Union's!

A snowHead

Anyone here ride Union Bindings? Im planning a pair of Union Force's this year Very Happy

Thoughts?

A snowHead

never tried them but the contacts look awesome.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

They get praised alot but can't comment from experience.

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Hey Dave,
I rode forces and cadets last season I was happy.
They have a few little probs but like other bindings check all bolts etc.
Heel cup often moves back I found and its not able to be tightened you will strip the bolt head off first.
Its to do with smaller boot sizes in l/xl bindings partly ie sz 8.5- 9uk in a lg/xl binding is to small a boot for the L/XL binding the heelcup shouldn't move but it does .
Toe Ratchets froze/stuck once,never figured it out could be a two fingered pull up plus push down ratchet unlike burton?
If it is ice you can determine by peeing on it, I didnt have time, so dropped in with one strap,it held.

I dont know what size brd or type of riding you are doing but you wont go too far wrong with Forces for anything,any size board.
I rode forces on 168,165,160 but ended up with soft cadets on the smaller board and have watched a friend carving very hard /committed in malamutes, cadets, on a f2 freeride 164 brd but think his stiff boots were doing the work.
So in all, grab them Dave

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Hi there, I've been riding Union force DLX's for the last two seasons, have put 60 odd days on them, on a 164 Arbor Abacus, generally off piste, BC etc - ie used them hard.

I think they're awesome. Light, super comfy, good adjustments, and really responsive, and have held up well, the leather on the toe straps has worn away, but that's just cosmetic. I'll probably buy Union again. I've ridden the high end Salomon, Burton, and Ride bindings a lot as well, and I reckon the Unions are better.

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Hi Hang11,
Your post is a great confirmation of union bindings in pow etc,I found the same as you, although less days use.It would seem they have got the flex right (design wise I guess with the `force`) for my riding anyway,over burton bindings.
Would you try/prefer a stiffer union model for your riding?
I have just soft strap wear on mine too but maybe thats what keeps them comfy all day long.
Also on union models,the ankel ratchet isnt bolted right through end of strap ,pulling on outer leather (will tear one day) but no big deal for now.

I am really interested in hearing on others intensive use of brds/boots in pow mainly (hardpack carving too, though for pow brds on piste).I,m set with unions for now,but boards and boots but I would always like to hear more for powder riding.
Would you be able give your opinion on the Abacus164/160 compared too whatever? good and bad but the negative is probably easier as powder boards are always tons of fun in fresh pow.
A friend has this board,so hope to ride it next season in some euro resort conditions at least,he,s very happy with it but its his first powder board, so would be.

With BC,s great powder and terrain/resorts,it must be a fantastic proving ground for specific powder gear,with service/gear too boot nearby.Just out of reach for myself, so would value your help/exper here if possible.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

By BC, I meant Back Country, not somewhere in the Northern Hemisphere with epic snow Very Happy

I live and ride NZ.

I think the Abacus rocks, I'm sold on Arbor boards, my wife has one too - a Push 156, and loves it. As an all around board it's limited, it has a very set back stance, and aggressive sidecut with not much tail, and doesnt ride switch at all well, but it's stiff as f**k, and is great for laying down big carves on the groomers/chowder as well. I've surfed for about 20 years, and find that the back foot style of the arbor is very like surfing. You have to push the board hard though, as it bites back sometimes, definitely suits an aggressive style. It's the most powder specific board I've ever owned, although I've had a few other pulled in tail/set back stance boards, but the Arbor is much better when it gets steep and deep. It just hangs in and charges on stupidly steep terrain, and is an effortless ride in powder. My bottle reaches its limits long before the board gets anywhere near its limits.

I'd really like a 163 Wasteland for the groomers, but they're heaps of coin here in NZ - $1000, so I got a Bataleon twin tip, for $300, which is great for mucking around on. I don't think the Abacus is probably the only board you would want in your quiver, it's no good for jibbing, unless every day is a pow day Very Happy

The Unions that I have are about the right flex, but I wear really stiff boots with my powder setup - DC Ghosts. The whole combo rides smoothly with great control. I love it.

This season's Abacus looks mint, it's got a black wood topsheet, and it looks like Arbor have come up with something a bit like magnetraction for their boards, so hopefully the US $ will go south, and I'll ship another one over to NZ.

Hope that helps.

After all it is free

Hang11,
I wrongly thought you must have, just got back from say, revelstoke/BC season working or something. Maybe you should tell the wife you have to go,cause Ive got some Q,s .!
Would like to ask you some more stuff, but fisrt need to know weight ,typical riding conds (icy? nth), foot angles, stance width, setback, would you have liked a 160cm so as perhaps more control/flex in certain conds (tight ,steep,wind blown etc) And if you can give post me $100 for few beers, as Im thirsty. NehNeh

Alot of reason I ask is that, I dont assume always, be set up right in each area and combination.Im getting closer though and see that what flex you have in your setup, is in the bindings.This fits with hard carving setups.Your brd did seem stiffer in shop.

I have had the most improvement in setup/riding with, binding stance width 1st and angles 2nd, fore/aft corrections for conds, no matter what I ride (all freeride ) but have discovered that its easy to be wrong about a board, bindings, boots. So am kind of into the nitty gritty,looking for the last 20% and confirmation.Some people are into it most arent.

I know every one is different but I dont buy into alot of the usual opinions, as they are market driven alot these days also its not just one board for me.Some work better when it counts,trees,glaciers resorts, wind pack,hangovers even etc.

Some of the riders on here were very helpful last season with ideas on boot fitting probs I have,its quite good place to ask about these things,so if you have any more too add, great, thanks.

Blimey! Feels like a trip to the doctor Laughing

Height: 6'4"
Weight: 95kg

Getting too close to 40 to be happy about it, and been snowboarding for 14 years now.

Typical riding conditions - all sorts this year, but preference is for the club fields in NZ, ungroomed, and varied terrain. Not much in the way of ice. No trees, they don't grow at altitude in NZ, it's more big wide open bowls, and steep faces, not often super dry snow.

Set back on the arbor is all the way, as far as it will go. Riding +17 and 0. Stance is narrow, no idea what it measures, I just muck around with it on a new board till it feels right.

I wouldn't have ridden a 160 Abacus, I like the 164 length, been surfing since I was a little kid, ridden longboards since the early 90's, and like the feel of a longer snowboard in powder. I ride a 157 Bataleon freestyle board too, +/-15 binding angles, sumo stance, and like the shorter length for mucking around on.

*Ski* the Net with snowHeads

Tirol 164, Everyone is different biomechanically nevermind quirks of style, technique etc therefore you can't really get a view of what works best from someone else for any given situation. Myself, I've never liked forward lean on bindings as it gives me cramp. The best thing I ever did from a gear perspective was demoing 3 different boards back to back on a powder day to really feel the difference between them, in fact the last 2 boards I've bought were a direct result of demos.

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

Hey Hang11,Fatbob,
Watch those doctors ,theyre nosey and can tell all sorts of stories, (stuff you dont want others too know about?.)
First, thanks Hang11 for coming through with info again, Fatbob I believe there are "general trends" in
how you set up a powder/freeride board for certain riding conds, trees vs steeps/board preferance in -- lenght vs physical strenght, that work better and will lead to real improvements for anyone.I think, alot ride comprimised but happy in resort on short brds.
I did as you did and demo,d (volkl selecta 168cm/163 in st anton,) and bought them ,demo is best way for 1 xboard,your on it.But I have canadian sticks and burtons as well to play with,I actually need more legs.
Another chap on here,bcjonny or stevo,( I think? not sure,) spent 3days sorting angles,stance etc( he came up within 2degrees of mine and hikes Back-c) .
It pays off testing, asking about abit,as Hang 11 rides 2 quiver boards etc but has completly different settings.He,s on track I would suggest.
One design point is lots of setback is not always needed,some sticks have it,40mm to 75mm say, some only have 25mm "usually longer noses though" but work great in there intended Speeds/conds,with no rear leg burn.

I also change brds back to back ,sometimes having 3x pow sticks (with binders on) in liftys huts/on the fence (small resort)etc .This is awesome on a button lift with offpiste access and no other riders,rinse and repeat,run after run,I was lucky once.
In looking at 28 tracks (mine) , each track sssing the same on a hill/face, all tracks side by side, I could see, where Im not symetrical/equal distant in forehand/backhand. It showed faults in technique, like in a painting, 80 mertres in falline but 28 tracks wide .

This real example, I thought, might explain what Im trying too acheive Fatbob, as I see you are helping out.Yes, it doesnt matter in pow, fun wise, but on "steeper icey hard pack" any tiny fault in technique shows up,-- to failure quickly .
Who can symetrically carve squashed figure eights on piste leaving a single line /rut? .I know someone who does this on a alpine brd, it is very impressive, symetrical by eye.
From the hard brd carving this guy takes it too powder, two hundred meters of symetrical sss track like it was on railway tracks ,not to mention varible snow conds/temps through falline,hes about 55.I think these two examples highlight alot of training in its forms but setup has to be started in the right sort of zone, dependent on rider to fine tune setup.

Alpine brds, carving brds,race brds have these "general trends"/zones of set up, that consistantly work as a start point.But Im not trying to be contra or anything and know most just get up and go with what they have.(I surfed bingin once with balinese kids that had no noses on 70,s relics,they ripped and paddled rings around me.But with modern kit/tuition they would have even been better,they just used what they had.)

Time on any board is foremost and if you spend over a month or two, every day, it starts to become alot clearer,you can see things/faults in others style but I fail to see my own somehow?.So always wanted to ask others in general who ride similar.

Your example Hang11, you are very similar too myself,I run narrow stance, you are taller with less degrees binding angles, which didnt surprise me givern your other riding ,"sumo style". (Hot tag,Im going to use it.)
You probably love going backwards It would seem? I imagine a stiff brd and bindings being super differcult in pow plus 50mm setback.
Listen,you got to check out Dupraz snowboards vids on You tube about this.If you havent already.A team rider got 1st in class in baker banked slalom on one.A maori chaps on vid down south too, on one,(but he didnt make it to baker). Maybe you know him?. I like that dupraz board.And think your stick would suit me in 160cm after listening to the doc,s report on stiffness,it must be fairly fast?.Got to go now, as Im still thirsty again.

snow reports

I never ride my arbor board backwards, it has no tail, and loads of nose, so it just feels "dead". I quite like riding switch on my other board, but I'm not massively into jibbing, it's all about big nasty carves in powder for me Very Happy

Just like surfing frozen waves really. I'll put some pics up over the weekend of my setups, so you can see the setback I use on the Arbor - it's pretty extreme, but it works for me.

Got a sneaky day off tomorrow, so hitting the mountains early for a few hours, snow's not that flash, but it beats working.

Hangii,
Yea!!, pictures would be cool to see,dont forget to check the switch riding, on Dupraz powder brd, on you tube if you have time, (brd will take hard or soft boots).Where are you riding,I,d like to hear bit more, as a friend is now getting a motel near turoa I think or probably other side.

I havent quiet, got a understanding of these club fields and conditions,compared to europe.I relise its vastly different in nz and snow is damper (and less depth by stats) , being never more than 70miles from the ocean in nz. I would think your,d be pleased about popularity of parks in nz, do they keep numbers down in club fields?Are club fields in nth?

I am thinking your choice, of a stiffer board like abacus may suit nz conditions in general in these club fields? (I know you dig it.) I keep thinking of very varible type conditions would, often be the case, windblown etc but I dont know this to be ,just thoughts, perhaps nth is more so than sth.

You know it makes sense.

Here's a pic of my feet, in Unions, on my Abacus, at the top of Porter Heights. The three black lines at the bottom of the hill are rows of cars in the car park.

If you want to find out a bit more about the club fields, which are all on the South Island, have a look at www.chillout.co.nz

If you are ever in NZ, they are so worth a visit. Usually sketchy rope tows, but the terrain is great, they're cheap and friendly and very low key.

Here's a few more pictures from the South Island of NZ. It's a beautiful place in winter.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

hang11, I hate you with the passion of 1000 burning suns for being in such a beautiful place while i languish in central london surrounded by concrete, steel and free paper distributors. Track some lines for the rest of us... Smile

A snowHead

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