 Poster: A snowHead
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After last years controversy over plagiarism by the SCGB of a Pistehors article (and that was not the first time they've done this) you might have thought they'd learnt their lesson, I'm afraid not!
A recent news piece on Scotland posted on their site on the 16th of January has used various photos from Winterhighland and Highland Instinct without any permission or credit given whatsoever - they've even been rude enough not to provide links to either of these excellent Scottish based sites, instead linking to other sites.
This plagiarism has been noticed by the owner of Highland Instinct, comments posted here on Winterhighland, and I believe complaints will be made tomorrow but does anyone think the SCGB will ever learn their lesson and stop thinking they have the right to 'nick' everyone else's content for their site?
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Fri 18-01-08 23:06; edited 2 times in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I am past caring at all the bickering.
PS "plagiarise".
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Lets just ........Oh I can't be bothered .......again 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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After last years controversy over plagiarism by the SCGB of a Pistehors article (and that was not the first time they've done this) you might have thought they'd learnt their lesson, I'm afraid not!
A recent news piece on Scotland posted on their site on the 16th of January has used various photos from Winterhighland and Highland Instinct without any permission or credit given whatsoever - they've even been rude enough not to provide links to either of these excellent Scottish based sites, instead linking to other sites instead.
This plagiarism has been noticed by the owner of Highland Instinct, comments posted here on Winterhighland, and I believe complaints will be made tomorrow but does anyone think the SCGB will ever learn their lesson and stop thinking they have the right to 'nick' everyone else's content for their site?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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skisimon, 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Still Copying of Great Britain strikes again.
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Fri 18-01-08 23:05; edited 1 time in total
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| achilles wrote: |
| PS "plagiarise". |
Yeah, I admit it, I can't spell after a few glasses of wine on a Friday night... but at least it's my spelling not someone else's that I've nicked 
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| Quote: |
does anyone think the SCGB will ever learn their lesson and stop thinking they have the right to 'nick' everyone else's content for their site?
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no, they don't care and, anyway, probably don't think it's wrong. They'd probably argue that unprotected pics on the www are fair game. I'd be slightly disappointed if this thread doesn't get to 20 pages or so tho'.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Bode Swiller, they'd be wrong though. At the least, they've been extremely discourteous.
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laundryman, totally agree but, hey, this is just a few pics... they appear to have a similarly cavalier attitude towards off-piste repping which has had life-changing consequences for some.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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It's embarrassing and silly, but that's also the internet for you. Remember leelau and spratley?
If this is all true, crediting and linking to the original site would have been the very minimum that should have been done.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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stoatsbrother, There's no "if this is all true" about it.
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| Quote: |
Remember leelau and spratley?
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Yes, and here's another fascinating ski magazine spat being played out on the www: http://main.travelwriters.com/bbs/listthread.asp?ID=4759
As for "borrowing" pics from the web... happens all the time. SCGB will argue that their content (eg snow reports - a revenue stream for them) are constantly being re-broadcast. It's simple; if you put something on the www and it gets used (borrowed/nicked/whatever) then your complaint is heavily diluted. It's the same as leaving some fivers on the pavement - the person picking them up isn't a thief, they are the recipient of a windfall.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| It's the same as leaving some fivers on the pavement - the person picking them up isn't a thief, they are the recipient of a windfall. |
In real life that's true, but it's not what the law says SFAIK. Same with nicking pictures from the web.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Ah yes, the sweet autumn leaves of the money tree. Is that what you teach your kids, Swiller?
In which case, I'd avoid leaving your wallet lying around the house if I were you.
And to think that all I used to do was pick up conkers, and loose women.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| ..... I'd be slightly disappointed if this thread doesn't get to 20 pages or so tho'. |
Yup. Looks like it's time for another SCGB-bashing snowheads bonding thing. Haven't had one for a week or so; overdue, really.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
Remember leelau and spratley?
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Never found out what the actual scorewas there. There didn't seem to be much defence regarding whether it happened just a defence that the guy who allegedly done it was OK as a person. What was the end result ?? Was it a fair cop ?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The Scots plagiarise our money for their prescriptions.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Nickski, it died a natural death (like this one will). The spat was far more entertaining than the photos.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| I'd be slightly disappointed if this thread doesn't get to 20 pages or so tho'. |
Well you're doing your level best to help it along I see
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| pistemeister wrote: |
| The Scots plagiarise our money for their prescriptions. |
They're just trying to get the English back for plagiarising their oil you know 
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Only way it'll make 20 pages is if PJSki joins in.
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| roga wrote: |
| pistemeister wrote: |
| The Scots plagiarise our money for their prescriptions. |
They're just trying to get the English back for plagiarising their oil you know |
Might look like it's all off the coast of Scotland but that's not the way the North Sea is divided up. It is (or was) mostly English and Norwegian oil.
Anyway, getting back on track, SCGB don't need oil cos their new Saaaaaaaaaab allegedly runs on dead sheep. Anyone seen it? We still need sight of the number plate to claim the big prize (a free photo album of Scottish ski scenes no doubt).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The SCGB and WinterHighland are both, in different ways, excellent websites.
I hope this one gets sorted amicably.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I have no issue with the photos being used to promote Scottish Snowsports, but I do take issue with the fact that the photos have been used without crediting them.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| Quote: |
Remember leelau and spratley?
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Yes, and here's another fascinating ski magazine spat being played out on the www: http://main.travelwriters.com/bbs/listthread.asp?ID=4759
As for "borrowing" pics from the web... happens all the time. SCGB will argue that their content (eg snow reports - a revenue stream for them) are constantly being re-broadcast. It's simple; if you put something on the www and it gets used (borrowed/nicked/whatever) then your complaint is heavily diluted. It's the same as leaving some fivers on the pavement - the person picking them up isn't a thief, they are the recipient of a windfall. |
Actually - it is theft if accompanied by the necessary dishonest intent (theft by finding).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I find it a little bizarre that the ostensible reason for closing the SCGB discussion forums to the public was fear of legal action/staying on the right side of the law. Such (worthy) concerns do not appear to have informed their actions in other areas.
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Poster: A snowHead
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beetle, as I understand it, the SCGB feared it might be subject to litigation (I now think the whole thing was botched personally). I don't think there was any moral high ground involved.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Best snow on moral high ground
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
roga,
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LOL, so the sea off the coast of Scotland is in fact English... well I'll be a monkey's uncle
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yep, quite a lot of it... http://devilskitchen.me.uk/2006/06/scotlands-oil.html - the border in the sea is a continuation of the border on land. |
Doesn't work like that, international protocol would be a continuation of the mean border gradient which is much less marked than a continuation of the last bit of border. Should the situation arise however existing administrative boundaries would be taken into account.
Prior to 1999 the administrative boundary for the North Sea went straight out parallel to lines of lattitude. This was cynically doctored in the Scotland Act by New Labour to move 6000sq miles of the Scottish Sector to the English Sector to massively increase % of gas reserves in the English sector. At the same time the Westminster govt renounced the UK's claim on Rockall, knocking 400miles off the range of Scottish Territorial waters with the squiggle of a pen! 
This has had dire consequences for the West Highland fishing fleet and control of fish stocks, as well as affecting Scotland's future reclamation of oil reserves in the vicinity.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Sorry, how off topic was that! 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Winterhighland, I'm sure SCGB had something to do with all that.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| beetle wrote: |
| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| Quote: |
Remember leelau and spratley?
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Yes, and here's another fascinating ski magazine spat being played out on the www: http://main.travelwriters.com/bbs/listthread.asp?ID=4759
As for "borrowing" pics from the web... happens all the time. SCGB will argue that their content (eg snow reports - a revenue stream for them) are constantly being re-broadcast. It's simple; if you put something on the www and it gets used (borrowed/nicked/whatever) then your complaint is heavily diluted. It's the same as leaving some fivers on the pavement - the person picking them up isn't a thief, they are the recipient of a windfall. |
Actually - it is theft if accompanied by the necessary dishonest intent (theft by finding). |
Excellent, a police matter. A dawn raid on their Wimbleden den should sort it.
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Swiller: "Hello, is that Wimbledon CID?"
Insp McEnroe: "Yes, how can I help you?"
Swiller: "I wish to report the theft of some rare photos of Scottish ski mountains, which make them look like a Colorado fantasy."
Insp McEnroe: "What is your interest in this matter - do you own these photos?"
Swiller: "No, officer, but I am a respected sock puppet and I witnessed this crime."
Insp McEnroe: "What is the value of these photographs?"
Swiller: "I do not know officer. Some would say that they are priceless."
Insp McEnroe: "You cannot be serious."
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Winterhighland, Who actually owns the copyright of the photos. This person or entity needs to write a dated letter to SCGB stating that as it stands the copyright owner does not give permission for reproduction of the work in this current format. For the use of these images to be granted credit needs to be present in text format associated to the images.
Now if you do not own the copyright you need a letter from the copyright holder stating that you can work exclusively on his behalf for these images.
As the copyright holder of these images you have the right to request that they are removed with immediate effect and becuase you make these requests in dated letters sent to SCGB and their legal representatives you have a strong case to pursue a subsequent legal prosecution if your requests are not adhered to.
Regardless of whether any changes are made or if the photos are removed immediately, everything has a copyright associated to it and unless these images have been changed to make them new and unique they should not have been used without first checking that it is fine to do so with the copyright owner.
Bode Swiller, The SCGB may claim that all they are doing is what many others do to them when they reproduce their Snow Reports but it doesn't escape the fact that they are breaking copyright law. On top of this the use of Snow Reports is a very different matter. Firstly they are not the sole owner of their Snow Reports as the data is provided by Snow Forecast. For this reason it would have to be a joint legal prosecution as otherwise the 2ndary user could claim that all data was taken from Snow Forecast rather than SCGB. More importantly if the new Snow Reports were an amalgamation of many different pieces of primary data such as Accu-Weather, SCGB, Snow Forecast to create a new weather forecast, however similar, it can be claimed that this has its own new copyright due to its uniqueness.
In summary though, Skiing is a community sport and the best and longest standing individuals and businesses seem to be those that respect others and understand this premise. I feel strongly that if SCGB want to borrow others work they need to behave in a way akin to belonging to a community which in this case means linking and crediting the copyright owner at a minimum. If they wish to act as a commercial body, which is fine and acceptable, they need to do this professionally as well which means paying fairly for the use and ownership of items claimed as their own.
Last edited by After all it is free  on Sat 19-01-08 14:56; edited 1 time in total
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Whitegold, SCGB as a travel agent is quite good, as a resort guide is as good as Cadogan guides is and as a snow reports guide is as good as Snow Forecast is.
I book my own holidays so have 0 need for their Travel Agency and although I use their snow reports due to ease of use, if the site disappeared tomorrow it would have 0 impact on my life as I would just use the many other snow reports out there.
BTW This site could offer a much better Snow Report system for Europe and Japan and through a partnership with Teton or Epic could well give a good first hand service for America & Canada....
Just take this quoted report from SZK ...... Chamonix - Jan '08 - It's shitting it down! 
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FAQ
