of issues, KenX also witnessed it.

As for not putting skins on at home, me and the OH must have done it many many times, without any issue, though could be we're maybe more biased to Spring touring and warmer temps.

That said this season still yet to really do a spring tour as it's just cold snow, cold snow with some concrete thrown in as well Toofy Grin

Just looking at my stats now on 30 days of putting skins on so far this season!!


Yes, many times. In Lofoten we do up to 3 or 4 reasonable climbs a day. I’ll keep you posted this week as we’ve got another 8 days coming up 😬
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Yep, no problems today either...
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In windy conditions cut your cheat sheets in half... much less to get tangled, you can use each half with one skin doubled.
But seriously? 5 mins to swap once you get used to doing it snowHead
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
And putting your skins on at home? Easy, stick them on outside in the same approx temps you will be skiing in, they won't get that hot in the back of your car unless you have the heating on full.
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Weathercam wrote:
@spyderjon, try telling that to my mate who was using them a couple of weeks ago who had nightmares trying to use them twice on two climbs on the same day!....

99% certain that if he spends just a little time ensuring his base are dry then that'll sort it.
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Weathercam wrote:
@spyderjon, try telling that to my mate who was using them a couple of weeks ago who had nightmares trying to use them twice on two climbs on the same day!

Had to resort to cable ties to hold them on!

And the dude in question is quite experienced.

Same guy also managed to break both of his dynafiddle bindings over the course of two weeks!

Though have to admit to having had no probs with my coltex but only use mine in spring snow. His probs were in very deep powder


Heard from a few sources that colltex Whizz skins don't work as well below minus 10 C.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
It was a very cold day..............
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DB wrote:


Heard from a few sources that colltex Whizz skins don't work as well below minus 10 C.


I had that problem on one very cold day. the tail clip came undone and the whole skin came off one ski and had zero adhesion for reattaching. When it's not really cold they are great!
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Very very new to touring, why shouldn't you put skins on at home?
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