So after around 10 weeks of being competent enough to be set free on a mountain and hopefully not do myself or anyone else harm, I still creep in at Level 6 on the IO ski school scale.
Do skiing gods like the one that describes himself in this gear thread actually exist, or will the OP suffer a reality check in the finish ?
A week on skis and they claim to be carving blacks, another week and they hope to be advanced!!
Maybe I'm just a hopeless case
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Mon 8-10-12 13:49; edited 2 times in total
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Megamum, given his user name and the fact he says he is " a bit of a maniac " I'd take it with a pinch of salt
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Megamum, Mrs. Piehole, taught by my good self, off the nursery slope doing basic (and pretty decent) parallel turns after about 4 hours, red runs all day 2, first (short) black run day 4. She then got a private 2 hour lesson where they asked how long she'd been skiing, "about a week", assigned an 'appropriate' (inappropriate) instructor who was then completely ill equipped to deal with someone zooming about quite skillfully.
I think it just depends on the individual, their fitness, fearlessness etc.
Not sure about the OP there - I progressed very quickly in terms of speeds, and turns but as you become more aware of what is good techique and bad technique (in my experience) you swiftly realise that your turns are z as opposed to S-shaped, you're skidding not carving, and there's no way in hell he's going to be advanced after 2 weeks..
I'd say it's easy to become an intermediate (ish) but the next step probably involves seasons and lots of lessons.
But as Mr Piehole says it does depend - I was keeping up with the fastest skiers in my TO group in Sauze and felt in complete conrol - people assumed I'd been skiing far more than I actually have, although has probably got something to do with the fact I'm fit, strong and athletic (relatively). As for carving blacks after a week - pull the other one, it's got bells on.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Megamum, It all depends on the person, their age and what other sports they do.
As an example I took a group skiing to Glenshee back in the 70's one guy we had with us had never skied before and by the end of his first day was skiing red runs in Scotland and looked pretty good. He was a skateboarder and sponsored canoe racer so his balance was very good, plus had no fear of anything, I still remember it pretty well as it shocked the hell out of me at the time.
Its rare have never seen anyone since make such quick progress, even my own son took longer to teach, but hey that's another thread
One thing I've noticed is that lots of people who start doing 'the other' (skiing or boarding) having already attained a decent competence in the first one, get along many many times fast than a total noob. Whether that's an aptitude thing (understands balance, understands the functioning of edges, can read terrain) or attitude (realises that falling over isn't much to be scared of or embarrassed about, is somewhat less inhibited as a result), is an interesting question.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
livetoski wrote:
Megamum, It all depends on the person, their age and what other sports they do.
Very much this. I once went snowboarding with a guy who'd been born and raised in Hawaii. It was his first week on snow but he could just do it (balance, form, steering) by virtue of having been on a surfboard all his life. As he explained "snowboarding's easy, the mountain doesn't move like waves do".
After all it is free
After all it is free
Mr Piehole wrote:
One thing I've noticed is that lots of people who start doing 'the other' (skiing or boarding) having already attained a decent competence in the first one, get along many many times fast than a total noob. Whether that's an aptitude thing (understands balance, understands the functioning of edges, can read terrain) or attitude (realises that falling over isn't much to be scared of or embarrassed about, is somewhat less inhibited as a result), is an interesting question.
I'd say it's very much an understanding of the mechanics of the thing. When an instructor talks about edging, you know what he means, what it does and can probably work out quickly how to do it without being shown all the exaggerated positions and actions to make it happen. You know how the shape of the ski/board affects how you turn.. the mechanics are the same.
It's like learning to ride a motorcycle after having driven a car, you know how the gears, accelerator and brakes all work, you already understand why and how the levels of each are balanced, all you need to learn is how to deal with the differences.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Megamum, I've had around 40 weeks on snow and I'm probably an IO level 7 (which I have been since my early 20s). For me it's not about progression, I'm never going to ski professionally or competitively, it's about enjoyment. If that's there, does anything else really matter? It's a holiday after all. Some people are naturally competitive and like to push their boundaries, I like to stay in my comfort zone and have fun...
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Megamum, I took me a long time to get going on skis, as queen bodecia, says how much you enjoy it is far more important than what level you are at. I took ages to learn as I only had a go when I got bored with my family disappearing for a couple of hours and coming back demanding food. Even skiing in Scotland frequently it took me quite a while to get off the beginners slopes as I am just not sporty and I lacked confidence.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
That post made me raise an eyebrow too
About level 6ish after three weeks in three years for me - not tried a black yet but last year in Meribel didn't come across any reds that caused me to struggle.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
It's very relative. I'm rubbish, but all my usual ski group think I'm good.
The more you ski, the more you realise just how good the good skiers are!
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
There is often a huge gulf between what people are actually doing on skis and what they think they are doing.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Is this thread about skiing or GNAR?
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Megamum, he's also talking about a black run - but how steep is his black run? If he's skiing somewhere relatively flat then the blacks won't be that steep.
If I compare myself with the people I generally ski with, I am not a very good skier.........I lack confidence on the true steeps and in deep powder, and on VW sized moguls.
However, I am a better skier technically than probably 75% of the skiers on our mountain (would be a higher percentage on a different mountain but we have lots of very good skiers), which is fine by me.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
queen bodecia wrote:
Megamum, I've had around 40 weeks on snow and I'm probably an IO level 7 (which I have been since my early 20s). For me it's not about progression, I'm never going to ski professionally or competitively, it's about enjoyment. If that's there, does anything else really matter? It's a holiday after all. Some people are naturally competitive and like to push their boundaries, I like to stay in my comfort zone and have fun...
Love it - me too
Megamum Don't get too good or you spend all your time on lifts. As others have said I think getting into the technical bio-mechanics of separation and angulation are what will take you into the realm of the 'advanced' (that and getting the right brand of 'pants' of course)
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
skinanny wrote:
However, I am a better skier technically than probably 75% of the skiers on our mountain :
This means skinanny is damn good. I'd be happy to be in top 50% on her mountain particularly on a weekday.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Apart from experienced ski racers has anyone ever seen a skier carving turns down a black piste in real life? Properly carving mind you, with clean transitions, linked turns and no pivots. I can only think of one skier doing this, and he was on a skwall (sp?) skiing down M in Courchevel.
Seem people really are freaks of nature and get incredibly good incredibly quickly. Put a fit mentally-strong 20-odd year old gymnast/martial artist/mountain biker/etc on a pair skis, and they'll quickly get better than the average middle aged sit-in-an-office-get-no-excersise-but-skied-one-week-a-year-for-a-decade sorta person.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Quote:
Apart from experienced ski racers has anyone ever seen a skier carving turns down a black piste in real life?
Nope, only in races.
Edit: Actually, yep - a Staatliche instructor in St Anton who's grandfather and father had won world cup races.
Edit again: Guess that kinda makes the same point!
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Mon 8-10-12 18:52; edited 1 time in total
I have seen people in the armed forces progress really quickly, women as well as the men.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
feef Wrote
"I'd say it's very much an understanding of the mechanics of the thing. When an instructor talks about edging, you know what he means, what it does and can probably work out quickly how to do it without being shown all the exaggerated positions and actions to make it happen. You know how the shape of the ski/board affects how you turn.. the mechanics are the same."
I'd agree with this to a degree. However, I still don't understand the mechanics of skiing. May be that's why it's taken me 30 years to reach level 7.
After all it is free
After all it is free
clarky999 wrote:
Edit again: Guess that kinda makes the same point!
It does! Plenty of people make quick progress. Plenty of people make slow progress. Nobody "carves blacks" in their first week of skiing. Very few people carve blacks in their entire skiing career, I know I won't.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Quote:
There is often a huge gulf between what people are actually doing on skis and what they think they are doing.
One man's carving is anothers...? Well, without having seen it I couldn't possibly comment (has a ever said that before?).
Quote:
Apart from experienced ski racers has anyone ever seen a skier carving turns down a black piste in real life?
Yes, but not very often, and certainly not by me.
I have a mate who was a very good soccer player (yes I know, but he really is a nice bloke) who was just about parallel, but certainly not carving after his first week. His only problem was that he had to hold somebody's hand yo get him into the gondola, and then he would only face up the mountain
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
I think most people who are reasonably competent at other sports, excluding the likes of darts and snooker, will adapt to skiing quite quickly.
I have always enjoyed sport however I don't consider myself a talented sportsman and have always had to work hard to get to a level in any sport where I thought I was doing myself justice. What that meant though was that when I took up skiing in my late twenties I went in with the attitude and confidence that I could crack it. It is not just about ability it is about attitude and determination IMHO.
Balance sports have been mentioned and that might be a slight bonus but many sports involve balance in their own way. You will not a kick a ball hard or far, strike a ball with a bat or a racquet well, make a tackle effectively etc. if your body position is incorrect.
The big difference I feel in skiing is the fear factor. Some people will be more concerned than others about falling or coping with icy conditions and steeper slopes and I feel that is a big factor that can hold people back.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Megamum wrote:
So after around 10 weeks of being competent enough to be set free on a mountain and hopefully not do myself or anyone else harm, I still creep in at Level 6 on the IO ski school scale.
Don't worry about what level you think you are. I honestly don't know what Level 6 on the IO ski school scale means but it doesn't matter anyway.
IT's holiday, so as long as you're safe and having fun you're on a winner.
This is my other-arf after 4 weeks skiing (she will do another week next year).
http://www.snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=88411
I could sit there all day and point out the things she could do to improve her skiing , but what's the point, it's our family holiday, other people pay me to tell em that stuff.
She (and I suspect, you) will get better at it as time goes on.
You shoud try and forget all those levels everyone says you're meant to be at after a certain number of weeks.
As long as you have a smile on your face at the end of the run that's all that matters.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I remember teaching a guy on plastic years ago who picked things up so quickly that initially I thought he was a wind-up from my instructor mates at the centre. He turned up as the only customer in the middle of summer on a 2x2 1/4 hr beginners course.
At the end of the course I was hoping he would be skiing linked plough turns with reasonable posture, turn shape and speed control and able to safely use the draglift to the top of the 90 metre intermediate slope. However every demo I did he was able to copy almost exactly so I just kept moving on with things. I asked him several times if he'd skied before as I just couldn't believe how quickly he was picking things up!
By the end of the 4 1/2 hour course he was doing competent parallel turns from the top of the 150 metre mainslope and using the chairlift to get there, along with decent posture and control of speed and direction.
This was pre-carver days too. Never seen anyone like him before or since and I've racked up somewhere near 20,000 hours of teaching in over 20 years. From talking to him about his sporting background I did find out that he was into rock climbing, hang gliding and free-fall parachuting so he had no problem with confidence or fear!
However as Wayne says it doesn't really matter as long as you enjoy what you do.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
General fitness is a massive advantage to learning any sport. Add to that a touch of confidence and people can learn things very fast.
The original post in Equipment R&Qs is a touch Dunning–Kruger.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Wayne, Thanks for re-posting that - my all time fave video...
She is at that perfect point where her confidence and technique are coming on leaps and bounds and she is attacking the mountain with relish and exploring with confidence and excitement.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Wayne, tell Mrs W she is very impressive, I must have missed the thread at the time. I wish I'd been that good at 4 weeks.
The point of this thread wasn't really about where I was I just spotted the comments in the other thread and recalled many on SH's saying about folks who believe they can do more than they can and I hadn't seen such a blatent demonstration of that for a while I just hope that chap doesn't get to the top of something one day and come a cropper through over confidence!!
I think I'm getting more confident. I can now get down reds without too much problem. I'm not carving them, but I can do them safely and enjoyabley. I've also done some really tough reds in bad............no..........bloody awful conditions and I think skiing in those poor conditions has given me a lot of confidence. This year I think I want to be more 'fluid' if that works as a concept - anyhow I know what I mean I'll have some more lessons at some point too.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
At the risk of being flamed....
I learned last year on dry slope, did about 8 x 1. 3/4 hour before my trip in January, also watched a tonne of ski vids and read 'the athletic skier' front to back a few times.
After a day and a half of skiing i was moved up to the top group (tagged along with a big group of year 11 / 6 formers with sister-in-laws schools trip). We did mostly reds and by the end of the week i was confident on all blacks in resort and staring to go off piste more and more...
I'm 27 and have played all kinds of sports (rugby semi-professionally) and keep myself in really good shape.
So in answer to OP i think it is possible to pick up skiing quite quickly.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I was an expert after a week or so
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Noooo.......Whitegold, don't do this to us......................one line, surely not...................... just one line?!!!!!
IMHO if a person has good balance, they can progress very quickly. When I see good skiers they are all very well poised, relaxed and balanced which gives the impression of fluidity. To improve my balance, there was nothing like getting stuck into some rough stuff off the side of the piste with dips, bumps, jumps, round trees and it was great fun!!
A good instructor is crucial - the quality of the lessons matters more than the quantity of lessons - to teach some technical stuff. Just watching little French kiddies following the leader all over the mountain is just so amazing - it helps to have a lower center of gravity and no fear. They don't care about levels...they just ski the terrain!!
If a person has a positive attitude and has fun, they can learn to ski quite well fairly quickly (assuming they don't have bad habits to get rid of). So, while i doubt 'the maniac' is carving blacks just yet, I don't doubt that he is skiing blacks and enjoying it. I hope he's brave enough to post a video.
FITNESS, LACK OF FEAR, natural balance. Probably in that order.
More often, it's apprehension (fear) which prevents the ladies from progressing as quickly as some chaps.
My Sis-in-Law took her BF with us one year. He was 38, a pilot and very fit and had never skied before. He was skiing the whole mountain with little style or technique on day one. By day 5 he was flying past the girls and giving them tips on technique, he wasn't the BF for much longer after that trip.
Starting young is a huge advantage.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
rob@rar,
Quote:
Very few people carve blacks in their entire skiing career, I know I won't.
Brandon says he will give you a lesson down Lanches in La Tania
After all it is free
After all it is free
livetoski,
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Mosha Marc wrote:
It's very relative. I'm rubbish, but all my usual ski group think I'm good.
The more you ski, the more you realise just how good the good skiers are!
So very true. I've been watching a little ski pr0n over the last week in anticipation of the arrival of winter. Looking at people skiing really big lines in AK, and comparing styles, I think you can start to see some of the differences between those who are very good skiers and have massive cojones, and those who are technically REALLY good skiers and have massive cajones.
For example, Rahlves, ex-racer. In this clip he talks about how he is skiing with guys who just aren't afraid so his challenge is not so much the technical aspect, as the MTFU-ness:
PierreYves Leblanc, to me, looks always in control of what's happening and, having more years of freeride under his belt, has both technique and a mastery of the fear aspect. Not the best clip, but his section in Out of the Shadows is simply unbelievable.
Some others, who clearly have amazing skills and have apparently no fear can look a bit, I dunno, sketchy. Harsh, given that I wouldn't go near what they do, but it's interesting that you can see differences in style and levels of control. Will now try to think of someone who fits this last bracket and will probably fail
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
meh wrote:
The original post in Equipment R&Qs is a touch Dunning–Kruger.
Seconded. I don't think the guy in that thread really knows how good a good skier is or how fast one can truly carve down a black.
I started skiing when I was 4 and considered myself to be pretty decent up until recently. But last February in Val d'Isere I saw a guy skiing telemark backwards down a red (I think it was on Cascade) like it was nothing. Then in March in Utah I tried keeping up with a couple of shop workers I met on the lift on a powder day. They lost me in under 30 seconds once we hit the trees, skiing as fast as I would ski in an open bowl.
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
, but what's the point, it's our family holiday, other people pay me to tell em that stuff.
I just hope that chap doesn't get to the top of something one day and come a cropper through over confidence!!
By day 5 he was flying past the girls and giving them tips on technique, he wasn't the BF for much longer after that trip. 
