 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@neironet, no idea really, but I'd imagine that your Assos stuff then Nikwax wash in would work well? Try and see?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@under a new name, that what I was planning on doing. But I wonder if Assos is a wrong type detergent and can ruin the fabric in some way. It is supposed to be used for high-end cycling clothing, but no words on GoreTex or ski gear. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@neironet, goretex recommends normal liquid detergent for cleaning (albeit 1/3 usual amount IIRC).
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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As far as I am concerned over many years of using breathable tech clothing, nothing comes anywhere close to the manufacturers original coating and you’re more than likely to reduce the breathability of your Tech outer layer by washing it with any sort of detergent, even Nik wax.
I usually soak any slightly smelly clothing in Water well away from the washing machine and simply let it drip dry on the washing line outside. That gets rid of almost all smells whilst ensuring that all detergent gets nowhere near it. if I have a patch on the shoulders that gets high wear due to carrying skis, I might squirt a bit of Nick wax on it but to be honest, I haven’t found out very effective either over the years. For a localised patch that doesn’t need to be specifically breathable silicone waterproofing spray like you might use on your mountain bike is more effective in my opinion.
I usually reckon that a decent outer shell of 20:20 or better will last 8 to 10 Ski weeks before deteriorating significantly. And I usually buy new, top spec, jackets that are one or two seasons out of date from somewhere like SportPursuit.Com so are about the same price as a current season mid range jacket. Once the factory DWR starts to give up, I will re-purpose it for hiking or general use or give it to charity that way I reckon it works out about £30 per trip over the life of the Ski clothing To ensure you have good waterproof breathable clothes. I also use a multi layer system with an high tech outer shell layer which means that if your Gore tex does give up, you’re only losing the last millimetre of your Ski clothing rather than wasting all the insulation layers as well.
I did try and experiment last year and took two old jackets to a dry cleaners that advertised that they did professional re-waterproofing of breathable clothing. When I got them home I gave them a light spray with a garden hose on a mist setting and both of them performed really poorly compared to my one-year-old jacket which I had beside them as a comparator. I took them both back to the dry cleaners and they reproofed them again. And there was still no improvement when I tested them again, so I just gave up on the expense as I was quite confident that the dry cleaners had followed the product instructions it’s just that the products don’t work very well.
Whatever you do if you are going to try using a domestic washing machine it is critical that it has to be completely free of any sort of washing powder or conditioner otherwise that will simply clog up all the pores in your gore tex and end up having an expensive jacket that no longer breathes properly. So you really need to remove the powder drawer clean it thoroughly and the compartment behind it and run at least two rinses through your washing machine before even thinking of putting your.Gore tex in there.
Oh, don’t tumble dry them either because that will knacker them also.
A bit of more amusing advice is a tip I got from a friend many years ago for Skiing on very heavy snow days or even in places where you get a bit of rain (like Morzine). For 100% waterproofing of your bum put a bin bag between your thermals and your ski trousers then whatever you sit on will never get through to soak you even if it gets through your salopette bottoms. I’ve only ever done it a few times, but it worked brilliantly. 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@snowdave, thank you!
@rickboden, thank you for such a detailed answer! If an outer shell only lasts 8 to 10 ski weeks, then mine is completely ruined I've been wearing the same jacket and ski pants for about 5 years already, and I ski multiple weeks per year. I've also already washed it several times! It's still okay, but I'm also just a "recreational skier" because of a couple of traumas. I have to wash my clothes as I have hyperhydrosis and even after a couple of weeks of skiing my clothes smell  But next time when we live at a ski resort for a prolonged time, I might try your "just water" method, it sounds like something that might just work.
To be honest, regarding being waterproof, I've used waterproof spray on another piece of clothing I have, and it worked perfectly. So I"m planning to "finish" my washing effort by waterproof spraying my ski clothes, and mostly trying to figure out what comes before that. I wonder if the dry cleaners you took your jackets to even used such a spray - but it definitely works. Not sure about breathability though :\
Regarding washing powder - I've read several websites from companies as Salomon, Quicksilver and they all recommend washing with "mild soap" whatever it means. And they also suggest a gentle tumble dry! Go figure.
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@rickboden, thorough post 
I've never done a back to back comparison as when I was young and energetic enough I only had one breathable shell.
Our experience over 25 years and various ski shells, various Gore-texs, H2No, Dermizax is Nikwax (or Grainger's) clean then wash-in and a light tumble (if recommended ... our new tumble dryer has a specific setting for technical breathable fabrics). Done once a season so every 50-60 days or so unless stain related accidents and things seem pretty fine.
We don't usually worry about the washing machine as we use a short, non-pre-washing cycle and detergent (in any case savon de marseille) goes in drum directly.
And in product lifetime? Best was a Mountain Hardwear (back when they were really good) Gore-Tex shell which lasted 1998 to 2012, 50-60 days a season => ~750 days; the Patagucci H2No got 2012 to 2019 - ~400 days; but we don't ski in the rain if we can avoid it (why would you?)
I had a fairly lengthy conversation with a manufacturer of my current shell over care as it deteriorated in a way I didn't think correct and they were firmly of the opinion that you need to wash (with "tech" products or minimal detergent) at least every 50 days or so as otherwise oils in your sweat will accumulate, blocking the membrane's pores. [The end of the conversation was them crediting the original cost against a new one, version 2, different fabric, very fair).
@neironet, your Assos product claims to "improve" breathability and looks techy enough to me. I don't think you can do permanent damage.
I'd still give it a go.
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| under a new name wrote: |
@rickboden, thorough post
I've never done a back to back comparison as when I was young and energetic enough I only had one breathable shell.
Our experience over 25 years and various ski shells, various Gore-texs, H2No, Dermizax is Nikwax (or Grainger's) clean then wash-in and a light tumble (if recommended ... our new tumble dryer has a specific setting for technical breathable fabrics). Done once a season so every 50-60 days or so unless stain related accidents and things seem pretty fine.
We don't usually worry about the washing machine as we use a short, non-pre-washing cycle and detergent (in any case savon de marseille) goes in drum directly.
And in product lifetime? Best was a Mountain Hardwear (back when they were really good) Gore-Tex shell which lasted 1998 to 2012, 50-60 days a season => ~750 days; the Patagucci H2No got 2012 to 2019 - ~400 days; but we don't ski in the rain if we can avoid it (why would you?)
I had a fairly lengthy conversation with a manufacturer of my current shell over care as it deteriorated in a way I didn't think correct and they were firmly of the opinion that you need to wash (with "tech" products or minimal detergent) at least every 50 days or so as otherwise oils in your sweat will accumulate, blocking the membrane's pores. [The end of the conversation was them crediting the original cost against a new one, version 2, different fabric, very fair).
@neironet, your Assos product claims to "improve" breathability and looks techy enough to me. I don't think you can do permanent damage.
I'd still give it a go. |
Great post and glad you’ve have better experiences than me. I will give your suggestion to go when my current shall reaches the end of its waterproof life.
It looks like from both of us at 50 to 60 days it’s about the right length of time before DWR deterioration occurs.
Amazing how technology catches up and what modern tumble dries can do
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