 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm hoping that some of our British friends will be willing to share some information on your ski trip(s) to the US. When? Where? How long? Travel Agent? Tour Company? What'd you think? How could it have been better? How often do you come over? Have you had a ski vacation in Europe? Where would you like to go? And whatever else you'd like to tell us about your trip.
We're very anxious to hear from you. Either post or send an email.
R
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Welcome, RJR (saw you over on Epic, too)!
Make sure that you check the Resorts and Trips forums here, too.
What's your goal in collecting this information?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I understand that since '98, more British skiers have taken their ski vacations in the US than in continental Europe. It's a market I'm considering for a focus when trying to build my private lesson clientele.
If your resort is like Winter Park and some of the other Colorado resorts, you're seing a large number of visitors from the UK.
What are your observations?
R
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The only thing that has put me off the US has been the licensing laws that you have over there. For the last few years my parents have been keen for us to go as a family but - even as someone who is on the first lift in the morning and last run in the evening - I still value my apres-ski. I know that a lot of my friends have felt the same way, very keen to try the skiing but not very keen to sit in every evening. I love going for a couple of beers in the evening with friends after a good day's skiing and until I can do that in the US - next season - I'm afraid I'll be sticking with Europe.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I go the other way, in terms of value for money I would choose north america every time if my wallet permitted - although I would choose Canada not USA as the exchange rate is better, but leave that aside for a moment
in terms of daily cost, there's little difference between NA and europe for us brits - it's just that the travel to north america takes so long that you relly need to do 10 to 14 days rather than just a week, so the overall cost does go up.
the clincher is the attitude, service and genral friendliness. I've skiied Canada, USA, Italy, Spain and France and to be honest, well - have you cheked out the "anti-france" thread in the "piste" forum? Have a read of thatm you';ll be enlightened
We often arranage our own holidays to north america as the tour ops have a bad habit of basing the pricing on 4 people since each hotel room has two double beds. we can usually get our own holiday arranged significantly cheaper than using a major - although this time we're using a small imdependent sine they can more or less match our price and we have the added advantage of their backup.
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Hi RJR,
I've not skiied in the US but have visited there several times over the past 10 years. What would put me off returning is a combination of intimidating airport security/immigration officials and the soon to be introduced $100 visa fee.
When you're going on holiday, the last thing you want is to be made to feel unwelcome before you've even stepped foot off out of the airport.
Cheers,
Clive
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Clive - agreed. Although several of the resorts look mouth-wateringly good I'm putting my money where my mouth is and keeping it out of the US! 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Clive could you please tell me more about the $ 100 visa fee? That could be a major decision maker, not only for the money, but as you said for the hassle that
one has to go trhough...
Personally I'd go to the US (been thinking about it since 1991), I would like to at least once, never been able to because other things always seemed to come first.
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Before I started a family I had a two week break in Colorado. One week in a catered chalet/house in Breckenridge and one week in the Lodge At Vail. I also got to ski at Copper Mountain and Arapahoe Basin(IIRC). But that was about six years ago so the memory does dim.
The main drawback is, without doubt, the flight. Now I have children (aged six and three) it will be a good few years before I want to sit with them in an enclosed space for half a day. By comparison to the alpes, the scenery and skiing is on a much smaller scale and a little contrived with half a dozen or so runs running from the top to the bottom of single lift, so you don't feel to be travelling round an area so much. Having said that there are more bump runs (yeah!), huge powder bowls (akin to slopeside offpiste but on a bigger scale) and trees on runs which is great. So it's best to say that the skiing is a nice change.
The most pronounced difference though is cultural. I found that it was most definately a different country with a shared language and that I felt "culturally" closer to other Europeans (including the French). However, this made for a much more interesting trip than I expected. I would love to go again, but I may have to wait about ten years for the chance.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hi RJR,
Saw your message on epic, but I'll post the reply here (since ssh added a link)....
I've skied in Canada quite a bit and the US a little. Went to Tahoe for a few days in February (Squaw, Suger bowl, Alpine Meadows), it was OK. Unfortunately (for the comparison with the US resorts) I'd been to the 3 vallees the week before, and went to whistler the week after so they did seem rather small. The other thing I didn't like about the US resorts was the driving about meant that apres was a kind of disjointed low-key private affair. I find the collective buzzing apres atmosphere of France and Whistler is much better.
I think Squaw over-rates itself somewhat as I think it was the most expensive lift pass I've ever bought (including the exchange rate being 1.85:1 !!) - even more expensive than Whistler (which isn't cheap either compared to 3 vallees pass but at least they have the terrain)
That said the skiing in Tahoe was good, service was good. I would probably not go there for longer than a weekend (and indeed I'll probably do just that next weekend as it's convenient for weekends during business trips to San Jose).
BTW Clive, you do not need to get a visa if you have a machine readable passport, the only problem you'll have is if you get a new passport after this october (in which case you'll be required to have a biometric one - unfortunately you wont be able to get one from the UK passport agency until 2005!!), existing machine readable ones will be ok until they expire. As a reasonably frequent visitor to the US, the difficulty getting in hasn't really changed - immigration has always been strict and time consuming, the only change now is that if you happen to go through after a non-waiver country they spend ages finger printing and photoing them which holds things up. Still quicker than Heathrow after the 1.5 hour wait for your bags 
From my limited experience of US resorts (and ones that friends have been to), I think it is unfair on Canadian resorts to lump them in with US resorts in the N. America bracket as they seem completely different in many ways. Indeed Canada is my place of choice to ski despite the long flights - I don't think I would make the long flight to go to US resorts - haven't been to colorado, wyoming or utah yet though so maybe my opinion would change going to the bigger mountains.
Stuart
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Clive could you please tell me more about the $ 100 visa fee? That could be a major decision maker, not only for the money, but as you said for the hassle that
one has to go trhough...
Personally I'd go to the US (been thinking about it since 1991), I would like to at least once, never been able to because other things always seemed to come first.
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That'll teach me to read all posts before ading mine, I suspected that the passport fee was what in fact Stuarth explained, but I was unsure.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks for the input, all of you. Please tell us more about your experiences as well as what would make the US (Colorado specifically) a more attractive option for your skiing vacation.
R
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Poster: A snowHead
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Even though my kids aren't old enough to drink here, US and Canadian licencing laws have forced us back to our hotel rooms by 9.30, as once our meal is over, or even before, we can't always go for a drink elsewhere. Some friends of ours were in Whistler, and many restaurants wouldn't allow their teens in even to eat. We'll stick to Europe for the time being, although I may be persuaded back to Banff !! 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hi RJR
I first skied in the US (Colorado actually) back in 1988. I flew into Denver (Stapleton Airport then - I've not been to the new one yet!) picked up a hire car and stayed for almost a week with my cousin who married an American and lives in Gunnison (near to Crested Butte of course). I had one day in ski school there, and was impressed with the psychology which seemed to be used in the US Ski Schools of firstly finding something positive to say about your skiing before commenting on faults, things to improve etc! I also tried Telemark skiing there for the first time (leather boots and skinny skis in those days of course - things have moved on since then!). After the first week I moved onto a couple of other Colorado resorts - Telluride (great setting  ), Purgatory, Aspen and finally Breckenridge.
Since then I have visited several other USA resorts over the years - Breckenridge, Keystone, Copper Mountain again, and then (in the West) Jackson Hole, Park City, Lake Tahoe, Mammoth, Big Sky and Bridger Bowl, and in the East the White Mountains of New Hampshire and Stowe in Vermont.
As regards the plusses of skiing in the US as compared to Europe I would say:
1. The lift lines are better organised (singles lines etc) to make sure the chairlifts are used more efficiently (and the people in line are better behaved!)
2. There are many well groomed intermediate trails (which makes for flattering skiing)
3. Many/most of the resorts in the US have skiing below the tree line, which makes for some nice trails through the trees, plus the tree lined trails are better in windy or poor visibility conditions than bare mountain.
4. Many resorts have volunteer greeters to show first time visitors around the mountain
5. Where higher standard trails join into beginners areas there are slow signs which are enforced by patrollers
6.Food and drink are considerably cheaper in the US than Europe.
The minusses of skiing in the US are:
1. Longer journey and more expensive air fare makes it only worthwhile if you are staying for 10 days or longer. Direct flights are well worthwhile paying extra for, to minimise the journey time
2. Takes some time to adjust bodyclocks, and for some resorts (particulary Colorado!) altitude can take some time to acclimatise to
3 Lift Tickets are considerably more expensive in the US 
4 Some chairlifts don't have safety bars (seems crazy but I heard it was something to do with litigation)
Sorry for the long post - hope it's of use!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I've skiied with my family in New Hampshire for the last six years - but now that my children are 17 and 19 they don't want to go anymore - it's the drinking laws problem again! This year we've been to Austria (twice) and the apres ski is fantastic, such a great atmosphere. As far as the skiing is concerned I find it easier in the US - better groomed slopes, better signage, better lift queue control, friendly people who are willing to help you up rather than ski over you when you fall (which I do, often). Just sort out the drinking laws and we'll be back!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I travel to the USA a fair bit and have always found the application of the under age drinking law very closely observed (obsessively in many instances).
I have just got back from Colorado and in the nearest bar to my motel in Frisco they had a guy on the door with a torch checking everones ID including me (very flattering until I realised he was checking everyone) but I just accepted this as slightly more obsessive than usual.
I was astonished therefore to find other bars full of youngsters (late teenagers upwards) living it up, most buying pitchers of beer.
I did ask a couple of the locals why but they more or less shrugged their shoulders and didn't offer a response.
Perhaps some of our Colorado contributors could venture some ideas.
By the way Steve I had a great time, hope your instructor exam went ok.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'm afraid I wouldn't visit USA at the present for political reasons - I don't agree with a lot (most!) of the current policies especially in respect of international treaties/organisations/wars, ie Kyoto, International Court, UN, Guantanamo, Iraq & I'm putting my few quid where my mouth is. For American posters this is purely an Administration issue - once you guys vote him out I'm sure I'd be over in a flash! Just seems hypocritical at present
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Stephen Sadler wrote: |
| By the way Steve I had a great time, hope your instructor exam went ok. |
Glad to hear it! Why not post a trip report?
(I passed the skiing, but not the teaching. Oh, well... )
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I skied Banff and Whistler first. I then skied Tahoe when I saw the price of motels in one of those discount guides - $30 a room was fairly typical. I got a one way car rental to South Lake Tahoe and skied Heavenly, Sierra, Kirkwood and Squaw Valley. The trip also gave me a chance to see San Francisco, which I did not care for. I would never go to the US with a tour operator. Tour operators always want silly money for US ski holidays. You can get a whole room for the price of some of the nightly supplements tour operators want. In many places it is easy to make your own arrangements. In Olympic year, I went to Salt Lake City and managed to ski the 4 Cottonwood resorts and Park City from a base in the downtown SLC area - $45 a motel room is typical. Lots of good inexpensive restaurants too. Getting a drink is a real problem in Utah, despite all the spin the tourist office give you . Once you got a beer, it was difficult to find out the strength of it. Downtown SLC also lacked a decent cinema and supermarket and was on the dull side. People were nice and friendly - no problems with Mormons trying to talk about religion. No direct flights. Customs clearance is when you land and you have to go through security again on the next internal flight, which is tiresome.
Had to go to these places because the other man's grass is always greener - but in truth it is difficult to beat Europe for skiing alone. I was using the holiday as a means of seeing a bit more of America without the chore of sightseeing every day. This year, with the week dollar, I thought about another US trip but the snow is disappearing now on both sides of the Atlantic, so I will probably give it a miss. A big difference is you tend to ski lots of resorts in a US trip rather than stay in one particular resort. I cannot understand why anyone would want to stay in a resort like Snowbird or Alta - you just add to the expense and the apres ski would be unremarkable.
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| mjg wrote: |
| I love going for a couple of beers in the evening with friends after a good day's skiing and until I can do that in the US - next season - I'm afraid I'll be sticking with Europe. |
eh? Only thing I can think of is, you run afoul of their somewhat old age limit for beering (21). Apart from that, wandering into bars and obtaining vast amounts of beer is pretty easy here!
amazingly, you can buy grog in petrol stations, too.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I think it's a personality thing: do you think that the best things in life are well organised and carefully planned with rigorously upheld standards? If so, Colorado's your kind of place. Or do you prefer life to be a bit more idiosyncratic and unpredictable - brilliant in parts, but flawed? If so, go Europe.
At its best, European skiing blows the pants off Colorado - huge ski areas, massive vertical drops, incredible variety within one resort and the best food in the world. You Americans can't do much about that without reshaping the Rockies. But the low points of European skiing can be miserable - queues, crowded pistes, surly staff, old lifts and badly managed resorts.
What do you choose? For me, it's a toss-up. But I'm not going back to the USA until America stops being a bully on the world stage. And if I need a visa when my passport gets renewed, I'm definitely not going back. Shame, really - I've spent several months of my life in Boulder and Colorado is one of my favourite places in the world.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Never been across the pond. Don't agree with US attitude to world at present (I think Guantanamo Bay a scandal).
But...
Would try out a US resort if given the chance - need to go once before I meet my maker (also hope to get to at least one pole, see a whale, and walk on Mars).
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think Americans are far better at marketing and spin than Europeans.
Therefore Americans make US resorts sound really good.
This is compounded by the fact that lots of people go in for oneupmanship and use bragging rights about trips to far off resorts to make them sound better than they actually are. This works both ways of course. I am sure there are lots of Americans boasting about how good their ski trip to Europe was -but we do not hear about that,of course.
'low points of European skiing can be miserable - queues, crowded pistes, surly staff, old lifts and badly managed resorts.' says a previous poster. You can get queues anywhere. In theory, European resorts should be better placed, because they have far more lifts. If it was that bad, they could always resort to the US trick of employing someone to make sure no lift seat was left unfilled. Similarly, crowds should be less of a problem in a bigger area. Surly staff do not bother me. Though it did not escape my notice one year, when Tignes changed from using old geezers smoking Gitanes to very glamorous young women. Lifts do not get any older than Alta and yet it is well regarded. The lifts there go about as fast as the single person lift at Sauze d' Oulx where you have to take your skis off. Snowbird, next door, makes a huge song and dance about the fact it has a cable car, or tram as Americans prefer to call it. Nothing to write home about on this side of the pond. Badly managed resorts ? I think the French stations de ski are very well managed - if a bit soulless. Europeans also adopt good practice, so you now see tissues at lifts which used to be a practice peculiar to the US.
US skiing does not cost in for less than a fortnight. Lift passes and lessons or guiding are expensive. On the other hand you can always use the trip to buy all sorts of things a lot cheaper in the US
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You know it makes sense.
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WaistDeepInPow, where are you planning to be?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I'm thinking of doing a course that's being run at keystone. I've also got a couple of friends that live in Boulder so may spend a week or two with them before the course starts.
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Poster: A snowHead
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WaistDeepInPow, stay in touch and we'll at least touch base when you get here!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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After 20yrs and about 55wks skiing in the Alps, I just got back from Utah - first time skiing in the US. We did 9 areas in 13 days, and it was fantastic. The total cost worked out at £110 per day skiing which is slightly more than I would normally pay in Europe (£80-100), but not too bad. We stayed in a Days Inn in SLC and the exchange rate obviously helped.
Major surprises were:
1) The food - WAY better than we expected. Lots of good classy places in SLC and lunch on the hill was often very good and always better value than Switzerland in particular, where you are often asked to pay £10 per head for some godawful pile of cheese!
2) The tough skiing was VERY tough and I would urge anybody who thinks they are an expert to try some of the lines in Snowbird/Alta! I've skied in Chamonix, Verbier, St Anton etc, but was very impressed especially by the dudes on twin-tip teles skiing couloirs I wouldn't touch unless in perfect conditions, and probably not even then!
Only snag was unlike in the alps where people are either too scared or not knowledgeable enough (or can't afford a guide) to go off-piste, over there anything within the resort boundary is skied multiple times per week, so you get moguls EVERYWHERE. Most disconcerting for someone like me who learned to ski off-piste so he could avoid the moguls!
Overall it was a great trip, and I'll definitely go back as long as the exchange rate is favourable.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
1) The food - WAY better than we expected. Lots of good classy places in SLC and lunch on the hill was often very good and always better value than Switzerland in particular, where you are often asked to pay £10 per head for some godawful pile of cheese!
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I agree that in Salt Lake City restaurants were fine. I particularly liked Lambs and the Vietnamese place, Trang's I think it was called. On the mountain I was not particularly impressed. The usual boring self-service places. I do like the little family-owned restaurants in Switzerland and I do not begrudge what they charge for Rosti, or pasta, or whatever. I used to skip lunch or bring water, chocolate, apple in my knapsack - but skiing with ski club reps meant that I got corrupted and I ended taking lunch because everyone else was doing so. Fluhalp in Zermatt was absolutely magnificent this year and they had a great live band on. Nothing comparable Stateside.
SLC motels were dead cheap. I used the Ramada and Super8 in the downtown area. I think I would stay in Midvale next time and cut out the TRAX train to Cottonwood canyons. There is not much in the way of bars or entertainment in SLC downtown anyway
Skiing - yes there are tough runs. I think Jackson Hole bases all its marketing on Corbetts Couloir - but most people will not want or be able to do that.
Where are the miles and miles for the Great British Piste Basher ? Utah Interconnect maybe -but a day on that costs as much as a weeks lift pass in Europe.
I would definitely ski in The US again - but my reasons would not be based purely on skiing.
Good exchange rate, shopping opportunities, somewhere different all factor in.
Colorado is on my list but I would not be prepared to pay top dollar for accommmodation. I think I would also need a car for the whole fortnight to move from place to place.
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FAQ
I ended my inauspicious Eldora career in February when they decided my schedule and their requirements weren't compatible.
Not that that ain't a cool thing 
