 Poster: A snowHead
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Yesterday passengers on an Easyjet flight from Birmingham to Geneva who had boarded the aircraft were then told that 36 of them would have to leave as the aircraft was overweight because too much fuel had been put in! 
Easyjet asked for volunteers, but there were too few of them, and the Police were called to the aircraft. Eventually Easyjet got the required numbers by disembarking those who were the last to check in.
See BBC Midlands Today from 2:05 onwards.
As it was a Geneva flight, I wonder whether any Snowheads were on it?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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sounds like a fueling error. One has to feel for the airline in this case.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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What a bunch of plonkers.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Alastair Pink, Unbelievable, or maybe not for EJ, likely taking the least hassle option for them, NOT their customers.
36 passengers plus luggage = c. 3.6T of weight, some ovefuelling that one, approximately 4000 litres extra put in by mistake, me thinks not!! 
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Markymark29, interesting I was trying to work out how much extra fuel it would mean, I think if I remember correctly that aircraft have to have at least twice the amount of fuel they need for the trip they are doing.
I am sure that there is a snowhead out there who knows about these things and if it was possible to put that much extra fuel onboard??
Some quick research shows that airlines average 4.8L per passenger per 100 km, with the flight to Geneva at 895km then 36 people would be 1546L 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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livetoski, Blimey thats accurate, I just worked on 100kg per passenger incl luggage/ ski's etc x 36no = 3600kg, and a litre of fuel weighs approx same as water = 1kg = 3600 litres, approx 2 x your 1546 so may be right?? Either way a pretty poor pump-jockey! 
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Wonder if this had anything to do with there being no plane to take us from GVA to Liverpool yesterday afternoon?
We didn't enjoy our five hour delay but it doesn't compare to being forcibly off-loaded on the way to the slopes.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Years ago I had all my luggage left behind (thankfully on the return journey!) because the plane was supposedly overwieght We weren't the only ones. Surely this is preferable to chucking people off the plane?!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Fuelling requirements are programmed into the bowser and dispensed to a set requirement. It's not impossible to screw-up but it is VERY rare and not for that quantity. It was done for a logistic purpose by the airline . . . but you'll need access to their internal systems to prove that 
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| Markymark29 wrote: |
| livetoski, Blimey thats accurate, I just worked on 100kg per passenger incl luggage/ ski's etc x 36no = 3600kg, and a litre of fuel weighs approx same as water... |
Specific gravity of jet fuel varies between about 0.78 to 0.85 - even a specific standard of fuel will allow for some variation - which is why in the RAF we tended to think in lbs of fuel rather than volume (since weight (OK mass if you are a pedant) is more relevant than volume in terms of calorific value).
As a hitherto loyal fan of easyjet, I am a bit put out by this story.
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Tue 28-12-10 12:39; edited 2 times in total
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You know it makes sense.
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something sounds distinctly odd about this whole story....definately feels like an efficiency thing rather than the number of people on board and too much fuel making the plane overweight?!?!?!?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Last year coming back from Lyon, Easyjet had overbooked by 4 people and had to ask for volunteers to take £100 and a night in a hotel and get the next flight over. There was a bit of negotiating going on and eventually 4 got off - dont know if they got more than the £100 originally offered.
I was sat next to 2 people who had missed the flight the day before and had been transferred onto the flight I was on and had been told the day before to make sure they got there early as the flight was overbooked - wonder if the same thing had happened big time in Birmingham yesterday ie it was a booking problem rather than a fuel problem?
(The people who took the money on my Lyon flight had the last laugh as having sat on the plane for 2 hours, the flight was cancelled as Gatwick was closed. I got The Crossroads Motel and no cash and those that took the cash had £100 and a good hotel on the airport complex ! I have to say that Easyjet were really good about the whole thing in contrast to Ryanair who would be taking the 'you're on your own mate' line)
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Poster: A snowHead
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achilles, Like you, I have been a fan of Easyjet and have used them many times. However it seems that alti-dude's experience of overbooking occurring on an Easyjet flight is by no means unique, see this
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Sounds like a load of porkies. A319 can carry up to 150 peeps to a max range of 3600 nm (WIKI expert). So to off load 20% of the pax on a short sector doesnt add up, unless the plane would have exceeded it max landing weight on arrival due to the excess fuel. Could have been the flight was scheduled to fly to another destination, then put on this sector but fuelled for the longer sector.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| BergenBergen wrote: |
| unless the plane would have exceeded it max landing weight on arrival due to the excess fuel. |
I always thought they dump fuel before landing if that is the case ?
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So the plane is not designed to be fully loaded with a full fuel tank? Sounds ridiculous to me and I'd guess something has been lost in the reporting somewhere... Surely offloading some of the baggage would have been a simpler (and cheaper?) option?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The airline LIAT (Luggage In Another Town) in the Caribbean used regularly to have to leave all the luggage behind if the wind was such as to force them to take off downwind. Maybe they still do as it's unlikely that the damn great mountain making it possible to take off only in one direction has moved in the years since I flew with them.
They should have weighed the passengers and chucked off the heaviest - would only have been 25 then, instead of 36. 
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rayscoops, Well, accorinding to WIKI The A319 doesnt have a fuel dumping system, CAA/FAA rules. In cases where the landing weight id too high the have to consume the fuel in flight. In emergencies they can land overweight but that then presents a new set of issues. You would think that off loading freight would be the better option but on easyjet maybe the majority of baggage is in the cabin.
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As long as it didn't exceed its max take off weight, they could of jetisoned some fuel over the sea to meet max landing weight?
Not a fan of easyjet, and they are not that cheap.
I went to Nurnberg earlier this year, was told to go Air Berlin from Stansted (their uk hub). They were cheaper, excellent service, complimentary food, drink and morning papers, leather seats and tvs onboard. EJ cant touch them, and im sure AB were at least 33% less.
Also i think they need about 30mins extra fuel, not double the required amount. As i know they are not allowed to land with excess fuel. Hence on emergency landings they dump fuel before coming in.
My mate used to be an engineer for EJ, and we flew back from Majorca with EJ, anyway pretty much from when it took off it was making some strange old sounds, then over France it dropped a fair bit and made a really bad groaning noise, then over the tannoy the pilot announced we had priority to land at Luton, and didn't need to take the usual route (via Essex atc) and could fly in a straight line to Luton (through Heathrow's airspace then???) and we landed at Luton pretty soon after!! I took a note of the tail number and told my mate what happened and the id of the plane. He asked me what happened and i explained it as best i could, he said that plane was the worse in their fleet and it was a suprise it was in the air instead of the hanger (like usual), also priority was no coincidence and was probably begged for by the pilot.
Monarch to Innsbruck coming in Jan
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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For those asking,
Yes they can fly with full tanks and passenger\baggage loads.
They can take off and land if the runway is long enough. Air temeprature, gradient, surface and a bunch of other stuff all play a part.
When the Captain checked the fuel load and ran it through the weight and balance calculations I should imagine he got a bit of a sinking feeling. Or possibly an "I told them so" feeling.
Underfuelling has been know to occur because of errors (the Gimli glider), possibly this was an error. Possibly someone expected the plane to do a fill in leg and filled it up to its ears so that it couldn't get out of BRM without denting the fence.
"The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire"- Flying instructor of the old school.
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Much as thirty06 says. Maximum permitted takeoff weight can be affected by wind direction, temperature and runway conditions. I had thought the latter most likely for this instance, but going for the fill-in leg without thinking through the implications is a thought. In my RAF days we filled to requirements determined by Ops - but that could be and was adjusted by the captain as he saw fit. We could almost always defuel fairly easily in the UK - but then we did have a high degree of confidence in what we were defuelling.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Overweight passengers can be a problem.
| Quote: |
| ....the plane was actually overloaded and out of balance, due to the use of incorrect (but FAA approved) passenger weight estimates..... the estimates were over 20 pounds (9 kg) lighter than the actual weight of an average passenger. After checking the actual weight of baggage..... it was found that the aircraft was actually 580 pounds (264 kg) above its maximum allowable take-off weight, with its center of gravity 5% to the rear of the allowable limit. |
The aircraft concerned was a Beechcraft 1900.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I was moved from the cheap seats to 1st class (or what constitutes it on Monarch) on a flight to Geneva once in order to help balance the weight out. Not too many complaints from me then.
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You know it makes sense.
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Hi, this is actually becoming quite common.
Airlines are charged by Geneva Airport by their weight on landing. Therefore, this is often why skis/snowboards/luggage are left behind and mysteriously 'miss' the flight.
Also, planes are normally fuelled for the flight time + 30 minutes holding so if they put too much fuel in, then all it meant was that easyjet were going to be charged more (into the next threshold) on landing.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Colin B, If they had asked my missus to move to help balance the plane, she would have taken offence.
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Poster: A snowHead
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what is the price of aviation fuel? as we are cattle fodder , maybe its cheaper to dump passnegers than fuel??! 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
Also, planes are normally fuelled for the flight time + 30 minutes
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It's actually a bit more complicated than that. I am not a real expert but I am sure that one will be around soon. The reserve fuel is calculated according to how much is needed to get to the planned diversion airport in the event that the destination airport is unavailable plus a contingency for holding. There may be other factors in play too. Like I said I only know enough to be dangerous.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I have flown in small planes where I was weighed and then told my luggage would be coming later because of weather conditions...
Also been in the same situation as Colin B - where the luggage was stowed incorrectly and passengers at the rear also had to leave first to stop the nose wheel leaving the ground...
The reason why flying is so safe these days is because people take this kind of thing seriously. Cock up on the fuelling front - but not as bad as the Gimli incident thirty06 mentions.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I read somewhere that many airports provide fuel to aircraft via underground pipes to the stands. These pipes can only deliver fuel. If an aircraft needs to offload fuel then a special tanker must be found and driven to the aircraft. Removing fuel is possible, but it is probably cheaper to pay a few passengers to travel later than to pay for the tanker plus the extra time at the stand while waiting for the tanker plus any extra time for staff and aircraft for the delays.
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Adrian, probably true at most airports now - certainly at LGW and LHR - and you would have to call for a Bowser to offload - and as you say - delays may cost - especially if they take you into a problem with crew hours.
US carriers habitually overbook some routes - and I have seen people get paid $750 dollars, a hotel and a meal, and an upgrade the next day to get off a transatlantic flight.
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Shambles - Jet .......
if only this type of cock-up wasnt a regular feature of their 'service'. TOTALLY lost the plot in the last couple of years ... and steadily getting worse
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
I have seen people get paid $750 dollars, a hotel and a meal, and an upgrade the next day to get off a transatlantic flight.
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my daughter and son in law were overbooked on a Virgin flight to Nairobi - quite a cheapie. They were paid more than their flight cost, plus overnight hotel at the airport, to go the next day. They were happy to do so and used the money to upgrade from bus to air travel for the internal journeys round Kenya. Sounds like easyJet didn't offer enough.
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Good to see that the police have so little to do that they have time to get involved in what is essentially a private matter between a company and its customers. Would love to know what law I would be breaking if I refuse to volunteer to fly out the next day or if I refuse to get off the plane because I declined to pay for speedy boarding and happened to be at the back of the queue at check-in.
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FAQ
Not just me, a whole row of us, by no means all lardies 