 Poster: A snowHead
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Off to Tignes on 24th and after looking at the forecast  was thinking of skiing the itineraries that are marked on the piste map.
Are they classified as pistes in the insurance companies eyes ?
Would love to do some off-piste lessons but skiing with a mate who has dodgy knees and hates unpisted snow !!!!!
thx for you help
al
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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2planks, I'm not a lawyer, but I would have thought that since itineries are not groomed ie not pisted, then the insurance company would class them as "off-piste" and you would only be covered if the policy specifically included off-piste.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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But some pistes are not groomed either, whereas I believe that itineraries (when shown as such on the piste map) are subject to patrolling by the pisteurs? As usual with insurance questions the answer is probably yes, no or maybe. Check with your insurers (unless you have a policy which definitely says "off piste without a guide") but make sure you speak to someone who understands what you're telling them.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Yoda wrote: |
| As usual with insurance questions the answer is probably yes, no or maybe. |
My experience with insurers is "no", or rather they do what it says on the tin. If it doesn't say somethign then they don't cover it. They price their premiums for the risk they agree to.
If itineraries were pistes they would make them pistes. I imagine they are opened when there is assumed to be no avalanche risk, rather then pistes which will have explicity avalanche control work. That was certainly the case in Davos. In Tignes they do avalanche control on some of the more popular off pistes, but on an ad hoc basis so I imagine anything marked as an intinerary will be safe.
It would be interesting to know what the legal status is. Les 7 Laux, for example, turned its itineraries into blacks one year (not sure of the current status) because they said itineraries had no clear legal status in France.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
Check with your insurers (unless you have a policy which definitely says "off piste without a guide") but make sure you speak to someone who understands what you're telling them.
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hear hear. Despite three telephone conversations with Dogtag, and supposedly "clarifying" comment on this forum, the answer was still as clear as mud, so I insured with the Ski Club, who are explicit about their cover.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I had always presumed that I was covered on the itineraires in tignes as you are within the marker poles which is what I took to define a piste. Good job I didn't have to find out.
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| 2planks wrote: |
It explicitely states they are marked black runs, so surely that is the definition of a piste  |
yes
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Thx everyone, lets hope it pukes it down, eh !
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AFAIK, itineraries are marked but not groomed or (and this is probably the most important) not patrolled. Therefore, there is no pisteur skiing down at the end of the day to ensure nobody is left on the piste/run. As for insurance, check the small print or ask for clarification.
Me, I use Direct Travel for my insurance which covers me off piste even without a guide.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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ssnowman, I use them too... £41 quid a year for both on and off piste (10% discount for renewal)... been with them for 3 years now.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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what you must never do, in insurance terms, is ski a closed run
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| Quote: |
what you must never do, in insurance terms, is ski a closed run
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indeed. And I have wondered sometimes about piste rescue on closed runs - does Carré/Carte Neige cover rescues on closed runs?
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You know it makes sense.
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I have Snowcard which covers more extreme activities, not that I am into extreme but I don't want the small print & ambiguity when it comes to essential insurance. Then if you go down a run that is marked closed you are going against local advice & are probably not covered whatever your insurance.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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But I did it anyway, theres no insurance against stupidity. It was the only route back & I followed some instructors assuming it just hadn't been pisted, well the piste basher had been up or down it but not ploughing & had just managed to break the 6 inch crust into slabs like a plouged field. I saw instructor falling & crying, I very slowly picked my way down with lots of fear. All was OK but the what if ??
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Poster: A snowHead
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Lechbob, In the 'what if' senario... get to the side and off piste 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Scarpa wrote: |
| Lechbob, In the 'what if' senario... get to the side and off piste |
Too thick with tress, not an option. Hate the taste of wood.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Lechbob, Hehehe.. I was interpreting your post as 'what if' you had an accident and the piste was closed... you wouldn't be covered by insurance. However... you would if you were off piste in the woods 
I did the same thing in Are in Sweden. One of the world cup downhill runs was closed but looked a bit of a challenge so I ducked the ropes. It too had been driven up and down but not groomed, and each rut had frozen solid with resulting snow debris frozen solid. You could either attempt to turn between the ruts or shake your fillings loose. Not fun at all.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Scarpa,
Was with a (school) party some years ago, where some in the group had been 'slightly off piste', doing some small jumps.
one kid landed badly, broke his femur.
could hear his screams echo round the mountain as they tried to move him onto the 'piste' so they could get him recovered legitimately.
In utah, the other week, was skiing one of the double diamons in Canyons - not so much as piste as simply a 'permitted entry' point into a forest.... even if they did patrol at days end, there's no obvious route, and whilst a knockout impact with a tree may not have been fatal, a night unconscious in the resulting pile of snow without discovery probably would have been.
Not sure there's an answer there - but agree with the earlier posts on insurance covering the 'written minimum' - I'd work on the assumption an itinerary is 'off piste'.
enjoy,
h.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Wouldn't worry about it, they'll be a skied-out mess within about 10 seconds of the lifts opening following a dump anyway.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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stevomcd, you know that. I know that. The insurance companies don't.
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