 Poster: A snowHead
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just saw an article detailing new regulations for driving in france, has anyone heard of this? the satnav thing could be interesting when we have an in-built satnav in our car and i'm not even sure if we can switch off the speed camera's in france........
many of us rely on Satnavs to get us from A to B and back again. Some of them are set up to alert us to the presence of speed cameras. In France, this is being outlawed. So, now you’ll have to turn off this feature, or not have a navigation gadget at all.
The new ruling came into effect on 1 January. Equipment which detects a radar signal has always been banned in France, but the new laws take matters a step further by banning ‘driver aids’ which incorporate the data that warns of speed camera presence. Arguably, this information is already available with such sites as Michelin Maps, but the new law stands.
Some satnav manufacturers have stopped the inclusion of speed trap data in their latest devices, but existing users can get a software update – to remove the offending data! We’re told that Tom Tom has introduced updates to remove the locations from their systems.
If it’s not removed and you are found to be in possession of such an item, then there are fines up to 1500 euro and / or six points on the driving licence.
Another unusual measure is that drivers will, from this year, have to carry a driver’s breathalyser kit. Such equipment is already being introduced on public transport, but drivers will also be expected to carry the gear. The breathalysers will allow drivers to check whether they are under the legal limit before driving. Drivers caught without one in their car will face a 17 euro fine.
Alpine drivers should be able to buy the breath-test equipment cheaply from their hire centres too, at only a few euros. Oddly, we’ve read that there will be no actual change in the drink-drive penalties in France – which currently mean that, unlike the UK, there is no automatic ban of at least a year if caught. However, drunk drivers still lose six points from their licence, which is a tough call in itself.
THOUGHTS PLEASE?!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Excessive legislation? In France!?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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drink driving in france is like a national hobby in parts, carrying a kit is a joke!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Hmm. Interesting. Come to think of it, I don't think I remember hearing the warning beep for the speed cameras, recently. I updated my maps so maybe they were taken out then. I got no warnings on the Italian motorways either, though their are lots of signs warning of speed checks by the "Tutor" system (whatever that is). Until reading this thread I hadn't really noticed the warnings had gone.
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many of us rely on Satnavs to get us from A to B and back again.
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Very useful when it gets complicated, in towns etc, especially if you have nobody capable of reading a map. But hardly essential to get from Calais to Chamonix etc. Or back again. French roads are pretty well signposted!
we are danger of becoming infantilised with all these gadgets. Amazing how well we managed to get around without them, in the olden days, even in foreign parts.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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We don't have sat nav that works in France, but the Via Michelin route finder tells you the exact location - so given I'm following the printout I can tell my OH all about the speed camera. Take it as front seat passenger I'm not a driver aid...
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Randomsabreur, if it's your OH I'm pretty sure that common sense will prevail and the French will understand that there is no way on God's earth that your OH will consider you to be "an aid". 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| pam w wrote: |
| we are danger of becoming infantilised with all these gadgets. |
Damn Straight! What ever happened to old school navigation techniques of Map, Compass, Sextant and Shouting at Foreigners.
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| Quote: |
pam w wrote:
we are danger of becoming infantilised with all these gadgets.
Damn Straight! What ever happened to old school navigation techniques of Map, Compass, Sextant and Shouting at Foreigners.
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Probably got something to do with all the heavy right footers who want to get from Calais to Chamonix in 3hrs
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Get a map, look at it, write a list of towns and roads. put it in glove box and drive. You won't need to look at it, every time you see a name on a sign that tallys with one on the list you'll know you're going the right way. Old motorbike trick. When did you last see a biker with a map?
Whats this about the breath test kit?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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cbowls30, I'm not casting doubt (err well not too much) but do you have an attributed source? The reason I ask is that French /Swiss speeding tickets are relativley peanuts if paid quickly, providing you're not too far over the limit and are almost badges of honour compared with the UK versions. I'm actually considering framing my French and Swiss speeding tickets. That said there are some horrible stories of draconian fines in both of these countries for grossly excessive speeding....but there again we can lose our licences the UK.
Please post your source. 
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Radar detectors in France
Illegal in France whether in use or not
While radar speed camera detectors may still be legal at home – the 2006 Road Safety Act did include enabling provisions allowing the Secretary of State to make regulations to prohibit them but this hasn't been done yet – the position is different abroad where many countries have laws in place banning the carrying or use of these devices.
The French Embassy gives the following advice regarding use of radar detectors in France:
Under articles L413-2 and R413-15 of the French 'Code de la Route' (highway code), it is strictly forbidden to have such devices in cars in France, regardless of whether or not they are in use.
Penalties can include fines of up to €3,000, confiscation of the device and of the vehicle.
This legislation does not apply to satellite navigation systems (SatNav or GPS). These can tell motorists only the location of fixed speed cameras, data which is already in the public domain.
Source: http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/overseas/radar-detectors-in-france.html
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You know it makes sense.
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| cbowls30 wrote: |
| THOUGHTS PLEASE?! |
Please quote the source of the article via a link
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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bertie bassett, All the main camera warning web sites area referring to it. All have issued updates for their applications that provide camera warnings and now remove both France and Switzerland.
Apparently it's still under review but Pocket GPC World, TomTom and Garmin are taking no chances and are updating their apps.
See:-http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=87165&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=60 You may need to register to read this, apparently a translation...
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Possessing a radar warning
The possession, transport and use of warning radars - which correlate data on the position of the radar with the actual position of the vehicle calculated by the GPS - is prohibited. Usage is subject to a fine of 1,500 euros, down 6 points of the permit, but also the input of the device or vehicle if the device is attached to it.
That have a support system for driving
For cons, the warning of dangerous areas, that is to say, accident-prone areas which are not systematically implemented radar, become support systems for driving from 1st January 2012.
Through a protocol signed with the Ministry of the Interior, July 28, 2011, manufacturers have pledged not to report the location of fixed and mobile radars, or other control device road. The number of identified hazard areas will be far higher than the number of radars to encourage motorists to moderate their average speed. |
Does any one else know any different?
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Poster: A snowHead
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You could always try looking at the road signs. Permanent cameras are signposted, and the temporary ones set up from time to time by the Gendarmerie wouldn't be on your satnav's database anyway.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Also, French speed limits are excellent, and it's hardly ever worth breaking them.
The tricky bit I repeatedly find is crossing over into Switzerland at Geneva, and it instantly reducing from 130 to 100.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Lizzard wrote: |
You could always try looking at the road signs. Permanent cameras are signposted
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Got to admit that the French are very fair on this one... usually if there's a signpost warning of a radar then within a couple of Kilometres there is one!!
| Lizzard wrote: |
and the temporary ones set up from time to time by the Gendarmerie wouldn't be on your satnav's database anyway. |
And again it seems that the French see this as fair game... I work on the principle that if you see one car flash going the other way on the Autoroute you ignore if you see 2 flash then you ensure that you're below the limit.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
| Randomsabreue, We don't have sat nav that works in France, but the Via Michelin route finder tells you the exact location - so given I'm following the printout I can tell my OH all about the speed camera. Take it as front seat passenger I'm not a driver aid... |
I've got one of them in the passenger seat. I call her 'NagNav'...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I have a Pogo alert gps thing that only warns you of cameras if you are over the speed limit. I was going to use it as a speedo as it can be changed to kph, but I guess it stays at home now.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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How are the French police going to enforce this satnav business? Will they have the power to stop cars and check the software?
A particularly stupid law IMHO.
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Isn't there a difference between:
1. a device which can 'detect' a radar site (ie an active radar detector) and
2. something which merely alerts you to the fact that there's a speed camera shown on a map (which is all a SatNav usually does) - even if the camera isn't actually there any more??
A paper map qualifies under the second definition - as does a keen-eyed passenger. Those can't be illegal, shurely?
Edit: typo, punctuation, gibberish, etc 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I don't even have a map in my car let alone a sat-nav.
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I don't even have a map in my car let alone a sat-nav.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Fogliettaz, our satnav is built in, and we only use it in France if we stay overnight somewhere we haven't stayed before. I have a very small spiral bound Michelin map of France, just in case Satnav blows a gasket
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| You could always try looking at the road signs. Permanent cameras are signposted, and the temporary ones set up from time to time by the Gendarmerie wouldn't be on your satnav's database anyway. |
Apparently, they are also removing the warning signs for the permanent cameras. If true that would mean the speed merchants will have to reign the speed in!
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You know it makes sense.
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Jivebaby, the source is the AA website..... would of thought them to be a bit reliable?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thinking about the logistics of this. Sarkozy has announced an intention of introducing this in the Spring. There are over 30 million cars in France apparently. What are the chances of getting that number of breathalysers made in the next 3 months? Sounds like a half baked politicians plan to me.
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Poster: A snowHead
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What are the chances of getting that number of breathalysers made in the next 3 months?
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there's probably a factory in China somewhere which could oblige.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Colin B wrote: |
| Thinking about the logistics of this. Sarkozy has announced an intention of introducing this in the Spring. There are over 30 million cars in France apparently. What are the chances of getting that number of breathalysers made in the next 3 months? Sounds like a half baked politicians plan to me. |
Sounds like they already had 30 million breathalyzers that they didn't know what to do with, and then had to quickly invent a reason to sell them. Just like when the WHO invented 'Swine Flu' to hurriedly get rid of that stockpile of Tamiflu that the American and UK governments accidentally bought.
Oooh. Little bit of politics.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| pam w wrote: |
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What are the chances of getting that number of breathalysers made in the next 3 months?
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there's probably a factory in China somewhere which could oblige. |
Or knowing the French there's probably a French owned manufacturer somewhere with the capacity to make them.... possibly PIP diversifying?? 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Living in France in the moment and I've always understood that the devices that actually detect cameras are illegal here but didn't think having the positions on your sat-nav was (especially considering the amount of paper versions that are around) but I just asked my french colleagues and apparently from the 1st January its illegal to have it on your sat-nav or have the paper versions (they do think its a bit of a joke though because apparently the mairie can ask you if you have one and all you have to say is no and they have no right to search your car, the police though could be another matter)
And yes they are starting to remove the signs before the speed cameras warning you that they are there, but apparently there should be an active speed sign thing before it (you know the signs that tell you how fast your going to give you a chance to slow down)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Making it illegal (with severe penalties as well) to merely possess publicly available information, is fascism. The kind of thing you'd expect from Belarus or North Korea.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| FlyingStantoni wrote: |
| Randomsabreur, if it's your OH I'm pretty sure that common sense will prevail and the French will understand that there is no way on God's earth that your OH will consider you to be "an aid". |
Indeed- but we aren't a bad navigational team now he's learned to listen....
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but apparently there should be an active speed sign thing before it (you know the signs that tell you how fast your going to give you a chance to slow down)
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never seen one of those on the autoroute, where there are plenty of cameras.
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pam w, there is definitely one as you approach the camera at Servoz on way down from Cham. Didn't stop me being flashed on Jan 1 however
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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And the odds of getting stopped by French plod and him checking your inbuilt sat nav (which is in English) for updates in respect of speed cameras...............somewhere between zero and winning the lottery......
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adie, my thoughts you can see how the conversation might go;
Flic - doz zat zat nav av cameras on it.
Driver - I say no officer it is a Satelite Navigation system with the latest maps loaded from Garmin.
Flic - yers but dozit av cameras on it.
Driver - No officer it is a Satelite Navegation System not a camera
Flic - zat iz no what I means..... doz zat zat nav av camera postions on eeet.
Driver - No officer it is purely for navigation.
Flic - oh? i zinc it az camera locationz on it.
Driver - really??? I can assure you it has not...
(all said in an 'allo 'allo stylee for comedy effect) :
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FAQ
