 Poster: A snowHead
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Set the scene and see if anyone can shed some light:
New to skiing and only had two indoor lessons at Tamworth SnowDome which were, to be honest, far from ideal (too crowded, uninterested instructor and ice rather than snow!). Biting the bullet and not going to bother with indoor but just go to have a bash. My plan is to have a 1 hour private lesson in the AM and then mooch off to practice what I have learned. Follow this pattern throughout the next 3 days. Is this a good way to do it or should I be looking at a more dedicated structure of lessons? I am going to be learning at La Grande Terche. Any input from you pros? 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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MrDan, Hardly a pro, but IMHO I'd agree with your approach but suggest 2 hours rather than 1. 1 hour is enough to be getting 'warmed up' but to have to stop at that point might be a bit frustrating. Also with the instructor needing to be back to meet his next client, you could find that the first and last 10 mins are 'wasted'. 2 hours is more effective in my experience. Definitely best in the AM though, when you're fresh.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Again, not a pro, but you might benefit from a coupld of half days in group lessons, then a 2 hour private on the 3rd day (a bit more cost effective, and it gives you a chance to meet new people and learn with them)
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AxsMan, brilliant, thanks for that. At least I know I'm on the right track. I must admit I was a little put off from formal lessons with the indoor experience but the last thing I want to do is just hire the equip and have a go, probably end up doing it wrong and injuring myself! I'll go for the 2 hour session as suggested and see where I go from there. Can't wait to get started! I'm assuming the sessions include learing how to correctly use the lifts and drags? Here's hoping otherwise I'll be the fella spooling around on the floor... thanks for the help
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I have to disagree I'm afraid. You'll learn faster and ultimately 'better' if you have continuous lessons to begin with (i.e. mornings and afternoons, in a group - normal ski-school). In the early days of your skiing career you'll just pick up bad habits if you ski on your own. This can lead to frustration and unhappiness with your own performance. In addition, group lessons are a brilliant laugh (if done well), and the experience will certainly add to your enjoyment of the holiday.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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The local skis school is ESF of which I have heard (mostly) good things assuming the group size is fairly small. telford_mike, it is the 'bad habits' that I am worried about! I know how easy they are to pick up and how hard they are to break!! I'll get in touch with the school and see what they can offer, I assume they will od a beginner package of some kind.
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MrDan, I'm in a similar situation to you, I too am a newbie and go to Austria at the weekend... I was going to do a ski school for 5x 2.5 hours lessons over a week. however I have been told to go private instead. so I have booked 3x 2 hour lessons for about £40.00 more.
Being a complete novice I have to go on what people tell me, and I'm told these 3 private lessons will be more benefical then 2 weeks at a ski school...
I would like to say I have found everyone on snowheads to be really helpful and I haven't been made to feel stupid at anytime.
Welcome
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slippy, cheers for that. It is difficult to know what to do really and I agree with you - everyone at  's has been great! The benefit of private lessons seems to be that is completely tailored to my abilities (or lack of!) rather than the 'best' or 'worst' in a larger group. Hoe you have a great time and as I don't go until 24th Jan it would be good if you can give some feedback after your lessons! Cheers
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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MrDan, No problem I'll be sure to give posting and video for the amusement of everyone on snowheads..
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slippy, While I'm sure the advice you've received was given with the best possible intentions, there's simply no way that you can learn as much in 3 x 2 hour private lessons as you would in a more extended period in ski-school.
Remember that learning is much more than just absorbing technique. You need to consolidate each new movement in a safe environment where you can get appropriate support when things go a bit pear-shaped. In addition, 80% of learning to ski is the non-technical stuff (balance, body-management etc) which cannot be 'taught' in the traditional sense of the word. Your instructor just drip-feeds suitable exercises which will build these skills almost subconciously. This takes time, and for most people the supportive dynamic of a group lesson is much better that the one-on-one pressure of private classes.
Private lessons are great for more experienced skiers who need to tweek their technique, and they can be pretty good if there is a small group of you who want to learn together. But the ski-school formula is very successful, and has been the basis for enjoyable, effective learning for many years.
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Wed 3-01-07 12:43; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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MrDan, B4 you go - have some lessons at Telford dryslope - it's a much nicer place to learn than Tamworth.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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MrDan, I think this is one of those 'ask ten folks and get 11 opinions' questions. I have had several group lessons as well as several 1-1 (or with Mrs Axs, 1-2) lessons over the last few years and would say that private lessons may not be as 'sociable' as group (although with the right instructor this is not always the case) but they are MUCH more effective as a learning session. having 100% (or 50%) of the instructors attention is much better than 10 - 15% and you can progress as fast as your aptitude allows (rather than at the pace of the slowest member).
The lessons I have had have included an element of 'guiding' so you do get to find your way round the hill. and again in ones and twos there is very little waiting around while someone else adjusts their boots.
Some may find group' lessons more enjoyable from the 'making new friends' approach, but for me, private lessons represent the best way to get started on that learning curve quickly and cost-effectively. Of course if your budget stretches you could try both and see how you get on. I have also done a week where we (family of 6) had lessons together for 3 hours in the morning and 2 in the afternoon, and it was one of the best skiing weeks we've had.
One final point. I have had mixed experiences with ESF, and generally would suggest trying to contact a smaller independent local ski school if possible. However I don't have any experience of ESF at your resort, so they might be brilliant. I would not trust young kids with them though, too large a group and too many horror stories.
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AxsMan, I suppose this is quite a subjective thing really and depends on how individuals prefer to learn. However, it is very useful for me and other beginners to see what others think and learn from the experiences. I do like the idea of being able to go at my pace rather than being part of a big group and hanging around (and paying for it too). I think it is only ESF at the resort but will have a look-see.
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You know it makes sense.
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telford_mike, Thanks for you post..I fully understand what your saying about the balancing etc. I can see the Pro's and Con's for both.
I expect it's just preference, I personally feel that I'd be more comfortable 1 to 1. If I take quite well to it, we can move on faster and if I don't they can spend more time with me trying to get it right without holding up the rest of the group
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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MrDan, slippy,
My thoughts on private versus group lessons....
If there are 6 people in a group then you can at best expect to receive 1/6 of the instructors time... so for a 2 hour group lesson about 20minutes....
Compare cost on this basis and the private looks less expensive now....
Some folks find the intense scrutiny and instruction of a private lesson a little daunting... you cannot "hide" ... all your efforts will be seen and analysed....
personally I find this good for my learning.... and still take the private lessons because i enjoy the constant progress.... I ski with groups and group lessons for other learning outcomes(determined in the private lessons between me and instructors).....
So far I have not hit the famed "intermediate plateau" and continue to learn and progress every season I ski....
There is much to be said for a few well thought out private lessons with the same instructor(or instructors) and then some well rehearsed practice (which may also include - as in my case - group lessons)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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MrDan, I applaud the fact that you are still willing to give the mountain a go after a disappointing experience - and I am quite sure that, however you choose to learn, you won't regret it!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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little tiger, thanks for this. Sounds like a combo of group and private might be the best way forward. I'll give it a go and see what works for me.
TallTone, I did have a not very nice time but I was convinced that this was not 'typical' of skiing lessons or instructors! Bring on the mountain (or at least the learner slopes to begin with )
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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MrDan,
you are welcome....
I try to get my friends to take 1-3 privates to get a good start... and to ski with them after to work on their technique(on suitable terrain - NOT any harder than in the lesson unless advised to do so)...
after that I think they need to evaluate where they are at and what will suit them...
me - I'm a lesson whore... love the learning thing.... 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Do you have anyone to ski with in the afternoons? If not it might be best to go for a mix of group lessons in the morning (to meet new people to ski with) and the odd private lesson in the afternoon (every other day?). As long as you take a good break over lunch you should be fine to have a 1.5/2 hour private lesson from 3-4.30 after a morning group session from 9.30-12 or similar. Expensive but very rewarding.
If you have friends to ski with I usually do as little tiger, encourage them to have private lessons and keep an eye on them in the afternoons myself - maybe it's just me but I was always taught not to ski alone in case of accidents and I still try and stick to that guideline.
I'm sure it will work out whatever you choose - it's mostly down to what you want and fell most confortable with.
aj xx
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Good point a.j., I do quite a bit of kayaking and the same goes with that really - brilliant to do it alone and have the peace and quiet but with safety in mind always better with someone else present. Same for ski I assume? I'll be going with one other but as yet undecided whether she'll be skiing or watching! Thanks for the input though, helpful.
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Group lessons are an absolute blast if you are at about the middle of teh ability range in your group imo. If you are the best in the group you'll get bored; if you're the slowest, you'll never get a rest and chances are you'll never hear anything the instructor says if you're always at the back. So another vote for purely privates.
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One thing that helps there eng_ch is to rotate the group each time you set off to do another exercise, 123456 then 234561 then 345612 etc That way you don't end up with the fastest at the front and the slowest at the back all the time.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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MrDan, You seems pretty confident but one thing to watch for in private lessons is the "worst in the world" syndrome. I met a group of skiers who had a beginner with them. They had convinced her that private lessons were the way to progress faster. She had a 2 hour lesson on the first morning - then never skied again  . She thought she couldn't ski at all, and would never be able to do it! I am sure that if she had been with a few others, falling down, not being able to get up, having a laugh, a chat and learning from each other's mistakes, she wouldn't have felt so bad! So I'd do ski school in the mornings, (with a school that limits the number of people, if possible, to 8 or less), then have a couple of privates in the afternoons on, say, Tuesday and Thursday.
Just my opinion, of course, and it may not apply to you at all  . You might be a natural!
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maggi, again, another good point! I think that my natural persistence should see me through because I hate giving up even if I do spend the first few hours sliding around! I usually just laugh it off. I think 'a natural' might be a bit over the mark but I suppose you just never know... 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hi!
I'm a by no means a pro or even an experienced skier, but thought that i would add my two penneth as someone who was in the same situation as you last year...
I went to France last year as someone who had once been on a dry slope at the age of 12 and broke my hand. That was the total extent of my skiing experience! Having had Private lessons in other sports and not liking the close attention and scrutiny I opted for a course of beginners skiing lessons in a group. 100 euro's for 6 days x 2 hours. I thought the price was pretty good and decided to go for it.
On day 1 there was about 10 people in the group, but by day 2 we had been split in half (based on how quickly we were picking it up). By day 3 i was skiing nicely down blue runs and parallel turning (having cut out the snow plough completely even for stopping). By day 4 we had been split again and i was now in a group of 3 tackling faster blue runs. This boosted my confidence and in the afternoons (when not in lessons) i began learning to carve with a more experienced friend. By day 6 of my lessons my little group of 3 were comfortable on red runs.
I am going back this year (in two weeks time woo-hoo!! ) and have booked onto an Advanced Intermediate course.
For me taking the group lessons was by far the better choice. I had more fun, met some great people and learnt in a more enjoyable way. And people say you don't learn as much in a group - i went from barely being able to stand to being comfortable on reds in week. Maybe i'm biased, but i think that's pretty good!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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MrDan, you'll be just fine. My first lesson was in the AFTERNOON of the first day. Well that wasn't good enough for me. I implored the friends we'd gone with to show me basic technique, and after twenty or so falls down the first slope, being almost in tears and wondering why I'd spent the thick end of five grand on a week's holiday (I have three kids) I was at last in a position to point straight down the rest of that piste. Boy, does that wind in your hair feel good! I simply haven't looked back... couldn't wait to book the next holiday
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magic_hat, You were lucky that your group got split up - suppose you'd spent the whole week with the whole group of the first day. Whether this happens is likely to depend on whether the ski school is busy, and also whether they have to pay non-working instuctors (structure of the school). You effectively had private lessons.
maggi, I think your friend was very unlucky, but also surprisingly uneducated - did her other skiing friends not explain that you can't learn to ski in a day?
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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MrDan, I learnt to ski 2 seasons ago. Being 50 at the time, my SO decided on my behalf that due to time 'time' ( and my personal Bad Attitude ) it would help if I had private lessons - 2 hrs each morning. I was anything but a 'natural' and found it difficult ( after day 2, 3 or 4 I was practising a little each afternoon) . I would vouch for private lessons every time, if I had been part of a group of more than 2 or 3 I would have probaly given-up; having no group benchmark I was able to push myself albeit at a slower pace than a group might have demanded.
If your finances can take it go private but do try and find an instructor through referral as early as you can and book the whole 'course' ahead of time. I wasted some time and money by booking 'the most expensive' ski school in the mistaken belief that would equate to the best instruction.
PS - i am now a ski-aholic, probably loads worse than anyone else hereabouts but that doesn't stop me trying to improve ( and I still have private lessons)
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Poster: A snowHead
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magic_hat, you were lucky - can I ask where/what school? They sound great!
If your instructor doesn't 'rotate' you for each exercise suggest it yourself to the others btw - it is very useful to have a different person go 'first' each time and is easy to achieve as yuo usually start from a standstill for each new exercise. (only applies once you hit real slopes btw and start playing the 'follow me' or 'ski to me' games - on nursery slope you should be close enough together to hear everything and it's tricky to rearrange yourselves.
aj xx
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Personal opinion - I think they (group and private) can both work well. And a lot of how well it works is going to be down to the learner as well - The following are worth thinking about:
- how much you pay attention to the instructor (whether group or private) and whether you can ignore people who are not serious about learning
- whether having lots of other learners inspires confidence in you or makes you feel more nervous
- can you understand what the instructor is trying to say?
- in a group you can learn from other people's mistakes
- if you're not happy about anything (e.g. you feel the group is golding you back, or you can't manage what most are doing, or the instructor isn't making things clear) then don't be afraid to say something.
Remember, with both private and group lessons, you are the paying customer at the end of the day. So if things aren't working out ask to switch instructor or group.
I did a few mornings of ski-school in Arinsal years ago and it was excellent and I came on really really quick. Being in a group sort of keeps you going when you feel you're crap, and the instructors don't usually stand for any wimpy behaviour. And when I went to La Clusaz last March, a mate of mine who had never skied before got on really well after just 2 x 2 hours lessons with one other person. He was knackered - but before the lessons he couldn't even stand up on the skis. After his second lesson we coaxed him on to a nice wide red and just took it easy with him all the way down. He didn't even know it was a red until we got to the bottom, and when we told him he was really stoked and had heaps of confidence for the rest of the week.
The private lessons are surprisingly cheap really for 2 hours and bring you on well. But the groups can work really well as well and can be a lot of fun.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| MrDan wrote: |
Set the scene and see if anyone can shed some light:
New to skiing and only had two indoor lessons at Tamworth SnowDome which were, to be honest, far from ideal (too crowded, uninterested instructor and ice rather than snow!). Biting the bullet and not going to bother with indoor but just go to have a bash. My plan is to have a 1 hour private lesson in the AM and then mooch off to practice what I have learned. Follow this pattern throughout the next 3 days. Is this a good way to do it or should I be looking at a more dedicated structure of lessons? I am going to be learning at La Grande Terche. Any input from you pros? |
Out of interest.. what day were you at the snowdome? Usually if its a ski only session going on its not too bad ice wise.. its the boarders that tend to scrape the snow away
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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FAQ
No major collisions, breakages, just very sore calf muscles that I obviously never use in normal run of the mill life 
