 Poster: A snowHead
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Going to Val D'Isere from April 5-12. A 14 Year Old Expert skier, was skiing every off piste opportunity going back to a lift in Kitzbuhel with comfort. Last year, I was skiing everything in Mott Canyon, Heavenly with comfort.
So tell me, hows the snow conditions usually by then? Will the off piste be okay? And how's the general Val D'Isere area? All I know about the skiing is that it is famous for its off piste and that the Espace Killy is BIG.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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skiking4, Just got back from Tignes, skied a fair bit of VDI area and you won't be disappointed with the off piste. Evolution2 do 4hrs group guided for 55 Euros, and there is a fair bit you can do yourself as long as you scope things out. Watch heading full pelt down the forests as there are a lot of small cliff bands. Saw one chap caught up in trees 10 feet above the piste cutting through... he had to force the skis past them and then fall onto his back from a straight drop.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks for the info but by cliff bands like how big? Because I can easily ski up to 10 footers and comfortably ski 15s. I haven't gotten the chance to ski 15+ ft but I probably can.
oh and another question: is it easy to ski over to the tignes glacier if the snow isn't any good in VDI?
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skiking4, Most of the drops I saw were round 10 ft but they had close trees at the bottoms. Follow the lift cuts for the open ares. It's very easy to get over to Tignes plus Val has a glacier area. The Killy pass covers both areas. Take a look at http://www.chaletchardons.com/off-piste.html
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ok any other info?
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Tue 26-03-19 5:02; edited 1 time in total
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skiking4, the EK is big, very big but you'll do the majority in a week if you can ski a bit. Did a bit of off-piste in December but it gets tracked real quickly, especially over in Tignes. If you want tree, cliff drops and big pow then head over to the Le Fornet side of Val - amazing scenery, empty slopes and tons of tree and pow to be had. Plus, it's nice when the weather closes in because of the trees.
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Approx 90% of the Espace Killy is freeride area. Loads of off-piste runs, if you know where to go. 
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Okay, any other suggestions?
Last edited by After all it is free  on Tue 26-03-19 5:02; edited 1 time in total
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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What more do you need to know? The snow will be good, there are lots of piste and lots of off-piste. All your initial questiosn have been answered.
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skiking4, Maybe you need to be more specific with your questions.
I can't comment on the off piste or cliff bands (not done any), but to answer your other as best i can:
"hows the snow conditions usually by then?" Dunno about 'usually' but this years looking pretty hopeful 
"And how's the general Val D'Isere area?" Big, with lots of on and off piste variety. Not much in the way of beginners slopes and the runs tend to be 'undergraded' particularly the notorious last 500m of 'Verte' which is labelled green but would be red anywhere else. From your description of yourself as "Last year, I was skiing everything in Mott Canyon, Heavenly with comfort" I don't see this presenting you with a problem. (I took one look at Mott Canyon, and decided that discretion was the better part of valour).
"is it easy to ski over to the tignes glacier if the snow isn't any good in VDI?" Depends if the routes are open (i.e if the snow is good enough and the wind not too high. However it is normally possible to ride a lift over there anyway. (at least it has been whenever I've been to ValD or Tignes.
BTW If price matters it's cheaper to stay in Tignes that ValD and the two resorts are well connected so skiing wise it makes little difference.
More important info, in Val visit the Morris Bar, in Tignes The Alpakka (which is also a reasonably priced hotel) . 
Dicks Tea Bar in Val also offers some interesting opportunities for new experiences (well new to me anyway) 
The Chalethotel Morris is above the Morris bar, is relatively cheap (for Val) and offers single rooms if that is a factor.
Of course if you are 14, I guess the last couple of points may may not be so relevant.
HTH 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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"The last 500m of Verte ..." The only tricky part on Verte is just before the tunnel at the end of the day, and where it continues along the road after crossing Coupe du Monde where it can become icy. The stretch between the Mont Blanc chair and the tunnel is hilarious at 4.30pm, though.
I would touch DTB with yours. Jacques down the road is far better, and Cafe Face (opposite) has a rather interestingly attired and tattooed barmaid who, I'm sure, would love to have done very bad things with me.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skiking4,
I have skied there a lot, about 35 weeks so far. But you're question is a bit too general, I'm afraid I haven't the time to spend 3 hours writing all I know about the place.
If you are specifically looking for cliffs to jump off I can't tell you where they are, that's why I'm still alive. If you want to go off piste safely you should go with one of the many off piste mountain guides which will cost about €55 for half a day. All of the off piste schools are listed on the Val D'Isere website.
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You know it makes sense.
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Okay, here's my more specific question:
Does snow fall in April?
If no snow, is it just going to be like Eastern US (if you haven't been there, its just a huge sheet of ice) in the morning and wet spring snow in the afternoon?
How does the off piste compare in challenge to Kitzbuhel, or to Mott Canyon in Heavenly, CA?
Any recommendations of guides? Thinking of going with my tour guide's mountain guides (Esprit Ski), but that's €141 for 9 AM to 5 PM, and maybe it's better something more like 9 AM to 12 or 1 PM for, as said by welshflyer, €55.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Does snow fall in April (in Val d'Isere)? Yes. They have loads of it last year.
Esprit Ski - number one in family skiing for 25 years. They may be limiting with where they take you.
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Poster: A snowHead
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skiking4, Oh yes, its snows in April, and even if its rain in resort its snow higher up. Runs home can be slushy in the evenings,
For more info look ath this
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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skiking4,
Have been to Val d Isere in early April twice before - and off for a long weekend there in 3 weeks.
Conditions were fabulous - snow on the Motte and the Pisaillas glaciers was nice and grippy.
All pistes were in excellent condition but softened up by early afternoon - even the Sache was open all the way down (admittedly it was a bit wet).
You'll have a great time - quite warm there at the moment but I'm sure winter's not entirely over yet.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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>Does snow fall in April?
Yes
>If no snow, is it just going to be like Eastern US (if you haven't been there, its just a huge sheet of ice) in the morning and wet spring snow in the afternoon?
COnditions vary, it can be like that yes, but it can be good. The conditions of the snow are a function of the weather - if it's hot, it will melt to sluch, then refreeze overnight
>How does the off piste compare in challenge to Kitzbuhel, or to Mott Canyon in Heavenly, CA?
I wasn;t very experienced when I did Mott Canyon, but Mott Canyon is *one* area@ Heavenly, Solaise alone is probalby the size of Heavenly
>Any recommendations of guides?
Can't help sorry, never used guides
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Guides? Try Alpine Experience - based out of Jean Sports in the main town.....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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skiking4,
Mountain Guides:-
Alpine Experience based in Jean Sport on the main road, near the Tourist Office and opposite the Moris Pub. Top Ski are based in the Galerie de Cimes (the small arcade of shops) opposite the little bus station on the main road going out towards La Daille. The Development Centre (TDC) in Precision Ski Shop near the tourist office. Mountain Masters in Killy Sport Shop? next to tourist office. ESF above the road tunnel in thecentre of town. Here is the link to the ski schools:-
http://www.valdisere.com/gb/glisse/ecoles/ecoles_de_ski.php?expandable=1&ssmenu=24
Snow Conditions - There's a huge base of snow this year and with the exception of a couple of pistes, the pistes are pisted every night. All the moguls will be gone first thing in the morning, but it may be a little icy until it softens up during the daytime. By about 3pm it may start to get slushy/heavy.
The off piste isn't too difficult but you need to go with qualified mountain guides who will equip you with a Transceiver. The off piste will probably be too dangerous in the afternoon in April. If there has been no new snow for a while the guides will be walking using touring skis and skis to hike to untracked snow, which is a lot of hard work.
If you are only 14 years old you may have to have an adult accompany you in off piste groups, you should check beforehand.
Here is the link to the Village/Town Map (it's not to scale, the distance from centre to La Daille is about 1 km and to Le Fornet about 2 km).
http://www.valdisere.com/gb/village/plan_station/plan_village.php?expandable=4&ssmenu=52
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Pound for Pound the best resort to ski and Board IMO.
Have been going for years now and still can't get enough. (off tomorrow for a week with the family and can't wait).
Take a look at the piste map and then look at all the off-piste available.
http://www.valdisere.com/images09/plan/plandesp_petit.jpg
Book it up. You'll not regret it.!
Kev.
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Further to kev360's note - the piste map his link points to shows the names of a lot of off-piste routes e.g. Kern, La Spatule and les Coves on Bellevarde, Les Danaides, Le Lavancher below Solaise, Super L, Le Lievre Blanc at Laisanant and many more - they're easy to find on the map. Vamos do a guidebook to Val D'Isere - Tignes off-piste which you will be able to pick up on Amazon or probably in the resort.
If you want a comparison with Mott Canyon then I would say that some routes are very much harder particularly the couloirs and some have easier gradients, but all are strictly unmaintained and unpatrolled unlike Mott Canyon which I believe is still actually within resort bounds at Heavenly.
Like the other contributors have said - do not be tempted to go on any of these on your own - Tignes has had a number of deaths in recent years on off-piste routes that are very close to pisted runs.
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skiking4,
When I said that the off piste isn't difficult, I meant that the qualified guides will take you to the best snow and slopes that are suitable for the group to ski. Because the guides know the area well they will know the lines down the slopes that don't lead to dead ends or cliffs etc. It's impossible to follow these off piste routes from the guide books, I've got the books.
By the fact you are off piste you have increased the risk of of being caught by an avalanche. Henrys' Avalanche Talk (HAT) is held each Tuesday in Dicks T-Bar in Val D'Isere at 18.00 hours. He is one of the mountain guides and he talks about spotting some of the dangers of Avalanches etc. I think it's about €5 to attend the talk.
http://hat.skioffpiste.co.uk/abouthat/programmes.html
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| welshflyer wrote: |
| If you are only 14 years old you may have to have an adult accompany you in off piste groups, you should check beforehand. |
Aren't there like junior guides?
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skiking4,
I don't understand what you mean by junior guides.
The mountain guides are all very highly qualified in mountain crafts and many are also qualified ski instructors. It takes them many years for them to attain their qualifications.
They don't have junior or adult groups they simply have groups based on their off piste skill levels.
I'm afraid I can't answer anymore questions because I'm off to Val D'Isere again.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I hope I don't need an adult because I am better skier than my family.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 26-03-19 5:03; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skiking4, I can tell, just from reading your posts what a modest, unassuming all round great guy you must be. You probably don't even need a guide,and if you had one they probably couldn't keep up with you.
Have a wonderful time in Val D. 
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| skiking4 wrote: |
| I hope I don't need an adult. I am WAY better than the rest of my family (intermediate skiers). |
If you are going off-piste you should have a qualified guide - who will inevitably be an adult. While you obviously consider yourself such an absolute whizz on skis, there is no point in thinking yourself the best 14 year old skier in the known universe if you are dead.
I suspect you have been steering this thread as a bit of a wind up. If not, then the most important skiing technique you still have to learn is a becoming degree of humility.
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You know it makes sense.
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Axsman, ccl, I mean I hope I don't need an adult in my family to ski with a guide as I'll be stuck to the red pistes then.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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skiking4, if you;re going off piste, the organisation may not accept "un-accompanied minors", so you may have to go with someone who will take responsibilty. It all depends on who you book with - some will, some won't. Wahtever you do, don't attempt to go off piste on your own, in europe the off piste is not avalaanche controlled as it is in North America, people have died in Avalanches within sight of the piste in the Espace Killy - you may be a great skiier but I don't expect that at the age of 14 you will have the backcountry knowledge and experience to be able to assess the conditions of a slope in an unfamiliar ski resort - although I may well be wrong of course!
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Axsman wrote: |
skiking4, I can tell, just from reading your posts what a modest, unassuming all round great guy you must be.
Have a wonderful time in Val D. |
Sounds like a perfect resort for him with all the other modest and unassuming people that are attracted to such a place..
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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skiking4, I make no apologies for being caustic about your attitude, but let me be more explicit about this business of skiing off-piste. Here is one description of Val D'Isère and off-piste punters:
the ski domain is very large, over 300 km of ski runs in a number of different valleys and a great deal of off-piste. Val d'Isère itself is located in a steep valley. These slopes with their challenging skiing attract the hard core skiers, unfortunately it is exactly these steeper slopes that are most prone to avalanches. Over the years much of the safe, and to be honest with you, a great deal of unsafe terrain has been exploited. While the off piste possibilities are vaste they are often on some particularly suspect pitches. At the same time the resort attracts a young international, for the great anglo-saxon, population. Armed with the latest freeride skis and snowboards, charged up on Extreme Sports channel videos the whole mountain seems skiable, there are quite literally NO LIMITS for these riders. Perhaps in Val for one or two weeks, maybe for a season, they have neither the knowledge acquired through spending many seasons in the resort or the caution of many years backcountry skiing.
http://pistehors.com/backcountry/wiki/Savoie/Val-D-Isere-Off-Piste
Three thoughts for you:
If you find it hard to accept that you may have to have an adult accompanying you, think for a moment of the guide: he/she has enough responsibility for a group without adding to that by having to take an unaccompanied minor.
You are 14. If you can't go off-piste this holiday, too bad, there is time enough ahead of you. You can enjoy superb on-piste skiing in that area. I assume your parents are prepared to pay for an off-piste guide but if you can't go unaccompanied, perhaps you can join an advanced class? The reds and blacks around that area may not be the jumping off precipices kind of thrill you really want, but can sure extend the repertoire of your skiing skills.
This advice is coming from an old fart, so is likely to be disregarded by you. But I have skied a lot on and off piste and I'm a qualified alpine instructor. Perhaps I have survived long enough to become an old fart by taking risks in a controlled and reasonably sensible way. Think on it!!
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Fri 3-04-09 7:01; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ccl, I understand and I am booking a guide but notice in one of my other posts I had indicated that I was going to use a guide by asking which guide ski school I should use.
My tour company, Esprit Ski, indicates that they do have a "teen off piste exploration" group but don't indicate how much it is on their brochure for some reason.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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That's reassuring! It was that stuff about not wanting to have to go with an adult that was alarming. "Teen off piste exploration" sounds good. I hope it is within budget and you have a great time.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yeah I'm definitely not going to be skiing off piste this time by myself.
Thinking of Alpine Experience (52 euros for afternoon) btw
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
If no snow, is it just going to be like Eastern US (if you haven't been there, its just a huge sheet of ice) in the morning and wet spring snow in the afternoon?
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skiking4: Do you mean all the time in the east - or just in late spring? On different trips I've skied Killington, Smugglers Notch, Stowe and Mt Sunapee and been lucky enough to have nothing other than powder/packed powder/great conditions. That was on a mix of January and March trips.
Am I right in thinking that you ski mainly in the US? Have you skied much in Europe before? Just that in my time at about 10 resorts in western US (including Alta/Snowbird after a 10 day snow drought this January) I've noticed a trend of US skiers being completely spoiled by western snow conditions. I've seen squeaky, corduroy packed powder described as "kinda icy" (which may be the sheet ice you refer to in the east?) and signs declaring "Warning:marginal conditions" when they mean a pebble has emerged onto the surface of the snow. Really funny for us Euro ski veterans.....
Meanwhile, I would support the use of Alpine Experience - Mrs MA and I had a great morning with them last winter. Great value too. You get a longer session if you go on their morning outings (09.00 - 13.00) as opposed to their pm outings, which don't start until 14.00.
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skiking4, its April so get the 1st lift up and ski the Epaule du Charvet piste before 9.30. This wil tell you how good a skier you are.
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mountainaddict, I went to Lake Tahoe a month after no snow last year (also a month after their biggest snowfall in a month ever). Locals complained about the "ice". To me, these would be top 5 days in conditions in the East.
Yes, I have skied in Europe once but I got amazing conditions at Kitzbuhel-- 5-6 ft of light snow in 5 days with no extremely cold weather and two epic back to back days when a meter had fallen blue bird sky days with small crowds. That's my European experience-- the best you can get.
In New York, where I usually ski except I'm in London for the year, at Hunter Mountain we get less than a 100 inches. After 80+% of all snowfalls, it rains.
You were extremely lucky to not get rain during your trips.
In the East, if you're not skiing during the snow, then you won't be after.
Frosty the Snowman, I'm pretty sure a piste won't be much trouble at all... except FUN!!!!!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| skiking4 wrote: |
mountainaddict, I went to Lake Tahoe a month after no snow last year (also a month after their biggest snowfall in a month ever). Locals complained about the "ice". To me, these would be top 5 days in conditions in the East.
Yes, I have skied in Europe once but I got amazing conditions at Kitzbuhel-- 5-6 ft of light snow in 5 days with no extremely cold weather and two epic back to back days when a meter had fallen blue bird sky days with small crowds. That's my European experience-- the best you can get.
In New York, where I usually ski except I'm in London for the year, at Hunter Mountain we get less than a 100 inches. After 80+% of all snowfalls, it rains.
You were extremely lucky to not get rain during your trips.
In the East, if you're not skiing during the snow, then you won't be after.
Frosty the Snowman, I'm pretty sure a piste won't be much trouble at all... except FUN!!!!!! |
Hope you've got good insurance, sounds like you'll need it!
When in the Espace you'll discover you're not as good a skiier as you think you are, especialy if you compare yourself to the seasonaires in Tignes.
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FAQ
