Am I ready?

A snowHead

I have skied for many years at Aldershot dry ski slope and at the Chill Factore in Manc which are very easy runs.

Been on 2 ski hols in my life, once to Risoul in France when I was 11 and to Rauris when I was 14 but not been again since.

On both trips I managed blues and some reds with ease but I have not been on a black at all.

How do I know if I will be able to try a black in Chamonix this January?

I was thinking of starting on blues and working up to reds on the first day and finishing by skiing down the Brevent black to the bottom. Is this wise?

How do I know what level I am on and if I can manage a black?

Thanks Very Happy

A snowHead

I would think if you're not planning to have any further tuition that for your own safety and that of other piste user you should stick to runs where you can comfortably control your speed and direction.

Impossible to say what level you're on and what you're capable of without being assessed by an instructor.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

bezthespaniard, Which black are you talking about?

Ask an instructor. No other easy way to ascertain what you're at.

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Im talking about any black at Chamonix. On the first day I am thinking of doing the Brevent Black that comes down into town.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

bezthespaniard, hmmm, the black down from the Brevent is a road. If the snow falls so that it is actually doable, it's not really a black at all - it's not steep, just narrow and boring. IMO it's labelled that way to discourage people.

If you want a more challenging "black", the Charles bozon down from the top of the cable car is more like it.

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bezthespaniard, Based on what you say, you are very unlikely to be able to cope safely with any genuine black in the first few days you are there.

As you will know from Chill Factore, everything is easier, but also very much faster on snow than on the dry slope. And none of the indoor snow slopes in the UK are any steeper than a moderate blue in most resorts.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

bezthespaniard, 1) You don't. 2) No. 3) You can't.

You need lessons or assessment by an experienced honest skier to make sure you are not a danger to yourself and to others. Take your time.

If you were good enough now to ski those runs, you'd not see it as a goal. You'd realise that the same run can vary hugely with different snow, weather and visibility conditions. You are at an early, early stage in your ski career. There is a huge difference between getting down a run managing to escape injury, and actually skiing it.

After all it is free

bezthespaniard, no.

Most of the blues in the Chamonix valley will be blacks in comparison to the Aldershot dry ski slope.

Have fun, stay safe and do yourself the favour of having some lessons.

Despite the Brevant black being a road and, as under a new name says, being boring as hell - there's still real opportunity to get damaged doing it. It's relatively narrow and has lots of corners where the snow get shitty and it's possible to ski over a 10m drop onto the track as it zigzags below.

I've "Skied" slopes that are probably too dificult for me and to be honest you don't get no where near as much enjoyment throwing yourself down a slope in any old fashion as you would skiing something you're more comfortable with.

Are you not having lessons?
Do you plough?
Do you carve?
Do you do the generic self-proclaimed british intermediate style "parallel turn" where you initiate the turn by pivoting the whole upper body?

It's so hard to say without seeing you ski, but if your skiing red slopes safely and comfortably you are probably ready to have a go at one of the easier blacks (when the snow is good).

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What a bunch of wimps! How do you know he can't do it?

Back in the days of unforgiving straight skis, I took my wife down a black on her 8th day on snow. She loved it. I was a slow starter - it took me 10 days to make a black. I also loved it. With modern carver skis, I've seen several skiers comfortably take on a black in their first week on snow.

The important questions for you to ask are these: Can I stop easily and quickly whenever I need to? Can I turn whenever I need to, or do I have to turn where the slope wants me to? Can I control my speed through the turn even when it's steep? Am I freaked by uneven surfaces, particularly bumps? Do I relish the more difficult reds or do I secretly fear them?

If you answer positively, choose a short black that you can get a good view of from a chair lift and make sure it looks doable to you. Make sure that the people skiing it aren't dropping like flies and ask the piste patrol whether conditions are good (you might not be able to see ice from afar). Only try it on a good day with perfect weather conditions. And, if it looks good - go for it.

Ignore the naysayers!

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

Leeds Skier

Are you not having lessons? No lessons, I had lessons both times before when I went skiing and at Chillfactore. I am just going to get time on the pistes.

Do you plough? No but I can

Do you carve? Yes, I had lessons to learn.

Do you do the generic self-proclaimed british intermediate style "parallel turn" where you initiate the turn by pivoting the whole upper body?
Yes

Jonny Jones

Can I stop easily and quickly whenever I need to? Yes and at speed
Can I turn whenever I need to, or do I have to turn where the slope wants me to? Yea
Can I control my speed through the turn even when it's steep? Yea
Am I freaked by uneven surfaces, particularly bumps? No
Do I relish the more difficult reds or do I secretly fear them? Love them

Last time I went skiing I was fine on reds, even the harder ones and took them at speed quite comortably. I have had all the lessons available to me in the UK and earnt a Silver Star when skiing in Risoul.

My mate went to Cham last year and he can do blacks and he would say I can ski as well as him.

I know I can happily attack any red, my main reason for asking is to see how much of a jump is it to black and what to be aware of on the slopes.
As I have never been on one I want to know what to expect.

I would also point out that I go most Tuesdays to chilfactore and ski the jumps and onto the tables.

snow reports

bezthespaniard, I have skied various blacks in Chamonix (including the one from the top of the Brevent cable car) as well as the easiest route down the Grands Montets in Argentiere - in good conditions, mind - and I'm only an intermediate skier. Sounds to me as though you should be fine so long as the runs are in reasonable condition and also, perhaps, not unduly narrow.

bezthespaniard, If you are ready depends on your ability to control your line and your speed on steeper terain. You sensibly stated that you plan to start on the blues and work up to the reds and if feeling confident then tackle the black.

stoatsbrother, Is right you should not be seeing black as somhow a 'must do' or a mark of the quality of your skiing, there is an inordinate amount of macho BS about skiing steeper slopes in resort and plenty of people who ski them when their ability is way below what is required to do so with any style or safety.

Your mate may be able to come down a black at speed but that does not mean he is skiing the run well. If you come down looking like a 'ferret on speed in a bath with a toaster' it is not a good look and will just mark you out as a bit of a **%$. Toofy Grin

Try not to compare yourself to 'friends' in your skiing but instead compare yourself to what you know to be good technique, This you will learn from a good instructor.

I would say if you can ski a tricky red and keep your technique tidy and be happy controlling your line and speed at all times then you should be ok to progress.

How are your short turns? Are they true short turns or do you tend to ski a long radius short arc turn? and end up picking up speed. It worries me what you say about your turn initiation though you will need to work on your seperation if you are going to maintain your ability to stay centred and balanced over you skis on steeper terrain.

If the conditions or you own ability mean that you are struggling then clearly you should reconsider, a great deal will depend on the snow conditions.

To give yourself a 'get out of jail' set of skills, make sure you practice your sideslipping and falling leaf drills on a bumpy red so that if you get into trouble on the black you can still come down in a controlled (if somwhat un elegant fashion).

Whatever you decide to do just enjoy your skiing Smile

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

bezthespaniard, have a go at the black after a few days when you have built up your skills when (if) you have progressed through from blues to reds and are skiing them in a controlled manner, the only way you will ever know is if you try it - irrespective of what an instructor might advise or, may I be so bold, even the collective wisdom of snowHeads Little Angel

A snowHead

A snowHead

Leeds_Skier,

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

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kevindonkleywood, 50% of skiing the step up to/from a blue/red/black or whatever is all in the head; I have known very good/stylish/controlled skiers that you would think would be fine, but they bottle it even with an instructor to hold their hand (I assume the instructor thought they could do it rather than wanting to get to a better bit of the mountain or was favouring better skiers in the group wink

), and I have seen ragged/controlled skiers stay ragged and in control whilst skiing down a black because they think about what they are doing, do not freeze and do not bottle it !

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

rayscoops, I dont disagree at all, just depends what you think is important thats all. Thats the beauty of snowHead

lots of different perspectives Very Happy

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kevindonkleywood, agreed, and the best 'first' black is the one that you do without knowing it and only afterwards some one points it out Very Happy

At least bezthespaniard is thinking it through rather than just deciding to chuck him/herself down the first black ... hopefully Little Angel

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

Don't set yourself artificial targets such as skiing a black run. A blue in poor condition can be trickier than a black in great snow.

If you're a third year skier with any semblance of athletic ability, a black run needn't be off the agenda. Just make sure you build to it properly and that it looks something you're comfortable with. I skied a black on my first day on skis (my very first run was red) but I was young, stupid and had years of playing ice hockey behind me so was kind of relaxed about sliding around on ice. Wink

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This has got to be one of the silliest threads in a long while. How in the name of all that's holy can anyone possibly advise the OP on if he's ready for a black without seeing him ski? He may as well ask I've just bought some new ski pants, does my bum look big in them?

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

make sure you have a good insurance cover
good job i m not going to cham this jan

snow reports

Some blacks are easier than some reds. Some blacks are a more pleasant experience than some blues - home run blue at end of day vs newly pisted black.

Some blacks are a bit steep but nice and wide, some are narrow (with nasty drops/cliffs) and not so steep. Some are really long with no escape, some are really short or can be escaped.

My advice would be:

1. Make sure you can sideslip well on reds, and that you have this tool in good working order before you consider the black.

2. Check out your intended target before being committed to going down it - is it wide/narrow, can you have a look then download by lift if your head isn't in it. Better yet if you're going with someone you know and they are more experienced than you - get them to check it out for you- moguls, drops, widths, rocks are probably the main differentiating thing. Slope direction might be relevant - icy would probably not be ideal.. Early on, same could well apply to some Chamonix reds. My future Sister in Law nicknamed a particular Tignes red the red piste of death because it was mogulled, narrow, icy, the odd rock was poking through and it had drops around it. She's skiied loads, and is a very elegant and controlled skier on most pistes, but she hated this one!

3. Don't build the thing up in your head. Kid yourself that the piste markers are dark blue or red and ski what you see in front of you.

bad_roo,

You know it makes sense.

Take it slowly, only ski in short sections so you don't build up speed or ski something you haven't seen first and watch out for faster skiers. What can go wrong Wink

It might not be enjoyable like that but it will be skiable.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

Just do it

A snowHead

Dr John, and I think thats been the bulk of the responses to the question.

(all assuming the OP is not simply trolling)

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

If you have to ask whether you are ready, I'd say you're not ready to tackle any black in any condition.

Your safety and the safety of others around you will depend on your abilities, the nature of the run and the conditions of the snow - it sounds like you are not yet able to assess any of these yourself yet, otherwise you wouldn't be asking. And there's no way anyone can assess these for you without knowing how you ski, what run you are intending to do, snow conditions, time of day etc.

On my last trip there was a black run that was no problem early in the week when there had been a good dump of snow. However by the end of the week it had been bashed and had become a steep sheet of ice - in the space of a few days it had gone from a run where a fall would have meant a twisted knee at worst to one where there would be a good chance it would be the trees at the bottom that would eventually slow you down (there was no run-out) rather than soft snow.

At the beginning of the week I was going down it with a couple of competent 3-week skiers. At the end of the week, even the locals were avoiding it.

My advice would be to have some lessons - an instructor or guide will take you on runs they are confident you can cope with in the conditions present at that time.

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Who know's whether you are ready bezthespaniard, I'm guessing the fact you are thinking about giving these routes a go will probably mean you will, regardless of what anyone says.

I ask, who will you be skiing with? Anything can happen to any of us at any time, so if you are trying something which has a higher risk level to what you are used to please make sure you ski with others - if anything does happen at least they will be able to get help. Don't forget you're not indoors in a Manchester fridge, or on a hill in Aldershot - you're on the side of a mountain, a vast area, where you could be in trouble very quickly if anything goes wrong.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Join your TO Rep on a Ski Guide day and you will soon find out if you are 'Ready' or not.

Be ready,however, to get your ego bruised.

snowHead

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

I remember when we were in Claviere/Montgenevre a few years back and skiing the Coletto Verde. Early in the week it was lovely untouched snow and we had first tracks down it. It was everything a black run should be - steep enough, nice snow and (relatively) safe to fall down.

By the end of the week, it was mogulled and icy to the hilt and one of the lads in our group who professes to be just as good as anyone else just managed to scrape down it on his backside. I chose to ski the red loop instead. Later on he was boasting about being the only one able to ski it.... he didn't ski it but did put him self and those below him in a bit of danger.

So... using the above as an example, you can't get an answer to your question until the actual moment you come to ski whatever black you decide to ski.

let us know how you get on!

After all it is free

If you aren't having lessons I would recommend that you go out skiing with a much more experienced skier in the warm up to trying your first black and see what they think. If they think you can handle it safely and in a controlled manor then ask them to come down the black and "guide" you down the run, i.e. allow them to pick a safe and steady route down and follow them at a safe distance.

Remember that black colour doesn't just relate to the steepness, but the difficulty and danger of the run as well. A black run is generally groomed alot less than other runs and can be steep, icy, have exposed rocks, very large moguls or all of the above at once and more. Many blacks are only rated as such due to one or two tricky areas on the way down (could be very tricky) but the rest of the piste may seem really mellow and easy, so just because you have seen some of the run and it looks ok don't assume it will all be the same.

As said choose your black carefully and speak to someone with knowledge of the resort (preferably the person you are skiing with) about which black is best for you to try first.

As an experienced skier I am not particularly excited by skiing black runs, its one of those things that novice skier's get very excited about doing as they feel it stamps some kind of standard or bragging rights on their skiing. In all honesty I often find it more enjoyable ripping into a good long red and I'm sure many others feel the same.

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Assuming this is not a wind up, the Blacks back to the valley at Brevent/Flegere are rubbish don't bother. The other black runs there are; the Bozon which is wide and a good option in good conditions BUT work your way up to it, the Janvier rarely in good condition, and the Floria which is tough plus narrow in places, if you can ski the adjacent red Crouchues ok (one of the best runs in the valley and would be black in most resorts) then give it a go.

My only caveats would be make sure you have a totally solid side slipping ability, and don't go on your own.

Help!!

Am I ready?

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