 Poster: A snowHead
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I have spent some time looking at previous threads about ski instructor qualifications as I’m considering doing a course. Those of you who have done instructor courses to varying levels, what was your main reason for doing it:
Intention to instruct in UK or abroad?
To improve CV?
Improve skiing ability?
Generally widen your horizons (not necessarily for work)?
I would like to work as an instructor if I qualified but not sure if it would be for me long term. On the other hand I am keen for a career change and this seems an appealing route to take for now while I consider the future.
The 10 week courses look great to me as it is appealing to be able to qualify in this time rather than doing L1 and L2 separately and having to do shadowing in UK.
For those who have done 10 week course how easy is it to get employment post qualification? Some companies seem to have links with ski schools for new recruits but presume this would be deferred to following season after qualifying.
Has anyone done BASI 2 and then gone onto work in New Zealand during the summer? Would NZSIA be sufficient to teach in Canada? If I go for the career change option it would seem like a good idea to use the qualification straight away!
Sorry, lots of questions there. Any advice gratefully received.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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chrispo, I know some people who did an autumn gap course with Snoworks, passed their L2 in December and then found teaching jobs in Verbier from January.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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To give oneself a massive sense of self importance and a license to grope and harass all females in a ski resort without fear of being slapped 
Well worth doing it gives you a new focus on your own skiing and helps you to concentrate on all you weak points before you are done
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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rob@rar, That sounds good. Have you just passed your L2? Are you planning to instruct or already instructing?
Ordhan, Good points!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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chrispo, I passed L2 a couple of weeks ago. I'm not planning on instructing full-time although I plan to do sufficient hours to move towards ISIA in the next few seasons.
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rob@rar, any idea how much money is required to fund the gap course? - I mean living expenses, not the course cost. I guess it depends where you do it. The summer course in Argentina (run by Peakleaders) appeals as the cost of living seems cheap out there - less than £1 a pint apparently!
My problem is that I can't take a career break from my job so i'm tempted by a career change! Just a bit aprehensive about job prospects post qualification.
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chrispo, no idea I'm afraid. If time and money are issues why do a gap course? Cheaper to just do the BASI courses and do your shadowing at your local artificial slope.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| I passed L2 a couple of weeks ago. |
Congratulations 
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I'm doing L1 in May at the Snowdome. We run a business from home and I can't take 10 weeks out to do the Gap course, plus they'd all be youngsters and I'm 50 this year. I MAY do L2 eventually. I have no intention to teach in the mountains, but really enjoy teaching and would like to be able to teach a specific sport, and skiing seems to be something I'm quite good at. I would like to teach part time at the Snowdome, even just to cover absences. I really get a kick out of teaching people and seeing them start and improve. I also think if I could do L2 it would help to focus on developing my own technique.
The only worry is that on a L2 course my breathing problems at altitude (not amenble to treatment or improveable by training) would annoy the others on the course, as I do tend to have to take more breaks than others i.e. stop more on a particular run. This is improving, but I'd need to be prepared to drop out of the course for the good of others on it, if I was holding them back. I'd need a very sympathetic trainer.
So, Level 1 for now, think about Level 2 to improve my teaching ability and own ski skills, and hopefully do a bit of part time teaching. That's all.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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chrispo,
I did a Gap course.
To answer your questions:
My reasons included all of the above.
Everyone who wanted to get work following the course did so with no problems. Although if you want to work in NZ I'd reccomend getting some experience under your belt in Europe / the US first. Had a friend who struggled to get work in NZ in their first season, but those who did a season in N Hemishpere first had no problems. The alternative of course is to do the Gap course in NZ then get work in Europe / US, I know people who've done that with no problems.
Re money - the course I did was full board so only additional costs were drinks and to upgrade the food from time to time! It was the BASI course in Pila.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Cheers all.
Will be giving it some serious thought in coming weeks. May well go for the L1 at Snowdome option first. Those courses seem to get booked up pretty quick, any feedback on L1 at Tamworth anyone? docsquid, best of luck with that in May.
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chrispo, thank you! I'll probably need it, but am looking forward to it enormously. Will post feedback as soon as I've done the course.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| chrispo wrote: |
| My problem is that I can't take a career break from my job so i'm tempted by a career change! Just a bit aprehensive about job prospects post qualification. |
Of all the reasons to take up ski instruction, making money isn't one of them. I personally don't know anyone with a BASI Alpine Level 2 that even breaks even over a season, let alone makes money. I'm sure they exist, but there are many more losers than winners in this respect.
A friend spent a season on Grouse Mountain - just outside of Vancouver - teaching for a season after he got his BASI 3 (as the a BASI Alpine Level 2 was then). He went to Grouse because the pay rates were significantly higher than Whistler. He's in his late 40s and a superb teacher - so he got two "promotions" and very good tips. He reckons that the season ended up costing him around £500 after he was realistic about his costs.
So, of all the (very good) reasons to do a ski instructors course, the money isn't one of them at this level. There are certainly people who earn good money being a ski instructor - but for most of us it'll never really be viable.
A friend did the Peak Leaders course and thoroughly enjoyed it. You'll find his blog on www.megeveski.com
The friends who have done gap courses reckon that it's cost around £2000 to £4000 over the gap course costs. Normally the upper end of this because the course has usually resulted in them buying new boots, skis and clothing 
I did my BASI 3 last season with BASS in Morzine (a sort of "mature person's gap course). It was fabulous and my skiing improved hugely.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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chrispo, I did Nonstop in Banff 11 week course! Any questions give me a PM. Came away with CSIA Level 2 and CSCF level 1. Opportunities for work worldwide. Exc France.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I can tell you the pros and cons I saw when I was asked to become an instructor a few years ago....
Pros:
Lots of time on snow
Lots of training
Cons:
Snowplow backwards more than ski
Rotten pay (costs money rather than pays)
Get yelled at a lot by stupidvisors at line-up
Being female you get to ski with kids a lot
Cannot select trainer- and I'm already skiing with the best trainers!!!!!
In the end it worked out I'd improve my skiing more and get to ski more by working and just taking time off and paying for the lessons! I'd also be able to keep the house 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I know/met people who make a living with BASI Level2/Grade 3 in Austria, Switzerland, Italy, US, but it's certainly not a good one.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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slikedges, at home the ski schools pay on a system that includes such things as number of seasons with the resort, and number of overseas seasons worked.... Simply having a cert won't do it at most schools - I know of ISIA level folks who have not passed the hiring clinic(which that resort obliged all to do) - ie they did not get employed after traveling down under thinking to work....
The top guys can earn $30/hour or just over.... but that is for 1 level over ISIA and many seasons worked in THAT resort and many more overseas... They get paid only for hours taught - nothing for appearing at line-up 3 times a day and not getting work. If you add up traveling expenses to the mountain (too dear to stay on mountain now - and no free accom) and count each "non-work" day in eary and late season then the REAL hourly rate is terrible... much less than the $12-15 they supposedly pay...
My instructor has managed 8-10 hour days(doing non-instruction stuff and race training etc etc)... but in general the hours of teaching is SIX.... 3 times 2 hour lesson slots... if you score an 830am 1 hour private you can work SEVEN hours....
I'll stick to my day job and ski in between... I still won't be rich... but I think it is more fun!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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chrispo, whilst I haven't personally done an instructor course, over the last three years I have got to know a number of people who have done the Warren Smith GAP course in Verbier. There is a lot of focus on personal skiing development, ski technique, biomechanics and physiology, as well as the theoretical BASI elements of the course, and the improvement in the skiing level over the nine weeks of the people I've met is remarkable.
What is also interesting is how their lives seem to have changed. A number of people have quit what they were doing and moved out to Switzerland and several are now working for ski schools in Verbier or elsewhere. It was quite a nice moment this season when I was having a drink in the bar with a couple of Warren's coaches and a few of the GAP students came in to show off their new Swiss Ski School uniforms to the guys - there was an obvious sense of achievement and pride on both sides. As a result of Warren's links with Swiss Snowsports there was work available for everyone with the ESS after they had passed the course, and I understand the going rate of pay is 28CHF/hr, which is about £14.
They had a 100% pass rate on the course this year, and if you want to read first hand about the experiences of the GAP students then have a look at http://www.warrensmith-skiacademy.com/gap/gap-program_08.htm
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BGA,
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What is also interesting is how their lives seem to have changed. A number of people have quit what they were doing and moved out to Switzerland and several are now working for ski schools in Verbier or elsewhere. It was quite a nice moment this season when I was having a drink in the bar with a couple of Warren's coaches and a few of the GAP students came in to show off their new Swiss Ski School uniforms to the guys - there was an obvious sense of achievement and pride on both sides. As a result of Warren's links with Swiss Snowsports there was work available for everyone with the ESS after they had passed the course, and I understand the going rate of pay is 28CHF/hr, which is about £14
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well said... 28chf is a good rate for a new L2, well done to WSA for forging the link with SSS. Good to have hope that one can actually get work straight away in a mountain environment.
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skimottaret,
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Good to have hope that one can actually get work straight away in a mountain environment.
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Personally I don't know anyone who's not managed to.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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beanie1, guess i meant to say full time, not just peak periods or interski type stuff. from what i hear getting a full season worht of work in a big resort is doable but pretty tough to accomplish....
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| beanie1, guess i meant to say full time, not just peak periods or interski type stuff. from what i hear getting a full season worht of work in a big resort is doable but pretty tough to accomplish.... |
From people I've talked to, the opposite appears to be true, unless a sponsored visa is required - and even then it's not too much of a stretch...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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DaveC, sorry should have qualified that further as I was implying within Europe as per BGA's post. plenty of work in canada or Oz
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skimottaret, Ummm.... I would query that.... I remember at least 1 week that my instructor had the most work for the week (thanks to my privates) and he was one of the top of the list and contracted(guaranteed certain number of hours pay per week).... I've never seen new hires work 6 hours a day for a week in June....(Staatliche imported on contract don't count as new hires)
Things may have changed with recent management changes but it would be surprising giving the pay structures if a new hire could work 42hours/week for June-October as a ski instructor (bar staff is another issue )
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little tiger, my statement of "plenty of work " is subjective. I dont think any first season teacher will be busy all day every day wherever they are... But i think you stand a chance of actually some hours outiside teh really busy periods if you go to NA or the southern hemisphere. It is tough in EU to get enough work to "pay the rent" over a whole season from what i hear...
Interesting to here that in Oz they will guarantee hours. what level of experience/training would that typically kick in? or is it like evything "depending on who you know"
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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BGA, 
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FAQ
