 Poster: A snowHead
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Had a lesson during my week in La Plagne, and wow, what a revelation!
I didn't realise my technique was so wrong. I booked the lesson to help me on steeper slopes, but in fact he just attempted to put right my terrible technique! He said the reason I'm nervous on steeps is that I skid my turns and twist my hips so I'm not in control. Standard thing instructors see, I'm sure.
I'd never got the whole 'driving the downhill ski forward' thing, but he got me to do lots of drills, and by the end I think I was getting it. I also didn't have enough up and down movement in my body.
I must admit, I'm finding it hard to do it all the time though, and I'm skiing far more slowly because I'm concentrating!
There's so much to remember!
I will definitely book more lessons in future because it's clear that I need them far more than I thought.
The Oxygene ski school in La Plagne is very good. Last time I booked a lesson it was with the ESF in Val D a few years ago and all I did was follow the guy, he didn't really teach me anything.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Try HH nearer keep you in tune.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Yeah it's 1hr 40 mins away, might go up there one Saturday or Sunday.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Piccadilly, those are fairly common weaknesses for many skiers. Glad your Oxygene instructor gave you a good lesson. Getting the fundamentals right is the key to skiing whatever terrain you want, whether that be steeps, off-piste, fast, icy, etc.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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kieranm, Can you name a snow slope closer?
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Piccadilly, was it 1-1?
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Yes it was. The guy's name was Ewan, he used to be in the British Ski Team, he's a lovely skier.
I now need to keep practising, and have more lessons. I'm so glad I finally got the downhill ski bit, I'd never understood that, despite reading about it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Piccadilly, how many times have you been before please?
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Skiing? Erm, I probably have at least 50 weeks' experience, I started skiing 23 years ago.
I discovered techniques have moved on since I last had a lesson!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Pedantica, I suspected/feared as much 
I think he only scratched the surface!
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Piccadilly, what's worse - and I'm not suggesting this will happen to you - is when the lessons run into several years' worth and you still continue to feel that the surface has only been scratched. Ho hum...
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You know it makes sense.
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Pedantica, But only because your expectations are now higher 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Scarpa, mmm, perhaps... 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Pedantica, Piccadilly, Yes, interesting... my experience level is similar and I wonder about the wisdom of dipping my toe back into the educational water...
Would I have more fun I ask myself?
I don't want to turn into one of those people for whom skiing becomes yet another thing that they have to 'excel' at.
At the moment I make do with occasionally trying out some tip or technique that I've read/seen in BZN 
This year it is mostly the 'sitting on a table' idea from my friend Klaus at Sofa ski school to try to try to make me think of keeping the hips facing downhill, not just the head and/or shoulders. I wonder if this area is what your instructor was looking at too piccadilly?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| red 27 wrote: |
| Would I have more fun I ask myself? |
About 12-15 years ago I was in a similar position to the OP - skied a fair number of weeks, but almost entirely without any instruction of any kind other than a couple of weeks of lessons on school ski trips. I had perfected my bad habits and while I enjoyed skiing I was getting more and more frustrated by my inability to ski steep pistes with control or to cope with deep snow, slush, 'ice', high speed, etc. Almost by accident I ended up in ski school on a trip to Courchevel and it was obvious that I had very poor technique that would need some effort to change if I wanted to ski more of the mountain. So since then I've had a lot of lessons.
Am I having more fun? Fun just isn't a big enough word! By becoming a better skier I have rediscovered my passion for skiing. While I continue to strive to become better it is not just because I want to become good at something, but because I want to have more enjoyment with my skiing. I would like to be able to ski faster, I would like to be able to ski more complex snow and terrain, I would like to be able to ski perfectly precise short radius turns down the fall line, I would like to be able to let it all hang out and ski just on the wrong side of control, and lots more. Not because those things are a challenge for me, but because they are fun.
For me the outcome of spending some time with high quality instructors has been a huge amount of fun. Also, the process of spending some time with high quality instructors has been a huge amount of fun. Deciding to go back to lessons shouldn't have to sacrifice anything other than cash!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| red 27 wrote: |
| ... to try to make me think of keeping the hips facing downhill, not just the head and/or shoulders. I wonder if this area is what your instructor was looking at too piccadilly? |
Ermmm.. not facing downhill necessarily, but facing the direction of travel.
For instance he took my poles away and was getting me to do turns while pushing one hip forward with my hand and pulling the other back to stop me from twisting.
It really was a lot to take in, and now I wish I'd had a whole week of lessons!
I feel like rob@rar did, it's frustrating me that I'm not better than I am, and I want to cope with tougher terrain and higher speeds. It's clear I will need a lot more lessons to really improve but at last I've made a start. It was quite a revelation to really feel the ski biting in much sooner in the turn.
You should try booking a couple and see how you get on, there's nothing to lose and everything to gain.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Pedantica, 
I perfectly understand that skiing indoors is a major compromise, and not especially cheap (although it's interesting to calculate the cost of getting to your nearest glacier for a day's coaching). Skiing indoors is not meant to be like skiing on a mountain, in the same way as visiting a golf driving range is not meant to be like playing a round of golf on your favourite course. For me, and you I know, it's a training facility pure and simple. If you are keen to improve your skills a training facility like your nearest indoor or dry ski slope can make out easier to get more value out of your expensive holiday: train throughout the year when mountain skiing isn't an option for you, then use those skills when you head to the mountains in the winter.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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food for thought... Perhaps the time has come for a little refresher...
rob@rar are you out in Les Arcs 13-15th Jan? if so please PM me with details if you're available.
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| Quote: |
Would I have more fun I ask myself?
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I certainly have more fun now I ski better. I also feel my body takes less punishment because my balance is so much better - and I can recover from some fairly spectacular mistakes at times. This morning I did a few steepish, wide, empty red runs and a couple of easyish and freshly pisted blacks, with my son. He skis like the wind - I know better than to try to keep up with him - but he didn't have to wait too long for me at the bottom!
I skied them well - and fairly fast. I felt 100% in control and balanced the whole time, was getting the turns right, really diving down the hill. it felt fantastic.
It's not always like that, sometimes I ski like a giraffe, which doesn't feel nearly as good.
I also enjoy mucking around doing exercises like one legged skiing, which are ideal for more gentle runs when skiing with friends. I have hugely more fun because of the lessons I've had. The intermediate plateau can be a pretty boring spot.
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red 27, sorry, I will be in Morzine then getting getting some coaching myself. I can recommend any of the guys in the Vallandry part of New Generation if you are looking for a private lesson, or Rob Hutchison who is a Brit instructor based there. Let me know if you want contact details for any of these guys.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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red 27, Look out John Arnold New Gen. Greatest of them all
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I agree with rob@rar that viewing indoor snow slopes as a means of getting more from your next ski holiday is the way forward. You could say they are short or flat(ish) or whatever but like with the golf driving range idea - you only need a small amount of space and FOCUS and you can improve massively in a short period of time. When I take some of the instructor training at HH in the Summer there are people there who have NEVER been to the mountains before YET their technique is pretty good... when they do go to the Alps or wherever they are pleasantly surprised... my motto for people who think they are too good for the an indoor slope is 'challenge them by drill not by terrain' - that essentially means that NO matter what your level there are drills for you to make improvements on a 180m slope in the middle of July!.... and of course the slopes are much quieter in the middle of Summer than in the middle of Winter (now!).
BTW it is Euan Gardiner at Oxygene Ski School - a very experienced instructor and yes used to be British Ski Team.
red 27 - may see you there as Im already teaching over in Les Arcs as opposed to Val D for those dates.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
my motto for people who think they are too good for the an indoor slope
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anyone who thinks they are too good for an indoor slope could be given a rude awakening!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| pam w wrote: |
| Quote: |
my motto for people who think they are too good for the an indoor slope
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anyone who thinks they are too good for an indoor slope could be given a rude awakening! |
A couple of seasons ago the toughest skiing I had was a day at Hemel being coached by Ross Green. He beasted us! Had a massive wipeout carving the slope on one ski. As any Inside Out client would probably confirm, there's plenty of stuff you can do which will test very able skiers. One-legged synchronised hockey stops, anyone...?
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| Steve Angus wrote: |
BTW it is Euan Gardiner at Oxygene Ski School - a very experienced instructor and yes used to be British Ski Team.
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Oops, I spelt his name wrongly - yes, he was very good and an extremely pleasant bloke too.
I'd have no problems with having lessons in a fridge during the summer, hopefully I can get a few more in on my next couple of trips though.
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You know it makes sense.
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One-legged synchronised hockey stops, anyone...?
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Hmm. That side-slipping on the uphill ski, minus sticks, was quite enough for me, thanks! Something I try to remember to practice whenever I'm hanging around for somebody to faff with their boots, or whatever.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks for the responses...
I don't want generic drills - I can get those out of a book - I want someone to look at how I ski, listen to me as I tell them how i like to ski, and then decide what (if anything  ) can be done to make skiing even more fun.
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Poster: A snowHead
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red 27, well an instructor would look at the difference between the way you ski and the way you'd like to ski, then decide which of the drills would be most likely to reduce that difference - i don't think anybody is suggesting that it would be the same prescription for all. Though there are a lot of us with the same faults and I guess that the kind of drills which have been developed to help racers race better (the sort of thing you can see the local ski club kids doing on a Saturday) would be helpful to many people. But if you're perfectly happy with the way you ski, and it doesn't present any dangers to you or others, then obviously there's no point wasting your time and money on lessons.
One of the things you can't do on an indoor slope is follow closely behind an instructor taking a beautiful line down the mountain, tailoring the line and speed to your own ability, as well as the conditions. I've found that a hugely enjoyable thing to do.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| pam w wrote: |
| red 27, One of the things you can't do on an indoor slope is follow closely behind an instructor taking a beautiful line down the mountain, tailoring the line and speed to your own ability, as well as the conditions. I've found that a hugely enjoyable thing to do. |
sounds like the old trick of tagging onto the end of a ski school class
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Just had a weeks skiing to start the season that wasn't a course - for the first time in 4-5 years. Really, really enjoyed because I had time to relax and get on with putting all the lessons into practice. But without those lessons I'd be a much weaker skier.
Having friends that are qualified instructors also keeps you on your toes!
red 27, I find being with an instructor but at the back of the group I learn very little compared to following directly behind the instructor
So much of skiing is counter-intuitive that I think you really do need good instruction to make progress at it. But if you're having fun and on a mountain - then just enjoy!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Gadge wrote: |
Just had a weeks skiing to start the season that wasn't a course - for the first time in 4-5 years. Really, really enjoyed because I had time to relax and get on with putting all the lessons into practice. But without those lessons I'd be a much weaker skier.
Having friends that are qualified instructors also keeps you on your toes!
red 27, I find being with an instructor but at the back of the group I learn very little compared to following directly behind the instructor
So much of skiing is counter-intuitive that I think you really do need good instruction to make progress at it. But if you're having fun and on a mountain - then just enjoy! |
yes your so right - you need to balance up practice time putting into practice what you have learnt in the lessons with just blasting around and getting into bad habits.... but as you also say skiing should be fun - but also counter-intuitive.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Oh dear - I've just read this and like the OP I probably have 50+ weeks and 20+ years under my belt and have decided to have a day's one-on-one in VdI in April. I wonder how bad it's going to be ?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
sounds like the old trick of tagging onto the end of a ski school class
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OK if you can along with an instructor plus one good skier in a private lesson. Tagging along behind a class is a waste of time. It's usually pretty slow, and the back markers are doing their own zig zaggy thing anyway, generally.
dsoutar, I'd be reluctant to do a day's private ski lesson. Two shorter sessions might be more productive, with some practice time in between. Good lessons are likely to be more tiring and require a lot more concentration than just doing your own thing. But I bet you'll enjoy it.
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pam w, thanks for the tip. Might also fit in better with my wife & our two 20-ish girls, i.e. lesson in morning & then ski with them afternoon so not being too unsociable although I'm sure they'll be quite happy to get rid of me 
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I'd endorse Oxygene as a good ski school. I had a 1 on 1 with their head instructor (a French guy) a couple of years ago. It had been a long time since I'd had a lesson and frankly I did it because I was finding late season La Plagne with the family a bit dull and wanted to have a few things to work on while I was cruising around.
It's tricky in these situations to make sure you get what you want out of a lesson. I've done enough skiing that I need to be pushed a bit and I need an instructor with good English to convey the subtleties of changes I need to make. I explained this to the desk and they really listened which has not aways been my experience!
I had a great time - a couple of little tweaks to initiate carves and finish them a little better then pushing the speed off-piste.
He made the point that if you have done plenty of skiing and are reasonably fit then to stress your technique you need to ski faster and with fewer stops - only by tiring your muscles a bit will you force yourself to rely on efficient technique rather than strength and tactics.
I totally agree with Pam - a couple of 2 hour provate lessons with some practice between is much better than a week of ski school once you are an intermediate or above.
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FAQ
