 Poster: A snowHead
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Last year I asked for info of a school ski trip organiser - The Sports Academy - but no-one had heard of them. I have now, they organised a really excellent trip for my son's school - it was brilliant. The school knew what they were doing as well, so together they put on a good value trip that seems to have worked well at every level.
Previously the school have been to Europe, this year they went to Northstar at Tahoe in order to get more hours skiing each day, Europe tends to be 4 hrs, Northstar gave up to 6 hours a day. Day 1 was spent in San Francisco with an overnight stay at the Radisson on Fishermans Wharf, what a bonus to get such a well located hotel. They had a tour of the city, some free time and a visit to Alcatraz. After this on to Northstar where they stayed in the new village and were given the run of the village every evening.
The holiday was £1230, about £500 more than Europe by coach. This was priced last year which obviously gave a bonus to the holiday company, but the kids benefitted as well with a $13 lunch voucher every day, thrown in as an extra, plus the Fishermans Wharf location. It is a lot of money, but there's so much supervision to pay for, one member of staff for every 8, plus an instructor for every 8, so 64 kids took quite a bit of staffing.
The travel worked well, before he went my son was disappointed that they were the last San Francisco flight out of terminal 1, not the first from T5, another bonus though, imagine going one day later and getting there hours late and 64 kids all without luggage  Coming back the next week they got through T5 ahead of schedule with every bag accounted for.
The only downside was the skiing. Snow conditions were very poor, slush from early morning and very little challenge, the black diamonds would be red or even blue in Europe. The fun park was great. The trip was good for beginners, they have brought back 40+ new skiers determined to go again and there's another 100 or so hoping for a place on next years trip to Davos.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I was in the security queue at SFO with what looked like 2 coach loads of kids who judging from the panda eyes had obviously been to Tahoe. Never have I been so glad to see them brandishing BA boarding passes while I had the comforting red of Virgin in my paw 
Sounds like a great trip though - slight more than you'd pay per head as a family but not much.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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fatbob, if it's anything like my kids' ski trips (to Eurpoe, so far), the cost will have included all grub, lessons, kit hire and lift pass, so it may not have been more expensive than a family trip.
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| Jane L wrote: |
The only downside was the skiing. Snow conditions were very poor, slush from early morning and very little challenge, the black diamonds would be red or even blue in Europe. The fun park was great. The trip was good for beginners, they have brought back 40+ new skiers determined to go again and there's another 100 or so hoping for a place on next years trip to Davos. |
In think, in so far as comparisons between resorts (never mind continents) can be valid, single black diamonds in North America are roughly equivalent to European reds.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Jane L wrote: |
| went to Northstar at Tahoe in order to get more hours skiing each day, Europe tends to be 4 hrs, Northstar gave up to 6 hours a day. |
I don't understand this - is it something particular to school trips? I normally expect about 7 hours skiing per day in Europe - (or even 8 hours if I only take a snack lunch - but these days I want the rest.)
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snowball, maybe she means tuition hours?
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snowball, many schools now are not allowed to let the kids freeski, therefore they have a certain number of instruction hours per day. Also, bear in mind that you are a fully grown adult, who is (presumably) reasonably fit. Many 11-12 yr olds do not have the physical capacity to ski more than 4 or 5 hours per day - especially the beginners who are working really hard to pick themselves up, or snowplough.
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My daughter has had 6 hours/day lessons, every day, on her school ski trips, as none of the accompanying staff are able to look after the kids on (or off) the piste. My son has had half day lessons, as several of the accompnying staff have some sort of 'ski leader' qualification (not the same as instructor, although staff member was also an instructor) and can take the kids skiing. The difference has not been down to the resort, merely the cicumstances; I assume that resorts will give you lessons 24/24 if you pay them.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Jane L, Get them to head a bit more into the Rockies next time... Good you had a good trip. My Brother is a Tahoe addict.
alex_heney, Not sure that is valid at all. I believe Resort by Resort variation is more significant than Continent to Continent variation, espescially with the imperative for most resorts to claim to have arange of run gradings whatever the topography actually dictates.
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snowball, the school doesn't have enough alpine leaders to let many free ski, so they are limited to lesson time, which tends to be 4 hrs in Europe in their experience, I gather they have discussed it with the tour provider who then offered Tahoe as a solution. My kids have skied from lift open to lift close since they started at 4 and 6, nowadays they also prefer to take lunch and eat it in a gondola so we only stop for a quick drink. I'm having to work hard on my fitness and speed, it's a really long day to keep up with them now.
It was a fabulous trip, really we couldn't miss such an opportunity. My son missed a trick though, he was given an upgrade to business class on the way out, why they picked a 13yr old I don't know, and he's always wanted to travel business class on a 747, but he exchanged it with a teacher as it was just too far for him to want to travel alone with all his mates behind in economy class.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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It may well be that Northstar was chosen (deliberately) for, amongst other reasons ,the relatively unthreatening terrain and the onsite village, both of which may be very useful with a crowd of kids of varying ages and varying abilities. There is however little doubt that it is one of the "easier" Tahoe resorts. As in all US resorts the grading of runs is in relation to the other runs in that resort ie the blacks are the most difficult runs within the resort boundary, which doesnt mean that they are of the same level of difficulty anywhere else.......some call Northstar Flatstar which rather gives away the level of difficulty there. There would be significantly more difficult terrain at say Squaw Valley but then taking the whole school party there was probably not on
On conditions, well that is a lottery. I have had fairly significant amounts of new snow at Lake Tahoe in April, other times it was sun all the way.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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malcolm1, yes, it was chosen so that the kids could be left unsupervised during non-skiing hours, and as all but a few were beginner / low intermediate it was an excellent choice of resort for skiing. A great plus was the new hotel right next to the lift station.
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| Quote: |
the school doesn't have enough alpine leaders to let many free ski, so they are limited to lesson time, which tends to be 4 hrs in Europe in their experience
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I must be missing something obvious here.
If the kids are not allowed "un-supervised skiing" beyond the 4 (or 6) hrs, what do they do the rest of the day??? 
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You know it makes sense.
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Other stuff, evening activities, shopping, generally mooching around the village, drinking (on European based trips obviously)... Not all kids can cope with the snowHeads mantra of first lift to last (with a hearty meal somewhere in between).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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On the other hand, I'm not sure I can cope with the snowheads mantra of staying out drinking till 4 am (and then skiing the next day AT ALL) either!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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abc, standard day (Feb 1/2 term in Europe) would be
7.00 breakfast
8.00 depart accommodation
8.15 arrive lifts
8.45 finish faffing with equipment, and join lift queue
9.30 get to top of mountain for lessons
11.30 finish morning 2 hours lesson and beat the lunch rush
12.30 start afternoon lessons
2.30 finish lessons at top of hill
2.45 last ski group arrives back late
3.00 complete head count and start downloading off the mountain
4.00 arrive back at accomodation, shower, relax
6.00 dinner
7.30 depart for evening ents
9.30 arrive home and bed
It's amazing how long everything takes when you have 50 people. Kids forget gloves, pick up the wrong skis, don't eat breakfast then feel sick, forget their lift pass etc. Most accommodation isn't ski in ski out, so there is a journey. If you go in school hols then there is usually a lift queue. If you have a lot of beginners then they get tired, so 4 hours is often enough. Every time you meet, then there has to be a head count. This in itself can take a while, especially if the kids are moving around or the teacher miscounts, or one has run off to the toilet without telling anyone.
One of the things that always makes me laugh on snowHeads is when teachers are asking for recommendations for ski trips - so many of the well meaning answers have obviously never been on a school ski trip! Every one that I have done has been different....it all depends on the school, age of kids, ability of kids etc but there are some things that are the same for them all. The fact remains, that you will never get as much skiing in as you would on a trip on your own.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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stewart woodward, sorry! How could I forget that 
Doesn't fit into a nice timeframe though!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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On my school trips the evenings were rarely over by midnight... 
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skisimon, depends on the age of the kids. I've had a group of 10 yr olds where they were in bed by 8.30 several nights. On the other hand if it is a 6th form group then bedtimes would be later. Usually schools seem to go for the "in your rooms by......." and then it;s up to the kids when they actually go to bed.
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| Quote: |
Usually schools seem to go for the "in your rooms by......." and then it;s up to the kids when they actually go to bed.
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That's very much my point. The more skiing the kids do, the more exhausted they're, the less energy they have left to get into trouble in the evening...
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abc, I don't follow how there will be trouble? If kids choose to sit quietly in their rooms rather than go to bed, then that's their choice.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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"kids sitting quietly"? Some nice kids you've got!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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abc, not mine....just the ones I work with. As I said earlier, for many of them, 4 hours skiing plus evening ents is enough to tire them out fully. Remember, you want them tired, but still to have enough energy to ski the next day.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| snowball wrote: |
| ..........or even 8 hours if I only take a snack lunch - but these days I want the rest... |
Hah! So age is catching up even with the great. 
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FAQ
Practice makes perfect. 
- it still is actually).