Booking a first-ever Switzerland trip for January 9, flying into Zurich, visiting a friend in Neuchatel and then heading for the beautiful slopes of the Valais. My wife and I are solid intermediate skiers, but we hail from southern California, a region not known for its copious snowfall, so we don't get to ski as frequently as we'd like. We do respectably well at Mammoth ("American" blues/intermediate with a few easier blacks), OK at Whistler (wow, even the intermediate runs here are kinda hard) and not so great at Snowbird (ski down that? You gotta be kidding...). The general buzz is that "intermediate" is a higher standard in Europe than the USA, so I hope I haven't gotten us in over our head. Checked out a few Zermatt runs on youtube, but it seems like such an apples-to-oranges comparison with any other area I've skied it's really hard to tell how difficult their intermediate "red" runs are. Can anyone recommend some easier red/blue runs there, at least to start off? Any we should definitely avoid? Some of the runs look really narrow, which scares me more than steep, although either condition will bring forth my inner chicken.
Also, does anybody know if we'll need reservations for the train journeys (Zurich-Neuchatel-Zermatt-Zurich) and how much in advance you need to purchase a Swiss rail Flexi-pass ticket? Thanks in advance for any advice -Bob
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Hi there
We are Zermatt regulars, having first gone on honeymoon many years ago, and getting the bug badly from then on. So , it's only fair to declare at the outset that I am a bit biased! I think it's important to understand at the outset that Zermatt is a pretty unique place. Some of the things that people (like me) love, are exactly the things that put other people off. For example there is very limited ski in/ski out accommodation. The village has been there since the Middle Ages with skiing coming much later. There are some lovely old parts of the village still preserved. It is more of a winter holiday experience in the broadest sense, with as much emphasis on good food, and beautiful surroundings as hard core skiing (though there is plenty of that if you want it). I understand that what you say it generally true, in that a Zermatt blue or red may be tougher in general than a US one. However I have done all my skiing in Europe , and someone better qualified may be able to comment specifically on that.
There are three main access points onto the mountain, an underground funicular (Sunnegga), a long, slow but spectacular cog train (Gornergrat) worth doing at least once for the experience, and a modern bubble system at the south, Matterhorn end of the village. This takes you up to the highest skiing which is mostly on wide, gentle glacier slopes, ideal for a solid intermediate as you describe yourself. However, and forgive me if you know all this already, Zermatt and its slopes are at very high altitude, and unless you are accustomed to that, I would suggest you don't go straight up to the highest point until you have had a day maybe to acclimatise (or just be aware that you may feel a little 'funny') if you do go straight up.
A good place to start might be on Gornergrat, enjoy the train journey for the experience it is and you will find numerous relatively gentle blues and reds from the gifthittli chair at Riffelberg (these stops are all marked on the map). It is true to say there are some narrow runs in places, for example the run down from Riffelberg to Riffelalp has a narrow section along the side of the train track, the very top of the run down from the Hohtalli cable car is a zig zag path, before widening out , and there are other examples. But don't let that put you off! You are more likely to fall over through being distracted by the sight of the Matterhorn when you are on a gentle blue!
I don't know if this is something you had planned or not, but there are some great schools and guides in Zermatt, and it might prove a worthwhile investment to hire a guide for a morning or a day, not so much for a lesson, but to help you get the most out of the area, and to point out the places you might like to avoid. Assuming the weather is good, you could buy the add on to the pass to take you over to Cervinia in Italy where the slopes are generally benign, again a guide could help you with all that.
I think you will enjoy the experience. The mountain restaurants are truly fantastic, and a big part of the experience. Seldom have I lost weight on holiday in Zermatt!
Sorry for rambling on, hope that helps a bit. Happy to answer any other questions, if I can.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Agree with all Scotsgirls comments. Plenty of gentle blues and reds in the Rothorn sector too. Even up on the Matterhorn area, the glacier is truly blue. or even green if you were in France. EXcept for the altitude, (but I have Mammoth topping out at 3370 metres, so another 500 should not make too much difference). The decent back to Zematt via Furi, should be avoided, at least early in the week, if feeling timid. When feeling brave the 'National' balck is a fantastic run, and pretty wide
Do go though. Having skied for 40 years, we have rarely gone back to the same place more than once, but this will be our 3rd consecutive visit to Zermatt. Truly brilliant, unless you want ski in ski out, then it is pretty useless unless you stay up the mountain out of the village. Enjoy
OldCaliSkiDude, Zermatt is a great place to ski, good choice. You don't say if you have skied in Europe before but I've skied in Mammoth a couple of trips and I'd say the big difference ski wise is the runs will be busier, particularly the home runs later in the day and you are very likely to find more ice, particularly on those busy home runs late in the day when you are tired.
The big plus though is the views are stunning, I never tire of seeing the Matterhorn and go ski on the Italian side one day, lots of great crusing pistes there and see how the Italians don't have such a great view of the Matterhorn as the Swiss.
You may think you should focus on skiing but I think it's worth doing a couple of the wonderful mountain restaurants at least to take the full Zermatt experience, make sure you book though if you are specially heading for that part of the mountain.
And the hot chocolate on the Italian side, Testa Grigia, is my favourite, just don't let it cool too much before you drink it or it will be solid!
Have a wonderful time.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
+1 for the hot chocolate at Testa Grigia, the best I ve tasted. My husband, who is more hard core than me, prefers an espresso and grappa to get him going, another benefit of visiting a resort on the border with Italy!
Wow thanks everyone for the positive encouragement and informative replies. I totally get scotsgirl's point about skiing Zermatt being as much about a winter holiday as racking up numbers of runs and vertical descent, and am definitely looking forward to sampling as much of the acclaimed Valais cuisine as possible before going bankrupt.
Starting with the Gornergrat train makes a lot of sense. It's true Mammoth tops out at 3370 metres, but the upper 1/3rd of the mountain is all advanced/expert terrain and we generally go up there only in fresh powder conditions when the inevitable falls produce fewer compound fractures. I think by day 2 we'll be ready for the glacier paradise 3883 metre summit!
twoodwar, is the "National" run the #8 black link between Blauherd and Patrullarve? I thought I saw a video of it and it didn't look too bad, as you said.
Snowmac, skiing to Italy for espresso or hot chocolate sounds fantastic. Can't wait.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
OldCaliSkiDude, wrap up - in January Zermatt can be dark and cold - far removed from the sunny slopes of Mammoth I remember from 20 years ago
After all it is free
After all it is free
Number 8 is indeed the National- it starts as you come out of the lift station at Baluherd, if you want to stay on it, you need to keep right, there is a left fork that is a blue down to Sunnegga. It is relatively steep, but nice and wide, plenty of room to get those turns in, and a nice exhilarating run. Have fun!
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
scotsgirl, perhaps didn't make it clear in suggesting a guide that a guide is a highly qualified expert who you hire to take you off piste. Zermatt is famous for its extensive (and sometimes tough) off-piste skiing.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Guides will of course take you off piste if that's what you want. I don't think that's what oldcalskidude has in mind. What I meant was that from personal experience many of the schools will and can provide qualified instructors who will guide you around the resort (as opposed to focussing solely on a technique base lesson), for those who simply want to understand the resort layout better. There is even a 'gourmet ski guide' who focuses on making sure you get the best culinary opportunities available!
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Grampies .....You must visit grampies.....that is all.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
scotsgirl, OK, you didn't mean a proper qualified guide. Unless you are very rich it seems an unnecessary expense to have a guide or ski teacher show you pistes for 500-600 Swiss Francs per day). It isn't hard to read a piste map. Or OldCaliSkiDude could try skiing with the Ski Club of GB rep free. (Well, after the first day, if you want to carry on you would have to join the club, but that is comparatively cheap and has other advantages).
Due to its exorbitant exchange rate Switzerland is much more expensive than the Common Market countries. I decided after my experience of Verbier 2 years ago not to go there again till things improve.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
It was only a suggestion...! I'm sure he will have a great time no matter how they explore the resort.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
+1 for SkiClubGB rep. Free for first day and if you like it, join. Details www.skiclub.co.uk
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Hi Oldcaliskidude, you have the run correct. A few steep pitches but you can always see a relatively mild line, if you dont want to take it head on. A great run. Not sure where you are staying, - if booked or your budget level, but if like me you want decent accomodation at prices well below those of the Mont Cervin Palace, we have stayed for the last 2 years at the Matterhornblick hotel. Good position by the church and a 30 yard walk and 2 flights of steps to the ski bus stop.I would recommend this place.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
scotsgirl wrote:
It was only a suggestion...! I'm sure he will have a great time no matter how they explore the resort.
Sorry, that came out rather sharper than I meant. Yes, he'll have a great time whatever, I'm sure.
Is the Zum See restaurant just before the end of the run down under the main cable-car (ie USA tram) still doing its Zumli Schlumli (Sp?) hot chocolate with cream and plum brandy in it? Quite a few years since I was in Zermatt, I have to confess.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I think you might mean schumli pflumli? (There are umlauts in there too, just can't find them on my keyboard!) you certainly can still get that in most of the mountain restaurants (in varying strengths!) certainly one to put the hairs on your chest, and that's just the girls...
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
+1 for Hotel Matterhornblick or in the finances are easier the Hotel Sonne is very welcoming. On a low budget the Tannenhof is value too.
Do buy your rail card in advance as a 'foreigner' as you will get a much better price than paying at the station.
Oldcaliskidude
Sorry if this is a video you have already come across, but this one shows someone skiing all the way from the top of Rothorn down to the Patrullarve chair and give a pretty good impression of what you would come across on that run at least. The fork I mentioned earlier to keep you on the National can be seen at about 4.14
Snowball
That will be exactly right - it will be the house version of the more wide spread schumli pflumli. If it is like most other things at Zum See, you have probably tasted one of the best versions around!
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I think we will pass on the idea of a guide—our skiing abilities hardly merit it—but a quick lesson is sounding like a good idea. Thanks for the video link scotsgirl, the National run looks like something we'd go down on a good day. Seems silly to be planning out runs five weeks ahead, but a poor choice at Zermatt can be a commitment of several miles!
Lodgings-wise we are staying at the Hotel Couronne. We looked into an apartment to save food costs but most require a seven-day booking and we will be there only four days. Not expecting to cover the entire area but if we get in some good runs and successfully make the trip to Cervinia I'll be more than happy.
Schumli Plumli sounds like exactly the kind of thing I want to be drinking:)
As red27 mentioned, current forecast for Zermatt shows temps dropping to -22C. And I thought Utah was bad...Hope it warms up at least a little...brrr....
After all it is free
After all it is free
Hi OldCaliSkiDude,
For rail travel, can I suggest the Swiss Card, this gives you transport to and from the airport, 1st and last days and then gives you half price fares on the other travelling days.
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
Yes, he'll have a great time whatever, I'm sure.
