 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi,
I took my family sking to switzerland last year and took out the bog standard ski insurance which I assumed would cover cost of any type of evacuation off the mountain due to an accident, as the policy said large sum of £`s for medical costs (can`t remember the exact amount). We had no accidents so did not have to call upon the services of the rescue teams.
We are going to the same place again this year Saas Fee. (We only got into skiing last year so it will only be nursery slopes and the odd blue run, no off piste stuff).
There was a topic on the this site the other day about skiers in france having to pay extra or get extra cover when they bought their ski pass if they were required to be evacuated off the mountain due to injury.
this was not offered to me when i bought my ski passes at the kiosk at the lift system in switzerland last year. Do they have the same type of extra cover available in Swizterland?
I know from climbing in the Alps you have to have to have mountain rescue insurance to cover the cost of helicopter lift off, and search and rescue team's time and effort involved.
Yes I am going to ask my insurance company, but i would like to know peoples first hand accounts and experiences of ski injury rescue in Switzerland.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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If you have ski holiday travel insurance you will be covered for piste rescue. I have never quite worked out why everyone on here is convinced that they need extra insurance for it, or why they persist in buying travel insurance which they think is inadequate. Quite bizarre.
I'm not complaining, however, as I am bonused on selling the stuff. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Lizzard, interesting. I got Carre Neige for the first time ever this year, but remained unconvinced about actually needing it. The power of snowHeads! Shall be interested to see how this thread pans out.
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Lizzard,
I hope there are no teachers reading this thread, you may get lines for bad grammar, using a noun as a verb  ,
Aneira
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Lizzard, in that case, can you recommend a good ski-insurance company?
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my mate didnt have Carre Neige last year and got stung for the piste rescue
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bargainbill, the Swiss tend to treat things a little differently, whilst I have never been unfortunate enough to have an accident I know enough people who have, in general the reports are the same in that they will present you with an invoice and plenty of time to pay, in some cases the insurer is the one actually presented with the invoice it seems to depend on the insurer though, some seem to want you to pay out for the rescue and then be refunded by them whilst others just arrange for everything.
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Aneira, shocking, but the alternative which presented itself was 'incentivised'.
ronaldothefrog, 'Fraid not. I have never bought ski insurance other than Carte Neige/Assur' 2Alpes, as I'm covered by the French healthcare system.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| If you have ski holiday travel insurance you will be covered for piste rescue. |
Yesterday I tried to confirm from Internet sites whether the standard ski holiday travel insurance covers recovery including e.g. helicopter extraction. I still haven't found a clear statement  When you say "piste rescue", Lizzard, does that include helicopters?
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To find out exactly what is covered by your insurance, you need to read the policy . . . carefully. If it is still not clear, contact the insurance company, or the broker who arranged the insurance and get a response in writing confirming that the specific risk which concerns you is included. Asking someone unconnected with YOUR insurer what is included in YOUR policy is pointless - how can Lizzard know?
I cannot imagine that any reputable* insurer would market a policy covering winter sports which does not include rescue from any prepared piste by whatever means are deemed necessary by the local rescuers, but there is no way I would tell you that your policy covers that unless I had a copy of your policy document.
*Yes, there are such things, I believe!!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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bargainbill, I think what people are getting at is that there are two questions.
1. Does your policy give you the cover you want? As Yellow Pyranha says, it should do but there's only one way to find out; read it.
2. If you need to to be rescued, will the rescuers demand some sort of payment or evidence of cover from you before they'll rescue you or will they worry about that later? If you're in any doubt, make sure that you have details of your insurance and, preferably, a credit card, with you when you ski.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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espri, why would piste rescue insurance exclude a particular mode of transport? 'Yes, you're covered as long as you're not evacuated by mule train.'
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As I understand it, my ski insurance will cover the costs of rescue off the mountain. However, in France for rescue off the mountain it seems that the rescuers will normally only accept cash or carre neige - they can't be expected to read the small print of your ski insurance policy that you happen to carry in your pocket to know that your insurance will pick up the cost. Of course if you pay by cash you could probably get it refunded by the insurance company but it may be a substantial amount that you would to fork out for.
For me therefore, I have ski insurance with Direct Travel and if in France, will also get carre neige - for a few Euros/day I believe it's worthwhile for the hassle-free rescue, should I ever be in an unfortunate position to need it.
That's my understanding anyway .... 
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You know it makes sense.
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For virtually anything that you have to claim from your insurance, you will have to pay out up front and claim it back.
For example:
Missed departure (assuming it's not your fault!) and having to buy a new flight
Luggage lost/delayed and having to buy new gear
Minor medical costs
Why is piste rescue any different? I'm baffled as to why this subject provokes so much debate? 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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>>Why is piste rescue any different? I'm baffled as to why this subject provokes so much debate?
So am I, sometimes, but sometimes not. Reading the threads on here, however, I swap between thinking CN is a good/pointless idea. I think the things that disconcerts are (1) the requirement for considerably quantities of up-front CASH, and (2) the uncertainty of rescue without CN.
If my flight is cancelled, I can produce my credit card and summon a private jet, should I so require. Then reclaim the costs, so fine.
If I am hurt on the slopes, my credit card is apparently useless. Where do I find a cashpoint on piste? What if they won't take me to it? How much cash might I need anyway - all sorts of numbers are bandied about as each person who attends to you wants more cash? And will I die of hypothermia first?
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Poster: A snowHead
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James the Last,
| Quote: |
Reading the threads on here, however, I swap between thinking CN is a good/pointless idea. I think the things that disconcerts are (1) the requirement for considerably quantities of up-front CASH, and (2) the uncertainty of rescue without CN.
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Me too. Spot on.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| stevomcd wrote: |
For virtually anything that you have to claim from your insurance, you will have to pay out up front and claim it back.
For example:
Missed departure (assuming it's not your fault!) and having to buy a new flight
Luggage lost/delayed and having to buy new gear
Minor medical costs
Why is piste rescue any different? I'm baffled as to why this subject provokes so much debate? |
For most "Service" events which can be covered by insurance (in general, not just ski insurance), most providers of the service can claim the insutred costs directly from teh insurance company, withougt having to bill the "customer" at all. Others will usually still bill you later, rather than requiring payment before they willl carry out the service.
For some reason French (and I believe it is only French) rescue operators appear unwilling to do either of these, and the fees that have to be paid up front can be very high.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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>>and the fees that have to be paid up front can be very high.
But moreover, in cash, when you are a 10km piste run away from a cash machine - and have no legs.
Essentially the CN is a rip off. But one that is probably foolish/hard to avoid.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| espri, why would piste rescue insurance exclude a particular mode of transport? |
A helicopter rescue can add thousands of Euros to the cost (and in my area helicopters are often called for "relatively minor" accidents, just to get the patient quickly to hospital). Whether that is covered depends on the insurance policy. In practice, each individual policy has to be checked, as Yellow Pyranha said. I just wondered whether, in your experience, it usually is (maybe the question is silly). However, my question was based on hearing of people being surprised by unexpectedly large rescue bills. It may be, of course, that they weren't properly insured and just expected the same treatment as if they had been knocked down in the streets.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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And now a personal question. I am insured through the Deutscher Skiverband (DSV) and that covers helicopter rescue, etc. However, I'm going to France in March. Will I need to buy a CN as well, to be covered for rescue there? I have ordered a lift ticket for L2A without the rescue part, assuming that my German insurance would be enough.
And an extra question: if we ski La Grave, is that covered by the CN?
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Thu 29-01-09 11:57; edited 1 time in total
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| Quote: |
Rescue in the mountains doesn’t come cheap, make sure you’re covered ! The average cost of rescue for the 2006/2007 season was (north French Alps / Savoy statistics) :
1 - Medical charges : 222€
2 - Rescue charges :
- lower slopes : 126€
- further / difficult slopes : 292€
- off piste : 524€
3 - Ambulance charges : 148€
4 - Helicopter : 1225€ |
From the Carre neige site. It also covers you for up to €15,000 for rescue in Scotland, Switzerland etc. etc.
The refunds for resort closure are less than generous - a maximum of 4 days' closure is covered, and you only get three of the days back. So from a 6 day pass, if the resort never opens, you get 50% back. Pointless insurance...
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| stevomcd wrote: |
| .....Why is piste rescue any different? I'm baffled as to why this subject provokes so much debate? |
I suspect, then, that you have not been involved in an accident on the slopes. I have. The last thing you want to be worried abut is how you are going to pay immediately for the rescue.
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I have been involved in or helped out in several, all in France (where I live). It has never, ever been an issue. People are taken down the mountain and to hospital (if required) with no questions asked. The rescue services do, quite rightly, pointedly ask for payment once the immediate carnage is over. Credit card has invariably been the method of choice, although I'm aware of a few cases where people have never paid up.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
For most "Service" events which can be covered by insurance (in general, not just ski insurance), most providers of the service can claim the insutred costs directly from teh insurance company, withougt having to bill the "customer" at all. Others will usually still bill you later, rather than requiring payment before they willl carry out the service.
For some reason French (and I believe it is only French) rescue operators appear unwilling to do either of these, and the fees that have to be paid up front can be very high.
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Nonsense.
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| stevomcd wrote: |
| I have been involved in or helped out in several, all in France (where I live). It has never, ever been an issue. People are taken down the mountain and to hospital (if required) with no questions asked. The rescue services do, quite rightly, pointedly ask for payment once the immediate carnage is over. Credit card has invariably been the method of choice, although I'm aware of a few cases where people have never paid up. |
My rescue off the slopes was in Fernie -where skiddoo rescue was free (insurance part of the lift pass cost I believe). I was very grateful that I had no hassle. In France, some snowheads tell of horrific tales of their rescuers taking them past ATMs before delivering there patients to the medical centre. I am sure neither you nor they are lying - but it does seem to be pot luck how the service works out unless you have CN - in which case all reports are of good service. For the trivial cost involved, I really don't care about all the theories of not needing CN, and how others such as yourself have experienced a tickety-boo situation; I fork out for CN when I get my lift pass - and do not begrudge Lizzard her commission.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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There seems to be a different account of mountain rescue in France dependant on whether you are a French resident or a tourist. Would this be true to say?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Not really, I run a chalet out here and most of my experiences have been helping out guests (i.e. Tourists). Speaking good French certainly helps a lot.
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Is there an equivalent to Carte Neige (I mean the weekly, rather than season, policy) in Austria?
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You know it makes sense.
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To clear up my own situation, I phoned the Deutscher Skiverband (through whom I am insured). Their explanation was that all costs should be handled by my normal health insurance in the first place. Additional costs, e.g. helicopter, would then be covered by the DSV insurance but paid once invoiced. They also said that there should be no problem in France and I certainly didn't get the impression that they expected I would have to pay on the slopes. Are the tales we read here just horror stories (I assume not) or is it just that the system does not always work as smoothly as planned, perhaps when there are language problems?
BTW, as a personal story, I can report that I helped a few years back as translator at an accident in Kitzbühel, where an American lad had hurt his hip and was in considerable pain. There a helicopter was called although the man wasn't insured and didn't really want it. There was no question of paying first. Presumably he had to find the cash later.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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All these mentions of "insurance certificate". Makes me think. I get my insurance free with my HSBC Premier bank account. I have no certificate; it mrerely rolls on from one year to the next. I can print (and have printed) the policy from the website. But certificate...???
Achilles refers to "For the trivial cost involved,". Maybe, but then all costs on a ski holiday are trivial. An extra £5 here, and extra £3 there - each day and costs blossom.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| stevomcd wrote: |
| Quote: |
For most "Service" events which can be covered by insurance (in general, not just ski insurance), most providers of the service can claim the insutred costs directly from teh insurance company, withougt having to bill the "customer" at all. Others will usually still bill you later, rather than requiring payment before they willl carry out the service.
For some reason French (and I believe it is only French) rescue operators appear unwilling to do either of these, and the fees that have to be paid up front can be very high.
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Nonsense. |
Which part of what I wrote do you think may not be quite correct?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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James the Last,
Perhaps this post will persuade you
| kamikaze wrote: |
| However, at the bottom she needed to be transferred to an ambulance to get to the medical centre. Whilst she was screaming in pain in the back of the stationary ambulance, the drivers refused to drive off without payment in cash (€140). |
Your belief system may say you don't need to fork out. Mine does not - for the peace of mind, CN's costs remain trivial, IMV.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| achilles wrote: |
| Your belief system may say you don't need to fork out. Mine does not - for the peace of mind, CN's costs remain trivial, IMV. |
You haven't read my postings have you? I am aware of these horror stories.
| James the Last wrote: |
| Essentially the CN is a rip off. But one that is probably foolish/hard to avoid. |
I think it it a complete rip off. I do not pay insurance for white goods breaking down; for NCB protection - for anything apart from where the liability covered is large (buildings insurance, motor insurance).
To pay an extra €30 to avoid the remote risk of having to pay €150... which I can reclaim anyway is very EXPENSIVE.
If, on the other hand, the French system is such that it is effectively a tax on foreign tourists, well maybe then it has to be paid. If so, rip off.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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James the Last, yes, I think that's well argued.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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James the Last, you entirely miss the point. I don't care if my washing machine breaks down for a day or 2. I have no insurance if it does, and can well afford repairs as required. I don't care about the risk of paying €150. I do very much care if the ambulance guys are insisting on cash whilst I am screaming in pain, when all I had to do was fork out a few € to have avoided the possibility. On the other hand, the thought of coping with cash demands whilst in pain, whilst at the same time feeling righteous about not being ripped off, may turn you on. It's your life.
I doubt that we'll agree, nor is there a need for us to do so. Suggest we leave it at that.
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achilles, I may be wrong, but it looks to me as though he does actually agree with you, as do I - which is why I paid for CN recently, even though I wasn't wholly convinced it was necessary.
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| James the Last wrote: |
| ....... I get my insurance free with my HSBC Premier bank account. |
I am aware of the HSBC Premier Account policy wording. Have a good look at what your insurance and see if you feel it covers you adequately for the off-piste sikiing (if any) you do.
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I've always skied in Switzerland on standard winter sports insurance. It only when I've skied in France that Carre Neige has been recommended on  's and I've paid the extra to have it. AFAIK its not needed in Switzerland.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Got to say Carre Neige isnt an issue for 99% of the people Ive skied with because theyve never heard of it. That comment will probably come back and bite me on the bum next time Im in France.
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FAQ
