 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi there
I am going to be living in Zermatt for 3 months from Mid Jan 2011 (lucky me!!). I will need to get down to Geneva at least once per week. I am going to drive it (yes I know there is a train but it is too slow + does not run 24/7!). I have a BMW 5 series estate. I plan to use winter tyres, but I am worried about the lack of traction as it is rear wheel drive. I plan to buy 4 winter tyres.
Does anyone have experince of driving a similar car on winter tyres on snow.
I can get chains but I don;t want to have to fit them unless in a major emergency. If I need chains then I need to get another car..!
For those that don't know the road to Zermatt is gnerally OK but has 1 or two steep and windy sections. The car park is at about 1400m (I will be parking in Tasch rather than Zermatt)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
| I am going to be living in Zermatt for 3 months from Mid Jan 2011 |
| Quote: |
| If I need chains then I need to get another car..! |
Answered your own question there, Chief
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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winter tyres will be fine on all 4 corners
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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lewis, pm Spyderman
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Switch off the DSC (traction control) by holding down the DSC button until 2 bulbs are illuminated on the dash; switch it all back on when required by pressing the same button once.
Nick
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Why not leave the car at the bottom of the hill and get the train?
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Winter Tyres will get you a lot further in terms of coping in the snow.. however, don't be soooo anti chain.... they're not that much of a hassle really!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hi Altis - see what I mentioned about the train.
I need to get to Geneva for 7am - the train does not allow this.
Hi Marcellus. I will inevitably be in a rush to get a flight etc, it will be 3am cold and dark, so I want to avoid chains if I can. I know if you get the knack they are OK - I personally find it hard. I fitted chains to a coach once in minus 25 so I do have some experience - and I can't be bothered with them! Maybe I will train with chains - sounds kinky!
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Many thanks for all the replies
I do have experience of driving with snow tryes etc by the way. I spent a couple of winters in Austria with a Polo, I never got stuck, the winter tyres were superb (Vredestein Snowtrac).
I was really wondering if anyone had driven a rear wheel estate on winter tyres on snow.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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If your up at 3am and the forecast is bad, put the chains on the night before, easier/quicker to remove if not needed IMHO....
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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kitenski, Minor disadvantage with that option is that lewis will be in Zermatt, and the car in Tasch (15 minute train ride away).
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snowsocks are now authorised for French roads in place of chains and are much easier to get on/off. Not sure on their 'legal' position in CH.
http://www.autosock.com/default.aspx?did=9079022
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Thu 9-12-10 16:46; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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Mis read your title
Driving BMW to my estate in the Alps
either way I'm jealous 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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lewis, Do you really think it would be that bad, I mean go and buy another car for the sake of not putting chains on once maybe twice MTFU. 
+1 with kitenski,
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Poster: A snowHead
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lewis, BMW is NOT the best car for winterdriving,,, I know,,, I used to do,, but change to a Audi, alot better,,, and now I got me a Saab,,, Thanks lord for this exelent car,,, I dont think there is any better without 4wdrive,,,,
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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If the weather forecast is bad and the journey crucial it would be cheaper, easier and more reliable for the odd day to go to Geneva the night before and stay in a hotel rather than buying a new car with marginally better winter driving characteristics. The roads can close due to snow so no car can pass.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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lewis, it's not pretty but with winter tyres you should be OK most of the time, and if not then you really do need chains.
I drove home from Heathrow last February in the snow in my Merc E class estate. Ironically I'd been skiing but didn't have my chains in the boot. It only started to get hairy on the A419 from Cirencester over the Cotswolds, and then really hairy going down Crickley Hill which was littered with artics that couldn't make it up in the snow. Kept it in first gear, had a couple of slightly sideways moments but with a modicum of driving knowledge, made it back with summer tyres and an empty boot. With winter tyres and advance planning you'll be fine!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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BMW - Is this not the ultimate driving machine? 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Why would anyone with the extraordinary good fortune to spend 3 winter months in Zermatt faff about the possibility of having to put chains on a couple of times during the year. It's always great to have to put chains on 'cos it means it's SNOWING!
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lewis, I've driven all kinds of BMWs all over the Alps over the last 15 years (my wife works for BMW so I get to drive a new one every six months). So far I can't honestly say I've had any major problems with them, or have got stuck in places that other people with front wheel drive were not getting stuck. The only car that I found genuinely problematic was a Z3 3.0, but then I guess that is not really intended for mountain passes in winter!
You do need snow chains though!
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i have driven a 5 series estate for the past 5 years with winter tyres in both scotland and the alpes -no problems with the slip diff and traction control, in my experience the estate is an excellent choice for snow driving in all coditions except very deep snow when maybe you shoundnt be on the roads anyway.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Steilhang wrote: |
| lewis, I've driven all kinds of BMWs all over the Alps over the last 15 years (my wife works for BMW so I get to drive a new one every six months). So far I can't honestly say I've had many major problems with them |
You missed the letter 'm'. I have corrected it for you.
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bar shaker, just because posey plonkers in the UK can't drive BMWs, does not mean that they are not good cars. Yes, they have rear-wheel drive but knowing how to drive it without the proverbial sack of sand/cement in the boot is far more important. Judging by the number I regularly see on the autobahns and in the ski resort car parks, the locals have it sussed!
I can't cope with rear-wheel drive and steep ice/snow covered roads very well, so I have a front-wheel drive. I have to drive up and down a hill with a 16% gradient each day, so I do not wish to risk my car and myself with my inexperience. I used to drive a Volvo 940 Turbo diesel - rear-wheel drive and got over the St Anton Pass when it was snow-covered without chains, but I did not like the experience. I know my limitations. It would seem that most of the Chelsea Tractor brigade in the UK do not, which is why some of you Landy owners are doing a nice trade in "help". The BMWs are brilliant cars, for those who know how to use them correctly! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Samerberg Sue, yes and no. I drove a lot on snow and ice in Canada when I lived there and felt very happy on it. But my BMW estate with low profile tyres was pants and wanted to go sideways. With the rear wheels being a different size from the front mean you cannot carry a spare which fits both, and the rear wheels were too bigin the arches to have chains easily and too wide to get snowtyres. So to have safe winter boots would have meant 5 new wheels. And BMW do not sell their 4 wheel drive saloon/estate options over here unless you go for a Chelsea tractor.
Which is why I now have a Subaru...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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stoatsbrother,
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BMW do not sell their 4 wheel drive saloon/estate options over here
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X drive is available in the UK as an option on 1 series and the new Mini estate,
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| stoatsbrother wrote: |
Which is why I now have a Subaru... |
You're safe, I rescue Subarus too.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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I have a RWD Jaguar XF, which has been largely terrible in CH in the snow, even with Winter tyres on. Therefore I would definitely take chains - they got me out of a spot of bother the other day.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Boredsurfing wrote: |
stoatsbrother,
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BMW do not sell their 4 wheel drive saloon/estate options over here
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X drive is available in the UK as an option on 1 series and the new Mini estate, |
On Saturday I visited the ski shop in Danbury, Essex, to drop in the board and skis for a service. There was plenty of snow about but once up the slope, their car park is flat.
Considering it is flat, how the hell did an X5 manage to get stuck in a parking space?
I sat and watched for a few minutes, he had all four wheels rotating away between attempts to dig it out with a shovel. I reversed my A6 quattro out of its space and drove home with a smile.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Willy Wavers of the World unite, you have nothing to lose but your chains...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I've driven my BMW estate to the alps with no drama. I didn't have snow tyres, I did have chains but I didn't use them. To be honest the only snowy bit was the last (flat) 100m to the hotel and I should have really put the chains on, but even then I managed to manouver the car into a parking spot where it stayed for a few days before driving out again with no drama. In the interests of balance and integrity I should point out that I did get stuck in the snow last year on my drive... I live in Berkshire at an altitude of about 50m. I coped with the actual snow just fine, it was when it turned to 20cm deep slush on top of ice that I had to resort to snow chains 
You are doing the right thing getting snow tyres and I would guess that if you park at Tasch you will probably never need to use your chains, but it's a very good idea to carry them.
I know of a few folks who live in the alps and drive BMWs and they cope fine with winter tyres. Sure, a 4wd would be even better for uncleared roads, but if you live on or near a main road you'll find the snow clearing is so effective it's not going to be a problem. People I know who live up steep hills and where roads are uncleared (e.g. the back streets of St Anton up in Nasserein) tend to have smaller cars with front or 4 wheel drive, but then again the taxi vans in St Anton are all rear wheel drive and I've seen them get up some very dodgy roads in snow and ice (with chains, and sometimes in reverse in order to make themselve "front" wheel drive I guess).
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Almost all Transit type vehicles are front wheel drive.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Some years ago I was sat next to a Romanian driving instructor while he reversed his front wheel drive Dacia 1300 (Renault 12) up a snowy hill at speed. It must be so that more weight is transferred to the driving wheels.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacia_1300
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and reverse is the lowest gear? Though normally lowest gear can cause problems. He knew his car, and his road, evidently.
I find a lot depends on the kind of snow. One sort of snow-covered road - absolutely no problem. another sort - no traction at all. The worst I encountered was 3 inches of freshly fallen wet spring snow on a previously warm road. 4 snow tyres which had carried me up that same stretch of road all winter just gave up - it was on with the chains.
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| bar shaker wrote: |
| Almost all Transit type vehicles are front wheel drive. |
Well, almost all the minivans (they tend to be VW Transporter I think) I've seen in St Anton are RWD, and when it snows heavily the drivers put chains on the rear wheels. The minibus I drove when I worked out there was RWD. It's perfectly possible to drive a RWD vehicle in the snow.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Mercs and VW minibuses are RWD and known for not being very good in the snow..... Renault, Opel, Vauxhal and Ford are all FWD and are very good in the snow (especially compared to the Merc and VWs)
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Somebody else has mentioned how good Saabs are in the snow ... you can have my "well seasoned" 10 yr old Saab 9-5 estate for 3 months and I'll look after your beamer
marcellus, I'm sure the newest VW Caravelles are FWD and both VW and Merc do 4x4 minibusses. We rent 2 Caravelle 4motion busses for the winter and they are absolutely cracking in the snow when shod with decent tyres.
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