Saalbach at New Year

A snowHead

I've got Kaltenbach booked for Christmas weeks so now I'm trying to book my New Year week. I quite fancy Saalbach but after some fairly limited skiing last New Year (at high altitude in Champoluc) the other couple we usually ski with are worried about how low Saalbach is. Can anyone who was there last New Year tell me what it was like? Many pistes open, decent quality snow?

While I'm in research mode - is Fieberbrunn a good location? Hotels there seem a bit cheaper than in Sallbach.

A snowHead

@Valkyrie, I have spent New Year in Saalbach for the last 12 years. Last year was exceptionally mild, with sunny days and not much in the way of fresh snow, so it was more like April than December. However, there was plenty of skiing above the mid-stations, thanks largely to the extensive snow making, and afternoons lazing in the sunshine in a deckchair also had an unexpected charm.

New Year 2014-15 was very snowy - fresh snow 4 mornings out of 6 - so the complete opposite of last New Year. Dec 2011/ Jan 2012 had so much snow that the valley was closed for a couple of days after the New Years guests had got out, so as ever, it is really difficult to predict what the conditions will be like.

Even though Saalbach, Hinterglemm, Leogang and Fieberbrunn are all at about 1000m, the vast majority of the skiing is above 1500m, and even last year the majority of pistes were open and in good condition and it was possible to ski almost all of the Circus. The runs back down to the villages were narrow and slushy in the afternoons, but still open.

Regarding Fieberbrunn - the runs are steeper and the lifts are less modern than in Saalbach-Hinterglemm, and it takes about 45 minutes to ski across to the main Ski Circus. I've never stayed in the village, so cannot comment on the accommodation, nightlife etc. but I have the impression that it is somewhat quieter than Saalbach or Hinterglemm, where New Year's Eve is a blast.

A good description of the skiing in Fieberbrunn here: http://www.theguardian.com/travel/2016/feb/20/austria-off-piste-ski-resort-fieberbrunn-winter

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I've spent many a new year in Hinterglemm, great fun and great atmosphere. This past winter I was there in early Jan, (9-16?), and it snowed quite a bit. However, the first full day we were there was the last day of the warm, sunny, snowless period. If there had been no artificial snow, I doubt a single run would have been open. But there was, and considering that there had only been a few days of cold in early Dec, the range and quality of the pistes that were open was incredible. I really enjoyed that first day, (though delighted to see the snow arrive the next) and skied much of the circuit, including Fieberbrunn.
My thoughts on Fieberbrunn are that it's a very beautiful area, but the infrastructure and pistes felt less polished and professional than S-H. That isn't necessarily a criticism, but, for example, the artificial snow seemed to be put down more inconsistently, the pistes less smoothly bashed overnight, that sort of thing.
I think I personally would prefer to stay in S-H rather than Fieberbrunn, simply due to the options. When you're in the main valley, you can chop and change what you want to do on the spur of the moment. If you're in Fieberbrunn you either limit yourself to that area, or you face the same, quite lengthy, journey every day to get to the main circus. You can get to Fieberbrunn's best skiing almost as quickly from S-H as you can from Fieberbrunn. Given that it was Fieberbrunn that was driving the link, (and I completely understand why), I actually think it has been better for S-H who now have access to some more wilder skiing areas that the main circus lacked a bit.
That said, if somebody offered me a cheap deal to Fieberbrunn I'd definitely consider it...

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I went to St Johann the week after New Year this year (arriving 2nd January), and spent 2 days of that week skiing from Fieberbrunn over into Saalbach-Hinterglemm.

This year at that time was very poor for snow in that area, but they still had most of the pistes open and skiable. The first time I went over, you had to use the gondola down to the link station from the Fieberbrunn side, although the piste was open on the Saalbach side. By later in the week, both were open. There were a good number of the valley runs open, on both sides of the valley, and I don't think there was any part of the area that couldn't be reached due to closed pistes.

I enjoy the skiing in Fieberbrunn too - I spent a couple of days skiing there the previous year, before the link to Saalbach was created, but I don't know what accommodation is like, as I had stayed in St Johann that time too. Espri on this site actually lives there.

Incidentally, it could also be worthwhile you looking at St Johann for somewhere to stay. If you get the Kizbuhel Allstar pass, that includes the St Johann area (smallish), but also the Fieberbrunn-Saalbach-Hinterglemm area - 15 minutes on the free ski bus, and Kitzbuhel itself - 10 minutes on the train (free with lift pass), and the Skiwelt (only worth it if conditions are good) - another 15-20 minutes on the train after Kitzbuhel, still included with lift pass. And some other areas that you can't get to with free transport.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I concur with everything said by my three learned colleagues. Having spent the last 9 Xmas/New Year periods in Saalbach (and hoping fervently that last winter's late snow won't be repeated), we were pleasantly surprised on arriving in mid-December to find that it was possible to ski most runs on artificial snow - over to Leogang and in the other direction to Hinterglemm, as well as around most of the valley anti-clockwise. Also, if my memory serves me correctly, nearly all the lifts were open.
The huge investment in snow-making certainly paid off, and we had the impression that Saalbach was much better off than many (if not most) other resorts. Also the artificial snow on the pistes was cold enough for most of the time to provide nice skiing conditions.
The altitude is higher than many other Austrian resorts, and in the last couple of Decembers, the problem has been the lack of any precipitation across the Alps (or that part of the Alps), rather than the kind of precipitation - in other words, several weeks of mainly cold temperatures but blue skies do not make for good snow conditions, although they do make for good snow-making conditions.

By the way, to digress, does anyone know what the new "Express Lift" is going to be, supposedly linking the Zwoelferkogel to the ski areas of the Westgipfel. Is it nothing more exciting than a renewal of the tired old Zwoelferkogelbahn, or are we going to be saved the tramp across the meadow (heading clockwise)?

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Your digression is a good one, as I saw it was 'NEU fur 2016-17' on the website, and have been intrigued. Alas I can't really help except to say that I'd heard the Zwolfer Bahn was scheduled for an upgrade, (is it really that many years? I still shudder at the old chairlift queues...), and that I can't see any sign of any building work on the web-cams, and surely if it was a major project you could. It says 10-seater. We will see...

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

@Colinthc, I'll be in Saalbach during July/August, so will investigate.

After all it is free

Seems the new 12er Express is moving from planning to execution - they have a company engaged: http://www.aloisloidl.at/de/referenzen-2016.html

This will be a very welcome development, and will presumably link the mid stations - anything else would be a one-way lift, which isn't very helpful. And the dualling of the drags on the nursery slopes is long overdue...

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@quinton, This corresponds with my own understanding of the projects being planned. My surmise about the possibility of a lift linking the Zwoelferkogel and the Westgipfel comes from the Saalbach website (Lift Company - New in 2016/17): "- 12er Express (Project) New 10-seater cable car connects the Zwölferkogel and the lifts in the area of the Westgipfel.". It seems a strange way of putting it, if all they are planning is to renew the Zwoelferkogelbahn.

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@quinton, I inferred the route - to link the two mountains with a 12-seat cable car, it would be nonsense to make this work in one direction only. They could build a new lift station at each end and have both somewhere between the midstation and the base, but that would seem like a missed opportunity.

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I'd not seen that sentence on the website. The German version says the new lift 'will comfortably connect the Zwolferkogel with the practice (i.e. beginners') lifts of the Westgipfel area'. It will be interesting to see exactly what route the lift will take.

My understanding is also that the 12er Express will be a short, 10-seat gondola from the area at the bottom Westgipfel piste (near the Schwarzach beginners' tow, I think, which is also being updated) over to the Zwölferkogel side (somewhere around the Xandlstadl). Just for the lazy amongst us Laughing

. The new lift is still described as a "project", though, also on the new piste plan, so whether this will materialise for next winter, I do not know. See http://www.saalbach.com/en/winter/lift-company/news/new-in-winter-201617.html (there was a link to the piste plan on http://alpinforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=792&start=3925 but that seems to have been removed - maybe they are thinking again about the regrading of the Reckmoos Nord piste to red).

And some news from the other side: there was an extensive report on the new TirolS lift linking Saalbach/Hinterglemm with Fieberbrunn in a recent issue of the Kitzbüheler Anzeiger - see here (in German) http://www.kitzanzeiger.at/Ein-Debuet-mit-Herausforderungen_pid,17070,nid,76015,type,newsdetail.html . Beyond the report on last season, the most interesting point is that the Fieberbrunn lift company plans to invest €8 million in snow-making equipment in the next three years. That will certainly be useful in places. The Reckmoos Süd piste suffers particularly under the sun. When I was in that area a couple of weeks ago, there was already work in progress there which I suspect is related to the new snow-making:

You know it makes sense.

@espri, All news that will be well received! As one of the self-confessed "lazy amongst us", who finds the walk across the flat meadow a bit of a pain, I'm intrigued by this project to link the Westgipfel to the Zwoelferkogel. If they included mention of it in "New for 2016/17", the inference must be that they intend to construct the new Express lift this summer. Strange though that there is no mention (that I could find, at least under "New for 2016/17") of the upgrading of the Zwoelferkogelbahn.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I don't think the Zwölferkogelbahn is being renewed this year.

A snowHead

Thanks for the info everyone - we've booked Fieberbrunn. I'll have a hire car so might well have a couple of days away and that looks to be easier from Fieberbrunn than S-H.

A snowHead

@Valkyrie, with a car Fieberbrunn is the perfect centre for a holiday with plenty of variety. Using the Salzburg Super Ski Card you can ski the Hochkönig (e.g. from Maria Alm) or, for (mostly) gentle slopes, Lofer. Alternatively, in the other direction with the Kitzbüheler Alpen AllStar Card the SkiWelt (from Going or Ellmau) is attractive. Both passes cover Kitzbühel and the closer areas like St. Johann and the Steinplatte (Waidring). And that's as well as enjoying all the Ski Circus has to offer (which could well be enough on its own for a week).

If you have any questions, just ask.

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Saalbach at New Year

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