 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm in a quandry - three weeks ago I was fooling about with my son at the bottom of the lift waiting for the others to arrive when I almost did the splits and something went "pop" in my knee. It did not collapse under me and, while I felt that there was something wrong, I was not in pain. I sat at the bar at the base of the lift with a bag of snow wrapped round my leg for about and hour then skied back to the chalet. Again, something wasn't right but it wasn't painful. By the time I got my trousers off it was moderately swollen. Didn't ski for the rest of the week and had a course of anti-inflammatories.
I have been to see two different physios. One says that while there is a slight difference in the amount of play in the bad knee, it is stable and that if I'd done anything too major it would have been really very painfull.
The other physio says that there is a difference between both knees but that my hamstrings are working overtime to stabilise the knee. He recommends an MRI.
Question is which one to go with - Have any other  's damaged the acl and not had any pain? Is it possible?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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ickabodblue, I had a very similar thing.. go see a surgeon then have an MRI. At Ross Hall my consultant dude was Mr. Cartlidge and he was absolutely excellent, he only works Wednesdays as the rest of the time he does NHS stuff. If you could get to see him either way it would be a good idea. The MRI I had showed some slight damage to the PCL and a bit of fluid in the knee but I was O.K apart from that and it stopped bothering me.
I see no reason NOT to get an MRI!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ickabodblue,
Could be anything, if you want a recommendation consult with Bill Leach at Glasgow Sports Surgery Service - www.gsss.co.uk
I did my ACL last year and nothing I read when it happened led me to think that the repair could be as good as it is, he is a skier and knows exactly what you need.
The only thing I can say to help you just now is that there was an audible pop when I did it, the sound of which I would compare to blowing up and then bursting an empty crisp packet. There was also a momentary severe pain at the very same time, which I did not feel again until a day or two afterwards, although by then it was much less painful and this could have been my hairline fracture of the tibia which happened at the same time.
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arv, Insurance company have sent me to the Nuffield. I suppose I've got nothing to lose by going for the scan, just wondered if it was necessary. Was your knee painful at all? I can't help thinking that if it is not really sore there can't be much wrong with it.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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robboj, There was a "pop" which made me feel kinda queasy. It just didn't sound natural, yeuch.
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ickabodblue, not at all! I carried on with my running and drinking as normal. A bit of dull pain when it happened but I hit the ground pretty hard, I skied the rest of the holiday after some rest. I had to have it checked out for insurance purposes. All it takes is 20 minutes to have the knee scanned and you will then be certain of what may or may not be wrong with the knee 
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| ickabodblue wrote: |
| arv, Insurance company have sent me to the Nuffield. I suppose I've got nothing to lose by going for the scan, just wondered if it was necessary. Was your knee painful at all? I can't help thinking that if it is not really sore there can't be much wrong with it. |
I dont know what insurance you have, but surely its down to your GP to refer you to the best person for the job - not for the insurance company to decide who should treat you.
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genepi, Nuffield is a private hospital, one of not very many round here. In fact one of two? The wait for an MRI scan on the NHS here is 6 months (depending on who is putting you on the list). Not great deal of choice going on. If it is for the MRI I wouldn't imagine it would matter who pressed the button.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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arv, As long as the Nuffield has the right person. Insurance companies are increasingly trying to manage medical problems - surely its better to get advice as to who to see & discuss it with your GP.
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genepi, Yeh you are right. Hopefully ickabodblue's GP is a whole bunch better than mine was in the situation, ''steroid injections'' is not the answer to everything 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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genepi, I had spoken to the GP, he took it for granted that I would go to the Nuffield. It is the nearest one which appears on the insurers list of approved hospitals. Myself and my family have attended it for a variety of things over the years (though never for a knee) and not had any cause for complaint.
arv, Of course your right, Even if it turns out to be nothing the scan will put my mind at rest. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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ickabodblue, they wouldn't refer you unless you needed it - MRI scans cost ££££. Good luck and let us know what they find
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For the record, a couple of consultations and an MRI at Ross Hall=£800
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You know it makes sense.
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They can normally tell from the laxity tests if you've done it or not. An MRI will show up damage if they are unsure and also any additional damage to other ligaments and your bones. Some people are in agony when they snap their ACL, I was like you and it didn't hurt too much, I just knew I'd hurt myself.
red 27, I was surprised at how little the MRI costs when people say they cost ££££. Mine in France cost 280 euros and when I got literature from Nuffield where I'm having surgery, it was still only ~£400. If you've got the money and they are unsure of the diagnosis get it done.
(Having surgery to fix my ACL this saturday)
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Get the MRI you dont want to diagnose it on the first run next year. Friends who have bust knee ligaments seemed to be doing fine but then it goes with out warning again (without surgery). Repair jobs have a high success rate now good physio during recupperation makes a big difference. On the other hand you might be fine but at least you'll know.
Hope it all works out
I have a conflicting opinions about my knee pains too they're either sore from skiing 2 weeks ago or from not skiing last week. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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kristof, Good luck for Saturday, let us know how you get on.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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kristof, hope it works according to plan!
ickabodblue, let us know what you end up doing/the outcome!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ickabodblue, nothing to lose on having the MRI. Badly damaged my MCL a few years back although got away with zero damage to the cruciates (consultant said I was lucky considering the damage to the MCL).
The injury was incredibly painful for the few hours after I did it and made me feel quite ill, the pain settled down after a few days (had surgery on day five after initial swelling had gone down). There was some difference in the 'play' in the knee although the knee itself was 'stable'. It could be that either you've damaged one of the medial ligaments or popped a cartlidge.
Do let us know the outcome - I developed a weird fascination with knees after my injury (and the subsequent THREE operations!).
Also, to follow on what others have said, do insist on sports injury specialists (including after-care) if you can - it will definitely pay off!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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ickabodblue,
Bill Leach consults at the Nuffield, that where I saw him and where he did the surgery. He consults on a Monday morning and cuts on a Thursday, rest of his time is NHS at the Western. He is the knee specialist in Scotland, was in the Herald last year for some new revolutionary knee surgery he has devised
He was recommended to me and I could not recommend him more strongly!
PM me if you want more info
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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robboj, That's great, thanks very much for that info. Need to contact the insurance company tomorrow and will pm you if I need to know anything else. Thanks 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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what possible reason would you not go for the MRI? It will either confirm you have done nothing, or hopefully show up any issues. I had knee issues, had MRI, nothing bad was detected and physio has alleviated the pain (hamstring was pulling knee).
Good luck!
Greg
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ickabodblue, it is possible not to have pain when the cruciate is torn, ligaments not too well equiped with painsensors, and also if completely torn will not relay pain. Rather the swelling, bleeding and fluid build-up in knee will cause pain. Instability can be masked by muscle spasm. Agree, go for MRI and get all checked out.
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Take some arnica, it will be fine.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Even though the pain was minimal I went for an MRI last month and it picked up a cracked bone that didn't show up on the X-ray. There might be something wrong with your knee that doesn't give much pain at the moment but is "an accident waiting to happen". The MRI might pick up something that prevents you sitting out the next ski holiday too.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I got taken out by a boarder, same as you nothing hurt, but my knee didn't feel quite right. I iced it and used the age old antiinflamitory - ibruprofen washed down with wine. That evening knee had swollen but I still had good range of movement & I was able to ski for the rest of the trip. However, MRI has shown I have ruptured my acl and my cartledge. Just waiting for surgery. I'm happy to read people's positive experiences here though.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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ickabodblue,
I popped my ACL Jan 07 (don't you just love ice)...not much pain, not aware of any popping sound just a sixth sense that something wasn't quite right.
Had the leg looked at by no less than 3 orthopods & 5 physios....only 2 of them picked up the rupture the other 6 all thought I'd just given the knee a bad wallop.
Have the MRI...nothing to lose..all to gain.
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As a skier, I think it a good idea to have a GP who specialises in sports injury. Mine does - and he would be my first port of call for something like this. I think as a specialist directly seeing the patient he has the edge over a consultation on snowheads.
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