 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I loved the Pilgrims when I tried a pair. They seemed to me to carve turns completely of their own volition whenever even vaguely set on edge, a weird experience for a rubbish skier like me who tends to clumsily skid all but the easiest and longest turns, and a surprise to me given their relatively large girth compared to the on-piste specific things I tend to ride, but a thoroughly exhilarating one.
I have nothing useful to offer wrt potential alternatives, sorry, just wanted to enthuse about the Piilgrims too. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I haven't tried Pilgrims but I've been using Line Prophet 100s for the last 3 weeks, mainly in powder and charging on soft fresh pistes. They are great skis in these conditions, not the fastest edge to edge, but light enough to pivot easily in tight spots. To be fair I don't think any skis in this category are going to be great on hardpack. I also have a pair of Head Monster iM82s which are pretty good off-piste and can pass as a true hardpack piste carver too. I'd say the Monsters are more versatile than my Prophets, but not as much fun on fresh piste and powder.
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| uktrailmonster wrote: |
| I haven't tried Pilgrims but I've been using Line Prophet 100s for the last 3 weeks, mainly in powder and charging on soft fresh pistes. They are great skis in these conditions, not the fastest edge to edge, but light enough to pivot easily in tight spots. To be fair I don't think any skis in this category are going to be great on hardpack. I also have a pair of Head Monster iM82s which are pretty good off-piste and can pass as a true hardpack piste carver too. I'd say the Monsters are more versatile than my Prophets, but not as much fun on fresh piste and powder. |
Hmm the 100's slightly fatter than what i was after - whats the edge grip like?
I know that with this type of ski i am unlikley to find anything that does it all perfectly - hence the ever elusive 1 ski quiver debate.
Just wondered if there were any midfat twintips out there with slightly more edge grip than the Pilgrim... If not ill be buying a pair of Pilgrims and trawling ebay for some piste only ski's
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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matricks, 4FRNT MSP, Mojo 90? Prophet 90? Armada ARV...? There are plenty 90ish wasted twin tips out there for you to try if you can.
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Thu 8-01-09 14:08; edited 1 time in total
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Just like a poster above I can't offer an alternative to the pilgrims, but I am also very pleased with mine. Did a demo on a pair a couple of months ago and although I'm not that fussed about the graphics I absolutely loved the skis after just a few runs. I have them in a 169 and am 5 ft 10 and weigh 85 kilos. Tried them in small bumps (all that was available at the time) and they seemed to work in those too, surprising for something which is 90mm under foot. I found they hold an edge really well (including going faster) and in the 169 they will happily do shorter turns too.
Not had a chance to try them off-piste, but with stats of 127-90-115 there should be no probs there.
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| arv wrote: |
| matricks, 4FRNT MSP, Mojo 90? Prophet 90? |
Glad you popped along arv,
Have you skiied any of the above? ive hammered the internet for reviews and it seems to be coming down to:
Icelantic Pilgrims
Line Prophets
4FRNT MSP
What says you - and the other oracles out there?
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I have skied the Armada ARV, in fact they are hanging on the wall behind me, I have rediscovered my love for the ski after some early season Glenshee skiing! If you are interested in them I can give you my 2c should you require. It should be noted that this years are "8% stiffer" so my review will only apply to the 07/08 model.
Having skied none of the above I can't really help you out other than the fact the MSP is a bit stiffer than the average bear (ben123 owned these so will see if he will write something for you), Dave C skis on prophet 90's (I believe) so maybe he can give you some food for thought also. The 90's have been talked about before I am sure so a search should be fruitful.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Haven't skied the pilgrims so not a direct comparison, but I've tried Mantras before and found them excellent in powder and fantastic at railing pistes. Thought they were maybe a bit stiff for me (65kg), but great if you're willing to push it.
I've also seen a few good reviews of the Nordica Enforcers, which I think are twins. Not tried them though - anyone else?
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Mantras aren't great skiing switch unless you have a death wish 
Supercharger probably too fat as per
| matricks wrote: |
Hmm the 100's slightly fatter than what i was after |
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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ChrisWo, 
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Prophet 90s are marvelous. Got them to replace K2 PEs which I found were washing out too easily (and which I had grown too fat for the length of*).
They certinly do what you ask, if buying again I'd probaly stick with the 90s over the 100s as they are incredibly nimble in bumps, marginally straighter but (amazingly) only 4sq cm less surface area according to Line. All good if you miostly ski Europe rather than US/west cost. No idea how they stack up against Pilgrims, but laterally softer in the front 25%(ish) and back 10% (ish) than Mantras due to the construction, similar feel underfoot. I'd imagine that this would give them a bit more float and a be bit better in deep than mantras, but I suck too much to give a verdict.
They have proper turny-uppy bits at both ends too.
*(220lbs, 6.1', 30ish weeks on snow, zero mad park skillz)
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You know it makes sense.
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| matricks wrote: |
Hmm the 100's slightly fatter than what i was after - whats the edge grip like?
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Edge grip is excellent on softpack, but never skied hardpack on them. If you roll them from edge to edge at speed it feels like you're on rails. But they obviously prefer long radius turns. I chose the 100s over the 90s mainly for extra float in powder. Most reviews say there isn't much in it between 90s and 100s on piste. A few reviews said the 100s are slightly softer and actually work better in bumps. I haven't skied the 90s to confirm or deny this, but the 100s are nimble enough for me. I would assume the 90s are better on hardpack, especially if they really are stiffer.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Cunners wrote: |
Prophet 90s are marvelous. Got them to replace K2 PEs which I found were washing out too easily (and which I had grown too fat for the length of*).
They certinly do what you ask, if buying again I'd probaly stick with the 90s over the 100s as they are incredibly nimble in bumps, marginally straighter but (amazingly) only 4sq cm less surface area according to Line. All good if you miostly ski Europe rather than US/west cost. No idea how they stack up against Pilgrims, but laterally softer in the front 25%(ish) and back 10% (ish) than Mantras due to the construction, similar feel underfoot. I'd imagine that this would give them a bit more float and a be bit better in deep than mantras, but I suck too much to give a verdict.
They have proper turny-uppy bits at both ends too.
*(220lbs, 6.1', 30ish weeks on snow, zero mad park skillz) |
Cool,
Thanks for the info on the prophets it seems that they have a fair degree of edge grip then..?
From what i can gather it seems that my "top 3" (Pilgrims, Prophets and MSP) are all pretty much near as damn it the same...? so am trying to get as much info on them as poss IOT make a decision - anyone know if the Prophets or MSPs can be demo'd in the UK?
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Poster: A snowHead
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matricks, Ellis Brigham stock 4FRNT and LINE. If youa re going down that route also try Dynastar Big Trouble (similar dims).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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You can demo Prophet 90s and MSPs at MK Snowdome, but you won't get them up to speed there. Not sure what you'll learn other than a feel for their weight/stiffness.
It's worth noting that the Pilgrims are designed to ski in much shorter lengths than the others, so probably not the same.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| uktrailmonster wrote: |
You can demo Prophet 90s and MSPs at MK Snowdome, but you won't get them up to speed there. Not sure what you'll learn other than a feel for their weight/stiffness.
It's worth noting that the Pilgrims are designed to ski in much shorter lengths than the others, so probably not the same. |
Rgr,
Was worth a thought as i cant really get my hands/ feet on them anywhere else in the interim - guess ill stick to the old faithful (thoughts of the snowheads masses)
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| arv wrote: |
| matricks, Ellis Brigham stock 4FRNT and LINE. If youa re going down that route also try Dynastar Big Trouble (similar dims). |
Bug*** - there is another one to add as a potential.. Dammit.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The thing that swung me towards the Prophets was the metal layers - I like fairly damp skis. The MSPs and dynnastars are, as far as I know, wood sandwich without the metal - I think the more freestyle skis tend not to be metal laminate as the metal makes them more likely to bend or delam when you case the halfpipe.
Being a coward, I am not affected by this issue.
I got the 90s as uktrailmonster says, they are optimised towards hard snow, whereas the 100s are the same idea opitmised for soft. Mogul performance is good, as the extra torsional stiffness is offset by having an extra inch of tip room across the pair.
Ps: try the Line blends too - a bit more like the MSP.
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matricks, Ski Tecnic is like my business in that we are both Icelantic & High Society retailers &, although we're both not 'involved' with WDF, we will both be WDF retailers when they are launched  .
The Icelantic Pilgrim was designed with carving performance high up the list of requirements so it's very torsionally stiff for it's width so you'll be hard pushed to find a better 90mm carver on the market. The Pilgrim also comes with a factory set 3 degree side edge to maximise edge grip. I've seen a guy carve a complete 360 on a pair of the new 179's which was very impressive.
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I should just like to add another vote for the good service and friendliness of the chap at Ski Tecnic in VT - he helped us out too and we were very pleased with the service.
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movement gladiator, proper twin, stiffish, 92mm wide, best all-mountain i've ever had, can carve much better than they look once you're up and charging
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| ChrisWo wrote: |
Haven't skied the pilgrims so not a direct comparison, but I've tried Mantras before and found them excellent in powder and fantastic at railing pistes. Thought they were maybe a bit stiff for me (65kg), but great if you're willing to push it.
I've also seen a few good reviews of the Nordica Enforcers, which I think are twins. Not tried them though - anyone else? |
Well as you ask... I demo'd a few fattish skis the other week including the Enforcers. Loved them that much I bought a pair.
Review here...
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=46761&highlight=nordica+enforcer
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| I should just like to add another vote for the good service and friendliness of the chap at Ski Tecnic in VT - he helped us out too and we were very pleased with the service. |
Too True!
He is a top bloke and if i go back to VT ill be certainly heading there again - id also go as far as to recommend the Hotel Mecure for anyone travelling there with wee ones - the ESF ski school is adjacent to the hotel!! and Ski Tecnic is downstairs in the Hotel - a winner all round!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Zags
swear by them, try the bigs
very light, good sidecut makes them racy on piste, though more bottle required than on a heavy GS ski
divine off piste, though if in heavier stuff they can control you as they're soft on flex
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| barry wrote: |
| movement gladiator, proper twin, stiffish, 92mm wide, best all-mountain i've ever had, can carve much better than they look once you're up and charging |
You see - i thought these would pop up.
Before i got hooked on mid fat twin tips i was chasing the Yaka Jam for a while and had seen, read about and really liked the Gladiators but at the time was biased agaisnt them cause of thier width and twin tips. But now.....
This is actually making my list longer instead of shorter.... arrgh 
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You know it makes sense.
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Oh, this years Enforcers are not twin tip, but both models are available.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Glads and Dukes
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Poster: A snowHead
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pilgrim, pilgrim pilgrim!! Skiied most of the others in your list and yeah theyre good skis (loved the Big Troubles but IMO the Pilgrim rides hard snow better) I was really blown away by Icelantic's looks and construction, though my choice for a 1 quiver ski would be the Nomad at 105mm under foot, carves hard snow almost as well as the Pilgrim and way more fun should you score any powpow!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Oh and Ski Technic are a retailer for WDF though I believe Timo (one of the team, he rips!) is the owners nephew, maybe thats what he was on about??
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| JT wrote: |
| Glads and Dukes |
You skiing on the Dukes at the moment?
Ref my post above
| matricks wrote: |
| I did have Markers in mind but have concerns about the additional height the boot will be above the ski and given that i wont be doing huge ammounts of touring its probably not worth the outlay....? |
Your thoughts please sir....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| matricks wrote: |
| .....Cheers spyderjon.......As you are in the "trade" so to speak and having checked your website - can you reccommend any particular bindings? the ones fitted when i had them were the Vist demo bindings. I did have Markers in mind but have concerns about the additional height the boot will be above the ski and given that i wont be doing huge ammounts of touring its probably not worth the outlay....? |
I'd recomend any higher quality binding (by that I mean metal construction) that's torsionally stiff to transfer energy input directly to the ski. I flog Vist's as all their bindings share the same metal chassis but every other manufacturer has metal chassis bindings in their range. I'm often surpised by the time taken in ski selection, epecially for edge hold qualities, & then to see a low end plasticy easily twisted binding attached.
Next batch of Pilgrim's available last week of January.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| matricks wrote: |
| .....Cheers spyderjon.......As you are in the "trade" so to speak and having checked your website - can you reccommend any particular bindings? the ones fitted when i had them were the Vist demo bindings. I did have Markers in mind but have concerns about the additional height the boot will be above the ski and given that i wont be doing huge ammounts of touring its probably not worth the outlay....? |
I'd recomend any higher quality binding (by that I mean metal construction) that's torsionally stiff to transfer energy input directly to the ski. I flog Vist's as all their bindings share the same metal chassis but every other manufacturer has metal chassis bindings in their range. I'm often surpised by the time taken in ski selection, epecially for edge hold qualities, & then to see a low end plasticy easily twisted binding attached.
Next batch of Pilgrim's available last week of January. |
Rgr that. Though its the SIA show in 2 weeks and am avidly awaiting to see what Icelantic will be showing for the 09/10 season.
Hopefully ill get some feedback re the markers, failing that it'll be some.......
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matricks,
Dukes........
Very solid binding which is what you would expect given the weight.. I know they stack high-ish but I don't notice it at all as I am so connected to the solid plate. It isn't like my rides on FR+'s which I didn't like for that reason....
By comparison, you are tottering on those...IMV, but other guys I have skied with have no problem with them...so it may have just been a iffy 1st impression of the FR's on my part
Nonetheless, I really like the solid feel of the Dukes and will go uphill on them... just not so far. I didn't want an out and out touring set-up, so I went for a bomber alpine with uphill capability which is what the Dukes are, IMO
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I think everyone who has taken the time to endorse Icelantic Pilgrims on this thread should get a free pair.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Likewise matricks, a real good quality brand! Personally I've been on VIST bindings for 3 seasons now and have not had a single problem with them, theyre pretty solid and light for a metal binding.
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FAQ
to stay with the piste demons that i ski with
Cheers 
