 Poster: A snowHead
|
As everyone in his family, School or general vicinity knows now, the crowning acheivement of the Chief Smilie Maker's last Winter season was the completion of 'The second longest black run in the world', the Sache in Tignes.
However, not being one to rest on his laurels, he is now asking "Where's the longest black run in the world Dad?". I have a creeping feeling that the answer to this question may end up having some influence on our holiday plans this Winter 
So, who knows?
We don't need off piste routes or greatest altitude drop or anything yet (interesting though that data all is). Simply, "What is the longest BlackPiste?"
In fact, maybe we can get a top 5 here?
1)
2) La Sache - Tignes
3)
4)
5)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
I think the Sarenne in Alpe d'Huez gets in there somewhere - 17km I think. Actually, I probably made that up. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
I always thought the Sarene- Alpe d'Huez, which runs from the Pic Blanc (3,300m) down to about 1,600m was the longest in the Alps. Although I'm not convinced it's a black throughout its length, which from memory is about 16kms. I would certainly nominate the Aiguille Rouge for inclusion in the list. Two of my favourites are the runs from the top of the Grand Montets in Argentiere, 5 & 7 kms respectively, depending whether you go to the back or the front of the mountain and blacks all the way. For an off-piste intinery definitely the Ruitor Glacier, over 20 kms, maybe this is the year I'll ski it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
I think there's an article which includes this info in this month's Daily Mail Ski and Snowboard magazine ? I'll take a look tonight......
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
alan empty, I think you are right altho' most of it is reddish in terms of steepness I was told. It's given black status just because of the length (to put off less able people who might get too tired half way down). Googling will find a thread on this topic on Natives - but I won't spoil things by linking.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
As above, the Sarenne is always quoted, but think about it: a black run is only as good as the sustained pitch. If the black run comprises 10km, 8km of which is red or blue with a couple of steep sections to require the grading, what kind of black run is that? I'm not convinced that the Sarenne is that great (though I've not skied it).
I'd nominate the front face of the Aiguille Rouge for difficulty, though the long black to Villaroger is just an outstanding piste (the best I know), with plenty of steepish stuff and sooooo long.
The main runs of La Grave, unmarked but certainly black in quality, are epic tests of skiing.
The toughest black in St Anton - the Schindlergrat - has been regraded from black to yellow.
The toughest black in Zermatt - the Stockhorn - has also been regraded.
The toughest black for stamina, as I recall, comprises the serial bump runs above Vail, which are really high altitude and exhausting.
In conclusion, I'd take him down the Aiguille Rouge-Villaroger. Fabulous fun for a father and son contest, with a lovely terrace cafe near the bottom as a reward. If it isn't the longest black in the world, it must be very close - 2000m vertical, after all.
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Tue 5-10-04 16:05; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I have skied the Sarenne and it's not that difficult. The gradient varies a lot and much of it is fairly easy stuff. But it is a black run.
David - which one is the Schindlergrat?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
It's a mountain with a big skiing face that stands in front of the higher Valluga. It's not a massive vertical, but it's a good tough run for your money, usually quite mogulled.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
DG, you're right it's a great run, it's also a super bit of off-piste if you duck under the barrier at the top. I feel I'm with you on the Aiguille Rouge.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Tue 5-10-04 16:43; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks David, I think I know where you mean. It's got some good off-piste off to the sides if I'm thinking of the right place.
Anyway, people, we're veering off topic - enough of the quality, more of the quantity! What are the longest 5 black runs? Do we have a length for La Sache yet?
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
I've skied the Sarenne several times and had good snow, bad snow and ice and it's quite a beast of a run. Obviously it's not black run steepness for all of it as you can't have a long black run without almost infinite altitude difference! The top sections are black run difficulty and there are a few short hard sections on the way down. I read a description in one of the ski guide books that described it as a run of two halves with the top half definitely black but the bottom where a good half of the length is a blue/green road. I've always found it hard but nowhere near as hard as le Tunnel (which is quite long ~3km as well but b*****y steep for most of it).
I've always cynically wondered if Alpe'd have never put too many lifts on this run as if they had lifts over the first couple of ks they would have to regrade the bottom and no longer have the longest black run in the alpes.......
How long is the Combe de Caron in Val Thorens. I remember this being a long run with a constantly steep gradiant but very enjojable.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
It seems to be difficult to get information from the Tignes website but I don't think La Sache is longer than the Aiguille Rouge, which the Ski Club website quotes as 7kms with a 2km vertical descent. That makes it a serious black in my view with an average vertical of 28%. I'm intrigued by this, I'm now of to the Chamonix website to check out the Grands Montets, damm there goes the afternoon's work.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Tue 5-10-04 17:04; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
However, the Paradiski piste map only marks the top half of Aiguille Rouge as black and has it as red from the top of the lifts up from Villaroger. Not that I've skied it (yet  ).
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
U, I think you've got to rate the Sarenne as no 1, with the Aiguille Rouge as no 2, I don't think La Sache is as long as the blacks from the top of Grands Montets, Pointe de Vue and Pylones, but it has been a long time since I skied them. Anyone else got any values for length/steepness.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
The bottom half of the Sarenne is a green rather than a blue, meandering , along a scenic gorge. However my book calls it the longest black at 16km.
Also at Alpe d'Huez, but an easy run as far as I remember, the top of the Pic Blanc to L'Envirsin d'Oz is claimed to be the longest Alpine piste and with a vertical of 2,330m (not sure how long)!
I agree about the Aiguille Rouge to Villaroger run at Les Arcs. Though much of the top half is more like a red it has the most black and near-black kms I can think of (and though you said you didn't want it, has the greatest vertical of any black).Les Arcs is usually thought of as an intermediate resort but has many more blacks than Val d'Isere. However many of them are off the top of the Aiguille Rouge cablecar which is sometimes closed by bad weather.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
David Goldsmith,
| Quote: |
The toughest black in St Anton - the Schindlergrat - has been regraded from black to yellow.
|
I've never heard of a yellow. I presume it's tougher than black? Could you elaborate please.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Yellow usually indicates an off-piste intinery.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
www.chezjayski.com
Cant do the links!
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Tue 5-10-04 18:55; edited 2 times in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
Several of the toughest runs were regraded as off-piste itineries to protect the resort from insurance claims since they were often left to grow bump fields rather than being smoothed every day.. They actually remain much the same
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
| hibernia wrote: |
www.chezjayski.com
Cant do the links! |
Its Villaroger in Les Arc
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Oh, so Aiguille Rouge to Villaroger is now claimed also to be the longest Black in the world (16km they say). Well, perhaps thats your answer.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Are they marked yellow because you pee yourself on the way down 
What are the brown runs like?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
DB, try and avoid the face-plants on them because you should never eat the yellow snow.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| snowball wrote: |
Also at Alpe d'Huez, but an easy run as far as I remember, the top of the Pic Blanc to L'Envirsin d'Oz is claimed to be the longest Alpine piste and with a vertical of 2,330m (not sure how long)! |
I never did this but the top section of this is the Tunnel, then it follows a nice easy red to vaujany before turning off on a black (never open when I've been there). Not sure that you could describe the tunnel as easy!
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
| David@traxvax wrote: |
| U, I think you've got to rate the Sarenne as no 1, with the Aiguille Rouge as no 2, I don't think La Sache is as long as the blacks from the top of Grands Montets, Pointe de Vue and Pylones, but it has been a long time since I skied them. Anyone else got any values for length/steepness. |
I'll guess that's in the Vamos guide, they're itineraries anyway, so do they count? There are some massively long itineraries around.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
I believe U was refering to pistes, the longest off-piste itinery I know is the Ruitor glacier which is 20kms, the Vallee Blanche is usually said to be 18kms but most of that is just about a blue. My take on this is:
1. Sarenne - Alpe d'Heuz
2. Aiguille Rouge - Les Arcs
3. Point de vue - Grands Montets
4. La Sache - Tignes
5. Pylones - Grands Montets
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
David@traxvax, eh ? In that case Point de vue and Pylones are itineraries not pistes, actually, Pylones isn't very long either. Sache was an itinerary as well a few years back and better for it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
David@traxvax, I think, though I'm no means certain that the longest off piste itinery would be down the Aletsch Glacier as I seem to recall that it's the longest Glacier in Europe Iit certainly used to be), add on the winter snow at the tail end and I think at one time it was possible to ski something like 25km, this does go back a few decades though to when my father used to ski it, in those days you took the first train up to Jungfraujoch in the morning and got back on more or less the last train at night, these days people use helicopters so a lot less journey time
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
|
ise, both are marked as pistes on the Chamonix piste map and go from the top of Grands Montets at 3300m to Lognan at 2000m, from memory one was 5kms long and the other 7kms, but it's been a long time since I've skied them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
skanky, The Villaroger run is red if you follow the road, but remains black if you follow straight down the fall line between hairpins. Usually lovely snow and good shaped moguls, opening out to a broader snowfield lower down. Finish with lunch at La Ferme, or back up and over to Beliou la Fumee just below 1950 if you want a black run menu too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Surely the only colour that matters is white ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| Chris Reed wrote: |
| snowball wrote: |
Also at Alpe d'Huez, but an easy run as far as I remember, the top of the Pic Blanc to L'Envirsin d'Oz is claimed to be the longest Alpine piste and with a vertical of 2,330m (not sure how long)! |
I never did this but the top section of this is the Tunnel, then it follows a nice easy red to vaujany before turning off on a black (never open when I've been there). Not sure that you could describe the tunnel as easy! |
I think I've muddled which it was, but I read the info about the longest run recently.
All my visits to A d'H over the last 15 years have been off piste (days out from La Grave)
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| ski wrote: |
| Surely the only colour that matters is white ? |
Surely the only couloir that matters is white ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
Martin Nicholas, thanks. I'll be skiing it for the first time in January.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| snowball wrote: |
| Also at Alpe d'Huez, but an easy run as far as I remember, the top of the Pic Blanc to L'Envirsin d'Oz is claimed to be the longest Alpine piste and with a vertical of 2,330m (not sure how long)! |
This is called the Champagne Run....It's the longest vertical you can do on piste but it's not all one piste so it's black at the top, red then blue in the middle and black again at the bottom. I've done it but not all in one go as my legs wouldn't take it!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There are only two runs that go west from the top (as far as I know) and thats the Pyramid and the Couloir des Impossibles which if you can take it, go all the way down to Vaujany and are pretty bloody hairy as their names suggest!!! (And they are off-piste runs).
Have to confess I've not heard of the 'Champagne Run' and I think its fair to say that nothing from 3,300 can be described as 'easy'!!! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
sarah@alpedhuez, the top of the Breithorn in Zermatt can.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
sarah@alpedhuez, yeah, sorry was just being facetiously pedantic (or was it pedantically facetious?).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
