 Poster: A snowHead
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The long, somewhat tortured, slightly fractured 'organisation' of British skiing is being revised.
The various jealously-guarded national and regional bodies that look after racing and recreational sliding in the UK have formed a 'Modernisation Working Group' which includes - among others - the Ski Club of Great Britain, Snowsport GB, BASI and British Snowboard Association.
According to this interesting article on the SCUK website there is talk of one organisation doing the work of several:
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| One organisation will be able to buy in and offer better services in areas such as information, insurance, publications, web-sites etc. and cut out much of the present duplication of time and effort. There will be more direct links between members both as individuals and as Clubs to the governing body who in turn will be answerable back to the membership. It will also be able to provide a seamless progression for competitors, officials and professionals from grass roots to elite level. |
So this might affect us all. Any views on this? Do you prefer to stay independent of clubs and associations?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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'BOB', as the project is known more familiarly, if implemented, will have a negligible effect on leisure skiers and boarders. It is virtually entirely about improving the lot of British competitive snowsports. Via www.snowracers.net we have been very vocal about some of the shortcomings in the sport, and have agitated for change. There are promising signs in the minutes of the latest report. Chris Craggs and I have had contacts and face-to-face meetings with Snowsport GB's chairman Oliver Jones, and its CEO Jason Cockburn.
Back in June we wrote on SnowRacers:
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| Quite quickly we now see a different spin on the Modernisation Working Group (Grass Roots mentioned for the first time) and it is clear from the Minutes of the May Congress that SSGB acknowledges two responsibilities : 1/ the need for the Modernisation programme to move up a gear towards implementation and 2/ Grass Roots development – comprising both an integrated “face” for snowsports (eg an integrated website) and “the development pathway for aspirant racers” - hopefully including support and development of clubs. |
There is a way to go yet, and the recommendations are still to be implemented effectively, but we have always campaigned for improved communication, better use of resources, and perhaps most vital of all, a genuine and unbroken conduit that follows the development of racers from grassroots up. To date the emphasis of the governing body has been nearly all on the elite end of the sport.
Snowsport GB with all its member bodies is a relatively small organisation, representing a surprisingly small number of members. Economies of scale would not be greatly improved by better coordination, and will barely affect you or I. On the other hand if there was to be a small levy (extremely unlikely) on top of memberships of the likes of the DHO, Kandahar, or even the Ski Club, then we might actually have the funds to implement all these admirable aims! (At the moment there doesn't seem to be the infrastructure to oversee any efforts as proposed by 'BOB').
This is all about the competitive side of the sport, so will have no tangible effect on most snowHeads. However we would welcome any contributions from those interested in the racing side, or ski racers themselves, over on snowRacers.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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PG, the DHO already contributes significantly to ski racing, especially given it's small size
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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D G Orf, absolutely, in terms of the DHO's adminstrative help, race organisation, commitment to the development of young racers. I'm aware of its fantastic efforts, particularly of certain individuals such as Ingie. Coordinating some of the arrangements for which I was responsible at the pre-British Championships race camp in Les Arcs last April was a huge job, and of course no one gets any financial reward for involvement.
As always these arguments boil down to funding, and ski racing is and will remain a minority sport in non-Alpine nations - and it's not that much better off across the Channel in the Alpine countries. Snowsport GB, the home nations and club bodies are severely strapped for cash, that's the bottom line. The only possibility of a significant increase in income in the short term is some kind of levy on 'general' members, and I doubt that's even remotely possible. I quite accept that, as well. Would a 'snowHeads club' pay £1 a year to support our racers, as a compulsory part of a subscription? I imagine that would be just a little controversial!
Earlier this morning I added an article "in another place"  on the difficulties on obtaining significant sponsorship even in the US, which has mountains, money and Bode. What chance the governing bodies in the UK of improving the lot of our racers, even with better organisation and communication?
So no, I was only raising the subject as a hypothetically possible way of raising short-term funding - but one I quite agree is very unlikely to catch on!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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PG, don't forget that places like snowheads and even the SCGB have a number of non British members it might be considered unfair to ask them to help fund a rival countries up and coming sports stars on a compulsory basis.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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D G Orf, I don't know.. I'm funding French ski racing when I buy my club licence, whether I like it or not!
Seriously, you rightly raise one key reason why it would be unlikely to work.
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The extent to which these developments affect recreational skiers, as well as the racing community, will be a product of how a potential new national body projects itself to the everyday skier.
Since over 95% of British skiers are currently not members of any representative body (in the formative years of British skiing the percentage was below 30%) there is huge potential for some 'wising up' and 'levelling at' the ski population. Since the vast majority of skiers have clearly defined 'common denominators' in terms of their universal needs - information and insurance are the two most obvious ones - some inspired thinking could deliver something very interesting.
Watch this space. Hopefully the non-elitists and communicators will see that it's not a 'top down' process that gets results but a 'roots up' approach.
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The national bodies of France, Austria, etc don't project themselves in the slightest to the everyday skier. Nor do non-competitive skiers affiliate themselves to clubs, as a general rule. 'BOB' is all about better organisation of the competitive side, set up to look at Snowsport GB's overriding concerns, ie (from the Congress minutes):
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1. To run and manage an effective and efficient organisation: in which we need to get the basics right, in financial control terms, organisational management terms and in respect of our athletes, coaches, sponsors and other stakeholders from UK Sport through to parents – in communication terms;
2. To ensure effective, equitable, and consistent performance and selection regime: enabling the best to be identified, and supported in reaching the top;
3. To increase the funds available to support our athletes: through reduced waste and through increased sponsorship revenues;
4. To support our elite athletes when they achieve success: enabling each of them to gain maximum opportunity and return through their competitive career and beyond.
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If there are any significant spin-off benefits for leisure skiers I would be very surprised. The grass roots question is only significant in that there has been little coordinated effort going into finding new talent among youngsters and this needs addressing.
At www.snowracers.net we shall be following developments closely, and I shall report back to this thread when we hear more.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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PG, I would be more than happy if a percentage of my BASI sub went to fund our team - it's wasted money anyway! 
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easiski, what is the BASI sub this year? I must confess I've not renewed for some years. It seemed very reasonable last time I did - about £40 or something, and the last BASI 3 refresher I did was only £10 I think - how much are they now?
Are you not happy with BASI (he enquires, diplomatically)?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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David Goldsmith,
I believe it's about £55 this year - just gone up. Refresher course is £20 - very cheap for a day with a top instructor.
Yesterday I had the opportunity to chat with someone who is closely involved with the Modernisation Working Group. Very interesting stuff. Latest update dated 07/10 here:
http://www.basi.org.uk/upload_area/members_resources/Modernisationupdatepost0710.doc
So far in this thread only racing has been mentioned, but it is also intended to bring all the instruction / coaching qualifications under one umbrella. How do people, particularly those who hold BASI / ASSI qualifications feel about this?
If you want to read a bit more about it go to:
http://www.snowsportgb.com/
Click on committee and scroll down to the Modernisation section. Respone to the first questionnaire consultation is online. Of interest is the fact that only 26 people have responded. Surely a very low figure for what must be a contentious subject?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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There are also a couple of comments on the Modernisation process across at mysnowsports here and here. As an outsider, the whole structure looks well overdue for modernaisation.
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| beanie1 wrote: |
| So far in this thread only racing has been mentioned, but it is also intended to bring all the instruction / coaching qualifications under one umbrella. How do people, particularly those who hold BASI / ASSI qualifications feel about this? |
This sounds good to me as there are currently differing routes to earning the ASSI qualification beteween Snowsport England & Snowsport Scotland for example. My recent Snowsport Scotland ASSI course was run by Shona Tate, a BASI 1 instructor who I believe also holds some form of administative role within BASI(?).
Shona commented that the new(ish) BASI Trainee Ski Instructor course was modelled on the Scottish ASSI course & that the Scottish ASSI award gives exemption from the BASI Trainee course for students who want to do the BASI Instructor course shows that the organisations are already working together.
One group that could be affected could be those that hold the Snowsport England ASSI Club Instructor qualification as I got the opinion that Snowsport Scotland believe that the ASSI qualification should be the minimum required & therefore don't offer a lower Club Instructor qualification. I suppose the outcome will depend from which camp the power base emerges from.
beanie1, as a BASIist, what are your thoughts?
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You know it makes sense.
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as an (SSE) ASSI and an (SSS) APC i feel being asked to pay circa £1200(+time) to have to do the foundation course before being allowed to do my BASI 3 is rather steep. THEN and only then will BASI allow submission to take the speed test..............not encouraging me here.
I fully support the BASI qualification process, but new volunteer races coaches will all disapear if they have to follow a british instructors route 1st.
ditto for volunteer club instructors, which i believe is a nice stepping stone for aspiring instructors to help out teaching snowplough under ASSI (or higher level) supervision to encourage them. It should not be seen as a "proper" ski instructor qualification, nor do I believe is it aimed to be.
IF, and only if BASI incorporate this introduction/UK based stepping stone then i am all for it. Commercial pressures for gap year wannabees is all fine, but don't screw over the people that actual will stay in the sport and be your future BASI instructors. Mostly of the keen but skint or still racing youngsters wil get round to the being instructors if given a bit of encouragement, and likely posses the basic skill to go all the way to BASI 1. To get a BASI 3, yes make them work for it, but maybe recognise APC coaching and experiance as part of the process might help.
Put that in a document, add it to the racing pathway stuff and show me where to sign to vote for it.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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My understanding is that the individual qualifications will continue to exist as they do now, at least over the medium term. The differences will be in administration, and cooperation with regards exemptions for various courses.
What I don't know about is what will happen with regards being a member of BASI, or ASSI? Currently BASI members pay an annual subs, do regular refreshers and first aid courses in order to keep their qualification current, be able to work legally and get insurance cover. What is the situation with ASSI? Will the two become one in this respect?
paulhothersall,
If you would like to take part in the questionnaires, send an email to snowsportfeedback@gmail.com stating your name and which organisation you are a member of.
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Poster: A snowHead
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FAQ
, only one first aid course tho 
