Newbie needs advice on new skis

A snowHead

Hey peeps,

I've ordered up some nice cheapy Blizzard skis off the internet, i'm planning on getting in 3 trips this/next year and instead of paying for hire skis thought i'd save myself a couple of quid by, buying some. My question is, when i get my new skis, do i need to do anything with them? i.e. do they need waxing or any special treatment before use? they are coming with some bindings already fitted, so is it simply a case of me setting the DIN on the bindings and adjusting them to fit the boot or does this need to be done by an expert or the binding need calibrating or something?

Please excuse the dumb questions but i just wanna be sure what i'm doing and ask a few silly questions rather than looking a complete fool later when i do something horribly wrong.

Cheers

Mac

A snowHead

You'll need to get the bindings set by a technician. Settings depends on a number of factors: weight, length of ski, binding itself etc.

Do not try doing it yourself.

They may not need waxing depending on how they come but a technician is going to charge you to look at and set the binding so get their opinion.

Generally just need to get them serviced after each trip after that, unless you go over a rock and heavily score the base, which should be sorted immediately (otherwise snow/water can freeze overnight and start to de-laminate ski).

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Nick, when you say 'get the bindings set', do you mean setting the DIN level (i usually have it set to 5) based on my weight and ability(or lack of it Smile

), or is it some kind of initial calibration of the binding that must be carried out by a professional?

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Snow and Rock do a free binding check. Go iin play dumb and they'll tell you if they need a service (about £25).
Like nick says DO NOT ADJUST THE BINDINGS YOURSELF.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I just spoke to the shop i'm getting them from, apparently they'll do it all for me free of charge, so i don't have to worry about it. But this does bring up another question, when i usually hire skis they generally just ask do i know my DIN setting, i usually say yeah, i'm a 5 'cause that's what i had when i learn't to ski on my local dry slope, and used the same ever since. I guess i've just been lucky that i've not injured myself as a result?

Anyways, thanks for the advice, appreciated.

Mac

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In theory as you progress in ability, your DIN setting will increase to a certain point. So, yes get them checked as you may need it increased to some degree. which is determined from you weight height ability, boot length and level of aggression (in skiing terms).

Also, if the place you are getting them from is "fitting" your bindings without your boot to do so, you DEFINITELY want to ahve them checked. Most shops won't mount bindings with out the boot these days, due to potential risk of liability.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

As a matter of interest why shouldn't one adjust ones own bindings?

After all it is free

T Bar, you can but you need to have the binding charts to do so and they are not published so you need a friendly ski tech to pass you a set for your make of bindings (not easy) the manufacturers would prefer you not to play with the settings for reasons of liability

D G Orf,
Fair enough I have only adjusted my own once, on hire skis in USA when I kept on prereleasing, borrowed a screwdriver and wound em up to my usual setting. Just wondering if I had commited a cardinal sin.
Puzzled

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T Bar, not really I've done it myself it's just that the shops have all the charts and usually check that the binding releases are working properly, most places in resorts won't charge you for checking the setting but even if they do it's unlikely to be more than the price of a beer, but go in when they're not busy

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

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Jonpim, if you make alterations to your car and then have an accident causing injury to yourself and/or others will Haynes accept liability for same? Will your insurers happily pay out those large claims?

The actual physical procedure of adjustment may be essentially simple (although not always by any means), but the selection of an appropriate release setting is not simple at all. As DG Orf says, shops are unlikely to charge much, if at all, for doing it so where's the cartel?

your old matey AC, PhD
Salomon Rental Technician

When I go into a ski shop for setting my bindings if I recall correctly they asl how heavy are you and how do you ski? As the latter is highly subjective I don't really see how you can get a very accurate binding setting.

Even this sometimes overdoes the accuracy I have several times just been asked how tight I would like them Confused

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

T Bar, it all depends on the standard of the ski technician, a good one will set the bindings perfectly for you, a bad one will have the bindings coming off or staying on when you don't want them to Shocked

A snowHead

maggi, over the past couple of years there has been a considerable expansion of the "skier type" descriptors used to asess binding setting. Of course the technician is unlikely to have seen you ski and must rely to an extent on your honesty, but an experienced eye can tell a lot from body language and visual clues as well. Also, an advanced or expert skier should, imo, have taken enough interest in these matters to know what their release setting should be, and hence question the technician if they disagree with him/her.

A snowHead

The reason to have your bindings set by a shop is so that your insurance company will have someone to sue. Make sure you have them tested and get a copy of the report.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

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The_Mac_Daddy, usually the dry slope uses the simplified table

The resorts should use the one that takes weight, boot length, skiing standard/experience, muscle power into consideration which allow a variation in DIN settings, as an example my settings could vary from arround 7.5 for general easy going skiing up to about 11 if I wanted to do serious racing

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

fair enough, i think the table was only based on sex, weight and height.

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Alan Craggs, OK, I have had my own skis for the past 3 years so techs might have got better.

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I always feel a bit tired of this: "do not do it" followed by the business about people getting sued. A year ago I went to a very prominent shop in Banff that fits boots with a lot of fuss, in the process of following their advice (=intense pressure, hours of waiting, "experts" refusing to listen properly to what I was saying) I lost a toe nail, had an expensive holiday ruined by intense pain, got a great pair of boots, the ones I was originally going to buy, but the "canting" adjustment was damaged by the "boot expert" (I saw him trying to force the allen bolt connector round with all his might, even though it was obvious it did not want to go). I just paid and got out in time to fly back home. Never again.

Then I bought my wife some skis (Volkl four stars) and half of one binding was not properly on the Volkl rail at all. We noticed a day later and kicked up a fuss and they re-did it for us - but what if I had not noticed? In both cases, given the little leaflet of information that you see the "experts" looking at, I have no doubt that I would have done a better job. Both were well-known shops with good reputations.

In years passed I always serviced and did repairs on my motorbikes when I realized the stupid mistakes made by professional mechanics who were thinking about the weekend - no one is as careful as the person who is going to ride on the thing. The only thing that holds me back is proper advice. If any one is going to sue anybody, we should sue the manufacturer for not making the appropriate information freely available.

After all it is free

Nogs, Obviously not a place to visit ! I've never had a problem in Switzerland but I guess it's down to the individual that checks the skis and boots and bindings, maybe I've just been lucky Confused

Sorry for the rant - it's off my chest now, so I'll forget it.
I can't wait to get out on the snow!

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And welcome to snowHeads Nogs

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

I had my bindings set in Champagny at the ski shop , as I'd bought the skis in Barcelona, without the boots, and they didn't have any Rossignol boots to set them with. When I later bought new boots, and got them adjusted again, the technician thought that the DIN was too high. So who was right I don't know.

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Thanks, Pete, for the welcome. Nice to be here.

maggi, just so Sad

and another welcome to Nogs snowHead

I don't like all this talk of litigation myself but if it came down to it how would the claimant prove that the shop had set them "incorrectly"? Unless you photograph the settings with the technican's hands on them at the time that would be tricky.

As far as I know the release setting recommendation (not DIN any longer as I drone on endlessly, but many insist on still calling it that) does vary between makes. Probably not by much though I don't have the actual info for anythiong other than Salomon.

Servicing your own vehicles is admirable (I've done plenty of that in the past myself) but don't go bleating to the manufacturer for a warranty claim if that's what you've done and something goes wrong. The release setting information is not "secret" - just ask to see the charts. If they say no then buy your kit somewhere else. I'm a bit worried that the Mac Daddy's local slope asks the customers to request their own setting though Puzzled

You know it makes sense.

Alan Craggs, when we borrowed skis from Ellis Brigham the other week at Castleford, all they did was ask me my setting.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Helen Beaumont, clearly they spotted you as an expert skier Cool

But slightly more seriously, let's hope that they were experienced enough to know that the setting you gave them was probably about right.

A snowHead

Lots of interesting comment here, but I would like to hear from someone with real knowledge (if one of you who has already posted is a trained technician or binding developer, I apologise). Just what is this Release Setting (OK Alan?) based on? You can measure weight. You can measure height. But ski=ing ability? Ski=ing style? I reckon they judge you by the equipment, and the Release Setting is just glorified guesswork.

A snowHead

Jonpim, The basic DIN setting as used in the dry ski slopes (when they remember) is based on the length of the boot sole plus the weight and height of the skier, the length of the boot sole and height of the skier form a lever that is acted on by the skiers weight.

Now the manufacturers have worked out a table which is then used to pick the DIN setting, for instance given my weight and height plus foot size my DIN setting straight off the table of 6.25 however this is suitable only for cautious skiers willing to go for frequent releases or beginners, so we go up one catagory which gives me a setting of 7.5 suited to Average/moderate skiing at average release/retention settings. Skiers who designate themselves "II" must accept a balanced compromise between release and retention. If I was more aggresive I would go down yet another step to being a type 3 skier with a DIN of 9, finally if I were racing it could go as high as 10.75. Now when I go over 50 years old my bindings should go down 1 catagory as older limbs are weaker than those of younger years.

So in answer to the question, beginners are type 1 or those who stick to blue runs, Intermediates are type 2 or those who happily ski red runs at normal speeds, type 3 are those who are good and like to travel at speeds where a ski flying off could be more dangerous than one staying on, ski shops know who beginners are (it's obvious) and treat everyone else as a type 2 skier unless asked not to by the skier

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Hi there, me again. Well i've got my ski's in the post today, they've fitted and set the bindings as promissed, the release settings were about what i expected. I just need to know now if i need to wax these skis before i use them? They are brand new, and when you feel the bottoms of them it feels like there's lots of small grooves (like a record) going from tip to tail. i'm guessing these should be filled in with the wax? Any recommendations on the type of wax i should use? Thanks again peeps Wink

AL

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The_Mac_Daddy, thinking of getting some Blizzards myself - which ones did you go for? No idea on wax - I would have thought a ski tech would do that in resort for you?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

i went for the cheapy cheap ones, Firebird XO3 With Rossignol Bindings £129 from ski warehouse. Thing is i shant know what they're like until i go away on boxing day (assuming it starts to snow in 3 valleys by then) but i'm guessing they gotta be better than the rubbish i usually get from the hire shops.

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

Mac daddy, worth having them waxed before use. New skis leave the factory with a coating of wax but that will dry out over time. So if you've no idea how long your skis have been in store then it's worth getting them waxed and the edges checked and set. Have it done it the resort, it's much cheaper and the chances are the tech will use the correct wax for the conditions.

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It's even worth waxing skis several times before you first use them. And regular waxing thereafter helps to build up a good, strong base.

New skis are often a bit slow to start with because of all the coarse hairs on the new base that slow the ski in certain conditions. Use a wax for extreme cold conditions a couple of times to remove them - this wax becomes very hard when dry, and pulls the hairs off when you scrape the bases.

Help!!

Newbie needs advice on new skis

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