 Poster: A snowHead
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Just trying to draw a parallel with smoking.
20 or 30 years ago it was social to join in with a cigarette but now it is anti-social.
If the environmentalists get their way it is only a matter of time the snowheads are regarded as outcasts.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Speak for yourself
Seriously, if the lifts are switched to nuclear-derived electricity and snow guns are run off reclaimed water, what's the problem?
As to smoking, there will be another cycle of 'luxury indulgence' perception, with personalities other than Demi Moore and Arnie toking cigars in mag adverts. Snooze.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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comprex, Most electricity in France is already nuclear.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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rjs, 'zackly.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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"Skiing"?
Or just lift-serviced alpine skiing?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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abc, since you understand my first point so clearly, what about the second: what is wrong with lift-serviced alpine skiing once the electric supply is reformed and the fresh water usage of snow guns managed?
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Perhaps eventually the last multi-millionaires will spend their last money on the last few drops of hydrocarbons, flying to Antartica to ski on the last few patches of snow, slicing the last polar bears to pieces with their ski edges as they do so.
Or hopefully it won't get to that stage 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Martin Bell, never worry, quite safe.
No polar bears in Antarctica.
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| comprex wrote: |
Martin Bell, never worry, quite safe.
No polar bears in Antarctica. |
It is more likely to be sliced and diced penguin.
But we aready have an advance party down there surveying for the lift installations just in case.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Or just fly to Japan
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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What's nihongo for 'adelie sashimi'?
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skiing is no different from any other unnecessary use of energy - any kind of leisure or competitive use of internal combustion engines, for example, such as almost the entire leisure boating industry, or keeping a whole house of 6 rooms, used by 2 people, warm in winter. Or chatting on the internet (unless on computers powered by solar panels, I suppose, though their manufacture, distribution and disposal is another matter). Or driving a great wagon of a car around the roads. A world in which the exhaustion of resources or fiscal policy had made energy far more scarce and/or expensive would be so different from our own that it is difficult to imagine. It's possible, just possible, that it might mean the end of Big Brother. Every cloud has a silver lining.
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You know it makes sense.
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Plenty of people still smoke, despite it being unfashionable.
Plenty of people still fly, despite it being perceived as eco-unfriendly.
And plenty of people will continue to shred, regardless of public opinion.
Price -- the oil for planes and cars is running out -- and lack of snow -- the world is melting -- are far more likely to curtail SnowHeads' love of white gold.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Doesn't bode well for we Scots who like to fish for the king.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I suppose no one would shoot us if we are prepared to carry the skies to walk up the slope. Many snowheads are doing it any way.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
Plenty of people still fly, despite it being perceived as eco-unfriendly.
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Plenty of people still fly, despite it being perceived as eco-unfriendly, in the view of WhiteGold.
Plenty of people still drive, despite it being perceived as eco-unfriendly in the view of abc. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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We can push the guilt fetishism even further, to wit:
Plenty of people still exist, despite it being perceived as eco-unfriendly.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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False premise.
There is no reason why skiing has to be any more eco-unfriendly than any other leisure activity.
It may or may not be eco-unfriendly now, but as social and economic pressure increase, the industry will adapt. That's how markets work, and resorts are at least putting out rhetoric that they recognise that already.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I agree with ami in berlin,.
I appreciate that my views are considered troll like, but I simply do not believe the global warming, carbon footprint cowdoo. Nature has a way of introducing cycles in the weather, we have had cold spells and hot spells in the past.
Starting from last year which was a poor start to the season I would counsel my views and see if we get 8 years out of the next 10 that are as bad as last new year. Then I will be the first to acknowledge that I was wrong, if however it does not come to pass others will have to eat humble pie. I do not think that we will have the weather we experienced last new year every year for the next 8 or 10 years.
Environmentalists do have their place in society, then again so do slugs!!!!
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ami in berlin, one can finesse the environmental argument to say that the free market model fails to protect the environment because environmental cost is not adequately represented as economic cost. Which is fine, the tragedy of the commons is a well known problem.
The part that peeves me is that there is an automatic further assumption of luxuries being worse for the environment per dollar expenditure than, say, industrial operations. To which I say: BAH!
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comprex, anyone who consumes more than I do is an uncaring environmental vandal. Anyone who consumes less is a downtrodden victim.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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If we cross out smoking ban with skiing ban and add 20 years it should read something like
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In 2027 England will be skiing free
By then it will be against the law to ski in any open or enclosed area making it happier to those who don't ski |
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Mon 23-07-07 19:50; edited 1 time in total
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| comprex wrote: |
ami in berlin, one can finesse the environmental argument to say that the free market model fails to protect the environment because environmental cost is not adequately represented as economic cost. Which is fine, the tragedy of the commons is a well known problem.
The part that peeves me is that there is an automatic further assumption of luxuries being worse for the environment per dollar expenditure than, say, industrial operations. To which I say: BAH! |
I think the ski industry is more likely to get ahead on this issue that other industries, though, for several reasons.
1. It has more to lose from global warming than pretty much any other industry.
2. It serves a clientele that, at least in the USA, tends to be more environmentally concerned than the population as a whole.
3. It serves a clientele that tends to be more weathly than the population as a whole, and therefore more able to accept added costs to apease their concerns in point 2.
We already see ski resorts at least talking about this, which tells me that they recognise both the potential existential threat as well as the PR threat. That's what I mean when I say the market will react, as the industry acts to preserve itself.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Maybe, then again consider that the ski industry has diminishing returns staring it in the face. Yell and scream at skiers and ski industry execs as the environmentalists might, the industry is teeny, penniless, and completely unable to control its own market fate compared to industries that also meet your criteria #2 and #3, to pick an example, minerals extraction operations in the DRC and petroleum processing in west Africa. You won't see those Nigerian gas flares stopping any time soon.
The public has conflated "luxury" and "leisure" with "environmental damage" and cleans out the rose garden whilst failing to notice the uncontrolled dump next door.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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But comprex, that's exactly why I expect the ski industry to get out in front of this (which, again, there are already signs that it is doing).
It's in the industry's interest to establish, follow and promote its efforts to minimise its environmental impact before it starts getting targeted. That makes the industry look good and eases the conscience of its patrons.
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ami in berlin, yes, yes, of course they'll do all that but the 'greening' of skiing has to be considered a purely marketing effort with utterly insignificant overall impact.
A marketing effort can either be directed towards bringing in new customers (big stumbling block of required gear and skills and income there, so very limited chance of a 'green' argument working with novices) or luring away customers from other areas in which case pointless to speak of homogeneous 'ski-industry' instead of case by case.
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You know it makes sense.
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Both ami in berlin and comprex are right though.
Skiing is a very small contributor of the carbon footprint so what it does or does not will have little effect, as observed by comprex.
But the PR angle is important too, both within the industry itself and by its connection to other industry, e.g. building construction industry.
It's like saying what you and I do doesn't really matter since each of us counts for such a tiny part of the overall effect. But if EVERY individual does the "right" thing for the environment, the collective result will become significant. Same principle applies to insignificant industry such as the ski industry. By joining with other "insinificant" industry that are direcly affected by global warming, together they will make more significant changes.
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FAQ
has there been a 
mood change? I thought you were public enermy no.1 at some time. 