 Poster: A snowHead
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After a successful first family trip to Serre Chevalier this year, we are considering La Plagne, Piesey Vallandy or Les Arcs for 2013. Trip would be for two families, with four kids aged 7 to 10 between us.
With a week's experience, we are all very happy on the greens, all OK on the blues and - to varying degrees - the adults can get down easy reds without sustaining major injuries (but it's hard work...don't laugh!)
This being the case, the Paradiski area seems ideal as it seems to be filled with masses of blues and reds. However, from the piste map I can see hardly any greens, and certainly no long ones; quite a contrast to Serre Che. Although we'd like to progress to ski mainly blues/reds next year, some nice long easy greens would still be desirable, especially for the first few days!
So my question is, are blues and greens effectively combined in Paradiski? Or is it just 'harder' than Serre Che and there are genuinely no long green runs there?
chemistry
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I would put La Foret above Vallandry, and arpette in the green category. Certainly My kids were ok on them after a couple of days when first learning.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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chemistry, it is definitely not harder than Serre Chevalier, I've been to Paradiski 5 times. There are plenty of easy runs for you to get used to.
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whats Ser-che like? will it have enough snow after 25th March? Considering a family trip last minute...any advice appreciated
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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There's a green that goes under the UCPA in La Plagne. If you look on here you can track them down http://www.paradiski.com/skiplan/
in Plagne Centre and Plagne 1800.
I wouldn't worry though, a lot of the blues are pretty mellow as well and if you get lessons the instructor will show you where the easy ones are.
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| Hells Bells wrote: |
| chemistry, it is definitely not harder than Serre Chevalier, I've been to Paradiski 5 times. There are plenty of easy runs for you to get used to. |
Thanks - as the confirmed Serre Chevalier fan that I know you to be, would the Paradiski area be a good choice for next year then? Sounds like it might...
We loved Serre Che - not just the skiing but also the whole laid back family friendly atmosphere, scenery, etc. - and have no desire to go somewhere with loads of designer boutiques or amazing apres ski (no offence to those who like that sort of thing).
chemistry
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Many years ago all the greens in Les Arcs were reclassified as blues. They had not got harder just the green class was dropped. A zone tranquil or mauve replaced them with whole areas such as that above Arc 1800 designated for beginners and nervous skiers. The pistuers patrolled them and pulled over skiers going too fast in their opinion. Unfortunately these Mauve areas do not go anywhere. Les Arcs now only has 4 classes of piste Mauve, Blue, Red and Black.
If you want to see where the very easy blues , formally marked as green, are then my earlier post of an old Les Arcs piste map shows them http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=87252
John
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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johnE,
Perfect - thanks!
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As a further suggestion for Les Arcs. There is a classic circuit for first week skiers in taking the transarc from 1800 up to the col du Chal, then down Plan Vert and Cascade to Pre St. Espirit followed by Belvedere back to 1800. With someone who has only skied a few days it takes all afternoon. There are numerous watering holes on the way.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I've never understood why Les Arcs classified some of the pistes as blue when in any other Euro resort I've skied in they would be classed as green. Most confusing for people who are using the piste map to decide whether to visit or not.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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chemistry, I would echo what others have said about La Plagne. You'll be fine and most of the blues will be perfect for you from your description of abilities. One of those to avoid initially is the blue that goes from the top of the Grande Rochette gondola down towards the top of the Aollets lift. The top section of that is a little 'tight' for a blue but this section is easily avoidable with a little planning. Disclaimer: I haven't been to La Plagne for a few years now so this may be out of date info.
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Oh yeah Schuss in Boots, there's that blue up there that's dead steep and pretty scary if you're new-ish and not expecting it! Very wide though so easy to traverse. I think that's off that gondola? Nearly made a mess in my pants when I got taken down that on the first day of my second week skiing...
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You know it makes sense.
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We spent a week in La Plagne this January as a family of four, I am a reasonably good skier confident on all blue, red and some blacks and my wife and two children (10 & 5yrs) had never skiied before. They had morning lessons all week while I clocked up some miles around the whole area. In the afternoons we skiied together as a family, the first couple of afternoons were up and down the green in Plagne Centre to practice simple technique which was fantastic with just a short chair lift ride so little time wasted sat around on lifts. The rest of the week I basically follwed the girls on all the routes they had covered with their instructor and I was very pleasantly surprised at how much they covered and the variety of blues they were completely at ease on. Together we covered most runs in Centre, Soleil, Belle Plagne, Bellecote, Arpette, Montchavins.
In short its a fantastic resort and with one week experience already there is more than enough skiing on blues to keep you all enjoying the holiday all week!
I would thoroughly recommend Oxygene Ski School in Plagne Centre, very organised and super instruction pitched at exactly the right level for my family!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Agree with Schuss in Boots, re Grande Rochette, but there is no need for you as beginners to use this gondola, far better off using Colorado and La Bergerie for getting up the hill and to then link up to the other resorts. The runs straight off the top off Grande Rochette would put most beginners right off. I'm sure at end of week 2 you would do it with few issues though.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I find more and more resorts have either re-classified greens as blues (or never had them in the first place) other than the main nursery slope. I think you'd be better off getting specific recomendations form the folks here on which blues are a greeny blue and which are a bit more challenging. IME blues can be a bit hit or miss (in Les Arc and LP too) some are very flat tracks others have steep(ish) section but flatten out for a great distance to justify the blue grading.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
IME blues can be a bit hit or miss
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which is why re-tracing routes done with a ski school, as described by jirac18, is such a good idea. I like the fact that he "followed" the girls too. If they fall, it's helpful to be able to help them recover skis, get the bindings open, tell them how great they are, etc.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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La Plagne is perfect for beginners. To start with avoid any blue runs off La Grand Rochette and Roche Del Mio (inc le lavessaet down the back towards Champagny) however once more confident these runs are are genuine blues (they have short steeper sections)
Love the linked post above which shows old piste maps (and former green runs)
Les Arcs side also has some nice runs, as mentioned above Le Foret is a long "blue" which winds down the moutain and is very gentle. For pogression, Red runs above Peisey Vallandry are not particularly difficult (wide and not overly steep - avoid combe) In fact all of the long windy blue runs (Left to Right or Right to Left accross (i.e. not down)) on the map between arc 1600, 1800 and Peisey Vallandy are roads and quite gentle.
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Thanks all - very helpful!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Run classifications are all nonsense anyway, most of the greens in Val d'Isere had more gradient on them than the blues.
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andytb,
I'm sure you are right...all part of the learning curve for me...!
chemistry
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Learnt to ski in La Plagne, it's great for beginners and I'd managed to hack my way down an easy black by the end of the week.
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chemistry, I agree with other snowheads that the Paradiski area would suit your needs next year. Having stayed at all the Les Arcs villages, a base at Peisey Vallandry has benefits. For example, fairly easy access to all parts of the Paradiski area. It's on the Les Arcs side but handy for the Vanoise Express cable car across to La Plagne. Also it's well placed for many easy runs and tree-line skiing for when visibility is poor. There's less in the way of shops and bars than the larger villages, if that was important to your group, but it has all essentials.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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chemistry,
We were in Belle Plagne for New Year, two families (and a couple of extra adults) , 3 children 2x 4 year olds and 1 x 6 year old. Our son (one of the 4 year olds) had 2 ski holidays under his belt, but the other 2 didn't have any, and the other 4 year old had only skied a couple of blocks of lessons on the dry slope previously. They all found the area fine to ski and plenty they could tackle. Not sure where they went on their lessons, apart from a couple of times we bumped into them, as being so young they didn't really know! We all really liked the skiing there, and would certainly return. I'm sure it will also be good to do a wee bit of mileage and not just up and down runs, go a wee tour so to speak, which will be an adventure for the kids. We did consider taking ours over to Les Coches, I'm sure they could do it ski wise, but with them being so young, it would take them a bit too long and would be too tiring, especially after morning lessons. I did find it took me a bit of time to get my bearings with some parts of the area, especially when we headed to La Plagne, but that was probably just me!
I agree with what folk are saying re green runs, and now it is starting to make some sense to me, as my 1st ski holiday was in Serre Che, and I remember green runs, yet I can't really recall a holiday since (and that was around 15 years ago), where there have been green runs, apart from a nursery area.
We stayed in the Crystal Club hotel in Belle Plagne, Hotel Turquoise. It was fine for the purpose, rooms are probably the most basic I've been in, but you don't spend much time there anyway. Food was pretty good most nights, staff were great, but it is real ski in ski out, so perfect for kids and the ski school meets on slope outside hotel. It had a large room in the basement that was great for the kids, and us. It had a tv with dvd and tons of bean bags on the floor, great for lounging about on watching a film. No-one seemed to use it apart from us, so was great! Often the kids would just chill out down there watching a film, while we had a beer or 3, sometimes we were all down watching a film.
Definately enjoyed Belle Plagne, if you want anymore info just ask and I'll try and answer.
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chemistry, as another La Plagne and Serre Che enthusiast, I think you'll be fine.
Was in Belle Plagne in January which offers some good, genuine blue options plus a rather nice "green" run down through the resort towards Bellecote where the Arpette chair accesses some ideal blue runs back to BP. Once you're back up to speed, so to speak, there are some terrific options to be honest.
In the main, I'd say the run grading is fairly comparable between the two resorts and both provide a good sense of travel.
I did a trip report from Jan this year here.
The place we stayed at could suit your group size too - just FYI.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Thank you all for the information; it's much appreciated!
Looks like the Paradiski area will suit us perfectly, but any advice as to whether La Plagne, Piesey/Vallandy or Les Arcs would be the best place to base ourselves?
chemistry
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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chemistry, as mentioned in my post above, Plan Peisey offers easy access to both the Les Arcs and La Plagne areas. It's also easy to get on comfortable blue runs, whilst offering decent red runs for more challenge. I'd avoid staying at Les Arcs 2000 and 1950, mainly because it's at the extreme end of the area but also because it can be very bleak in poor weather. Montchavin and Les Coches are similarly well placed for access to the Vanoise Express link cable car. However I think they can be tricky to ski back to in icy or hard-packed snow conditions, so beware of that. Belle Plagne and Plagne Bellecote would also suit your needs I think. Bellecote has a bit more in the way of shops, food, etc. One thing that annoyed me on my trip this season was that several of the chairlifts in the Montchavin/Belle Plagne / Bellecote zone seemed old and desperately slow. Not ideal with the temperature at -15c. Generally on the Les Arcs side the key lifts seemed more modern. Happy to comment further if you've anywhere specific in mind later.
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Arc 2000 and 1950 are two lifts from the Vanoise Express and 2 back again.
However Villaroger and Champagny are att he extremes of the combined resort.
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You know it makes sense.
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johnE, for blue access, 2000/ 1950 is only one lift from the Vanoise... (Bois de L'Ours): to use the two lift route - Marmottes and Arcabulle, you've got to be a pretty solid red skier to get down that pitch on Reches - after the gap to the top of Derby.
We took our 4 yr old over there the blue way after her 2nd week, and she was fine. Took a while, I'll admit (but now she's 10 she wouldn't admit to any such thing...).
1950 is great for a family holiday, being traffic free and designed for true, and I do mean true, ski in / out, with all amenities within a couple hundred yards tops of wherever you are.
However Peisey probably does give you more options for going back and forth between the two areas, and as above if the conditions close in, a better experience if you decided to stick it out, outside.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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chemistry, one of the good points for LP (and LA) are the ski in/out options. Again, plenty to chose from - we were only 50m from the piste, for example.
LA is very accessible from Belle Plagne - run down to Alpette chair in Bellecote and then 2 blues. To be honest though, I'm not sure you'd come close to running out of options by staying and skiing in one area or the other.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Fri 9-03-12 19:42; edited 1 time in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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chemistry, Lots of easy runs in Les Arcs as those above have noted. The paths that cross the forest areas are very innocuous in fact sometimes I wonder how you keep going along them. The beginners slope under the chantel lift is another good area, and there are beginners areas up above the Vallandry area that you can reach by chair, getting a decent height for a good view and then ski out through the forest paths. In fact I should think you could do as a circuit.
Starting vallandry area, Peisey 61 chair, beginners area, Foret, Maitaz, first half of Transarc gondola, drop down to plan bois, then retour plan piesey back to Vallandry and there would be very little that would challenge you much more than a green would. Of course you could also do the start from the Transarc as well depending on where you were staying. You could also spend time in the beginners area under the transarc and chantel left as I mentioned above and do the rest of the circuit later.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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any of the arcs, plan-peisey, plagne centre/soliel/bellecote will be fine. Avoid villaroger, champagny & montchavin for being on the extremities of paradiski. plagne 1800 is ok but you will be on the bus to make lessons.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Cheers everyone! I have been moved to make a donation to Snowheads as a small thank-you for all the help.
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All these resorts you mention chemistry are good but what you should bear in mind is that they have quite large ski areas. So you may end up paying for a lot more skiing than you will use. These 3 resorts have access to pretty massive ski area and therefore are amongst the slightly more expensive resorts you will find in France and I am not talking just in respect of lift passes. Accommodation, eating out will cost you more too. You may find that you could probably get better value for money in staying in resorts with smaller ski areas.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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XPeak, makes a good point. The lift passes for the large ski areas are only a good deal if you can cover the resort from edge to edge. Perhaps something smaller where the passes are cheaper as well as everything else and the runs all end up at the same point so you can't get lost or stuck in the wrong valley.
We skied Aussois for the day this year and all runs lead back to pretty much the same point. There are 40-50Km of piste which is loads for many people.
Hemsedal in Norway is a good option as well (although the costs are not so good). Wide slopes, long greens with diversions onto blues/reds, lots of chair lifts, all the runs end up at the bottom.
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Hi Chemistry - good to chat again - I am also doing research for 2013 and also a big fan of Serre Che as you know but I agree with Xpeak not sure if an early intermediete would need an enormous area like La Plagne lift passes far more and when I went there years ago for my 3rd trip I didn't ski anywhere near as much as my husband did - I certainly didn't go anywhere near the glacier -In Serre Che even my friend who is a timid intermediete didnt cover even a quarter of it . Not ruling out larger areas as we are a mixed party but a friend has suggested the ski welt area in Austria (also big I know)( I still want wide cruisy runs - easier to progress onto reds) we were all a little disapointed with the narrow green - more like a road running down to Chantemerle I like to ski back down a wide run home at the end of the day. Anyway thought might look into the villages around that as they all have skiing in their own villages plus access to the whole of the ski Welt area which is great if you fancy getting some miles under your skis - Westendorff looks a pretty town - Will keep you in touch with the research - let me know what you decide too - though early days yet. So sad it is all over for this one - Did you get an extra sneaky trip in? Take care - Kay
PS having said all that the Paradiski area is fantastic first time I ever skied on really good snow - we went when our children were 13 and 10 they had private lessons and came on so fast - stayed in a lovely chalet in Champany en Vanoise but had big cues in the morning as the only way up was a gondola and the run back was too difficult fo me and the children. But fond memories of us all skiing together as a family - I am sure you will have a great time there lots of choice.
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Did look out for you with the fantastic description - Thought I saw you once skiing past a restaurant in Serre Ratier but I can't get out of those deckchairs fast enough.Seems just a long wait to next year - will you be going in the half term week? If that is the case maybe a bigger area (like Serre Che-Paradiski even bigger) would be good as the skiers have plenty of pistes to spread out on after the initial lift. Although, Serre Cherre was fantastic last year the only day we ever queued for a lift was the windy Wednesday when the bubble lift at Chantemerle was closed so the only way up was by the chair. If you are going at half term check other countries holiday times as that can affect it a lot ( we were lucky last year with the zone that was off in France and Italy not on holiday).But heyho I am enjoying the planning - just spending a little to long on it- very time consuming but fun. What is the ski place at Hemel like? I would like to have a practise at the old turns again before next year as I spend the first couple of days playing catch up- Thinking of having some more lessons next year. One private lesson I don't think was enough - Sorry just read the title of this thread and I seemed to have messed it up. Will leave immediately. Happy planning K 
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FAQ
, hence my enthusiasm for planning the 2013 outing 
. In the meantime some trips to Hemel are planned, to keep our skiing skills up to scratch.
