 Poster: A snowHead
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Following on from my question about how snug is "snug", would it be worth having my existing boots foam (or whatever material is popular these days) -injected to reduced the excess volume and create a better fit? I'm thinking that the shell is technically too big for me, but what if the lining is snug - surely it'll will be better at transmiting my foot/leg movements to the ski? Or, as per most things to do with skiing,
is there some counter-intuition at work here?? 
And (just for my future reference) does anyone have a rough idea of how much boot injection costs?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Manda, I paid £139 or so at Profeet in London. If the shell is too big, there may be too much space to fit the injected liner. the fitter should be able to tell. I certainly had a nice snug fit although it is compressing more rapidly than I expected. Also, even the standard foam is very firm, rather like a race boot. I'm very pleased in general with mine.
You might find it a better experience to try Zipfit liners? If you don't want the very close fit that custom liners will give you.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Whenever buying boots the boot fitter should do a shell check. This is performed by putting your bare foot in the shell and inspecting the space around the foot. Once centred in the boot there should be around a cm of space between your foot and the shell - I normally say a finger, but what size is a finger? A professional will be able to work out if the shells fit you or not, but you can do this test at home to give you a rough idea.
As David says Zipfits are a very good alternative for a custom liner, foaming does tend towards high performance skiing and can frankly be uncomfortable.
Zipfits, however, are warm and long wearing but it would be a waste to put them in a shell that's too large. Expect to pay around £120.
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Manda, I recently had a pair of foam liners done for my boots and sadly one ended up too snug leading to pain in that foot, the other felt not much better than a normal liner. Sadly the fitter could not "see" anything wrong with them and I was sent on my way with my tail between my legs  They're now bin material sadly.
You really need to find a shop that has done quite a few in the past to get some experience. If the fitter has only done a couple I would be tempted to walk away and try elsewhere.
Luckily I have found a fitter that has done quite a few so will be trying again in the next couple of weeks when the liners arrive.
Once you've tried skiing in a foamed liner its very hard to go back to skiing in a normal liner as the control you have is so much better.
I too have very low volume feet, though not narrow, and have had a real nightmare getting boots to fit. It appears that foamed liners are a good solution though as has already been mentioned, it may be worth you getting a pair of shells a full size smaller first before getting the foam liners.
I was always getting fitted in a size 27 shell by fitters. In the end I size fitted myself a full size smaller and have been a lot happier. If your cranking your buckles this would be worth considering.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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If the shell is only a little too big (e.g. ca one mondo size) then a footbed might take up enough volume and along with foam injected liners might make the boots useable.
If the shell is clearly too big, foam liners will only be a temporary solution and you would be throwing good money after bad, best to start again. Boots are too important to have badly fitting ones.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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rockyrobin, who foamed them? Sounds like a terrible result. My liners aren't as good as I was led to expect, but they're a massive improvement over stock ones. Probably the same degree of improvement in fitas comparing custom footbeds with standard insoles.
That said, I wouldn't recommend them unless you have serious problem feet or want extra precision and IMHO (very humble I will add) I'm not convinced that most people on modern skis will get much out of that. A good bootfitter should be able to get standard liners to be comfortable.
You're mention of smaller shells, well, as a few people have mentioned to me, starting with a boot that fits is a good start. I would have a nightmare if my shells were too small. Sounds as though you are going to the wrong shops and getting generally pants advice! Bad news all round.
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Manda,
If they are that wrong, sell the boots and start again. I wouldn't go trying to right a wrong, as DB says, good money after bad...
New kit for the season... hurrah..!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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parlor, when the bloke at Meribel fitted me for foot liners a few seasons back he did check my boot volume in that fashion, and he considered they were a "just" a bit too roomy - and suggested getting the liners "done", or buying new smaller boots. Didn't have the money at the time, so left with just the footbeds....
Had a look at Zipfit - thanks for the link David Murdoch. They sound great. Has anyone used them?
Are they the only brand of mouldable inner on the block?
And what's the deal with mouldable inners - if every boot these days comes with its own set of mouldable inners, then what's the point of throwing them away and replacing them with something like Zipfit?
(see, told you I didn't have a clue when I first bought my boots - at least now I know what I don't know, if you know what I mean).
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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My boots go all the way up to 11.
(sorry, I was watching Spinal Tap last night)
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Wear The Fox Hat, 
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Am I a complete freak? I never really have problems with boots, tried custom liners but could barely feel the difference, have footbeds but think they are a waste of £100.
I skied on my first pair of boots for too long and flattened the liners but change now every 10 weeks of skiing, keeping the shop liners as the are fine when you buy them but compress over time. I occasionally have pain in one arch, but that is without fail due to me cranking the top buckle on my shin, relax it for a lift and I am fine.
To be fair, I ski very hard, off piste, bumps, steeps, everything and don't have any difficulty. The only thing I would say is that I'm not sure you can get both comfort and performance.
Am I just lucky?
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You know it makes sense.
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Yes. You apparently have a perfectly aligned body and are also probly young, and well trained, and ski every weekend.......
Stop it. You're making me very jealous. 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Sorry, have to go - I have some vomiting to do.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ithengyew
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| flicksta wrote: |
| I do however have an excellent body. |
Whose is it, and where do you keep it?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anna Friel has been out of the public eye for a while.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Manda,
Sorry to interrupt flicksta's self-appreciation (!!!) but I know someone who had foam linings. The foam initially sets pretty solid so she was in a world of foot pain for a few days before the foam softened slightly.
I also know another girl who's had spongy foam glued to the outsides of their liners to take up some of the excess room in her boots. She had custom liners but isn't getting on with them. They're uncomfortable, considering they're designed for comfort and because they're built for comfort, they're not performing. I think she's going new boot shopping soon...
I'd recommend trying to work with the original liners before trying out new ones, unless your old liners are past their prime of course in which case you may as well buy new boots!
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Snowy, the custom liners I know are the Zipfit ones and the Conformables. I think there's a third brand but can't recall what it is.
Conformables aren't really built for comfort...the foam is firmer than what arrived in my "race" boots (no, they're not plugs hence the inverteds). I think Zipfits claim to be comfortable and performant.
Would I get foamed liners again? Almost certainly.
Are they as good as marketed? Certainly not.
Here's another brand I found http://www.intuitionsports.com/products.htm
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Manda,
Not all mouldable liners are created equal. I've heard good things about intuition liners. I have Strolz boots (including Strolz liners with can be purchased without the boots http://www.larryadler.com/ski_equipment.cfm?Category=23&Product_ID=1416 ) and a pair of Garmonts with some heat-mouldable G-fit 2 liners. The Strolz were foamed by injecting a liquid through tubes into the boot liner, this gives a good fit even if the space between your foot and the boot shell differs considerably. The heat moudable liners are a complete liner which is put in an oven and then put in the boot. As it's not a fluid that sets the degree to which the heat moudable liners can expand & contract to fill up the spaces is less. With foam injection you put as much or as little in to do the job, with heat moudable it's pretty much a set volume that gets moved around.
http://www.strolz.at/english/gesamt.htm
Both boots are comfortable but perform for me far better than any 'off the shelf boot' I've tried.
From my experience boot fit involves a degree of luck i.e. if you are lucky to have feet than happen to match an off the shelf boot shell then it's a lot easier.
Alber Sport (Dorfstraße 15, Tel. +43 5446 3400) in St Anton, Austria offer many different boots (inc Strolz).
If you can get over to the states Jef Bergeron is also highly rated ....
http://forums.epicski.com/showthread.php?t=22253
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