 Poster: A snowHead
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Powder skirts - what are they all about? I have just bought a new jacket which has an integrated powder skirt - think I will just cut it out to go in the pile of unused skirts from previous jackets. I simply don't get these. I have skied hundreds of weeks, mostly off piste and can count on one hand the number of days where a powder skirt would have been relevant. You need soft, deep, dry snow for it to risk snow going up your jacket, even then you'll be wearing a backpack with a waste strap leaving no room for snow. So what on earth is the powder skirt for?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@pisteoff, yeah, not on my list of requirements
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Err, maybe for the plenty of people who still fall over?
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Well, I'm getting ever better at that, comes with age ...But does snow go up your jacket when you fall?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Well yeah, kind of a silly question really.
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Surely even the theoretical falling powder skier who has forgotten they'd be wearing a pack is more likely to collect snow through that opening where their head is than to somehow have it travel upwards under their jacket, failing to be blocked by the jacket hem, but being stopped by this additional barrier. It sounds a bit unlikely to me. I don't think anyone [I ride with] cares about this type of "feature", although sometimes you can't avoid buying it.
A combination of marketing and justification for the price differential between a jacket range?
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I'd like a hood-free jacket too, but those are as hard to get as jackets which aren't built for big people.
Maybe there's a business idea there: a sewing shop which removes unwanted features (and beer gut space) from expensive jackets.
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I know people, my wife for one, who like to fasten these all the time. Not quite sure why, TBH, but I think it's more about holding it in place than protecting against powder ingress.
They do offer a little more wind/snow protection even if you're not going to fall over, so I do tend to fasten them if I'm going out in a blizzard at -15C, whether I'm expecting waist-deep powder or not.
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| SnoodyMcFlude wrote: |
| Err, maybe for the plenty of people who still fall over? |
I'm sure there IS a combination of conditions, speed, and type of fall where a snowskirt might 'save the day' but my falls have come in two kinds, slow speed and high speed. Slow speed doesn't generally have the momentum to push snow up your jacket and high speed I'm either much more worried about making sure everything's still attached to care if a bit of snow's gone up my jacket, or so much has been pushed up that the snowskirt poppers would have unpopped or the skirt been flipped up and the snow pushed past it.
Can't say they offend me so much I'd bother removing them, I just ignore them when putting my jacket on and can't say I've ever been 'aware' of it being there while wearing the jacket.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| phil_w wrote: |
| I'd like a hood-free jacket too, but those are as hard to get as jackets which aren't built for big people. |
As someone else who's found most jacket manufacturers seem to assume someone with a 38" chest size will have arms 18m long you might want to check out the Schöffel. Arm lengths where I can actually see my hands with the jacket on and a zip on/off hood so you have the choice.
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Most of my falls are head-first, wouldn't help me in the slightest!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| pisteoff wrote: |
| Powder skirts - what are they all about?...... |
I luv 'em - keeps the draughts out as I prefer regular trousers not high waisted/bibbed salopettes. Wish my outdoor/dog walking jackets had 'em.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Always assumed it is Scottish specific spec, no?
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I only do mine up if its very cold and windy to keep the draughts out. Even then it tends to be only in high, cold, exposed spots when I've dressed for better weather lower down the mountain.
I've had a couple of occasions when I've lost an edge on steep icy pistes and had to arrest a high speed slide, where having it done up would have been better to keep the cookies out.
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You know it makes sense.
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@spyderjon, isn't "dog walking jacket" what old ski jackets become?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@adithorp, We don't have a dog, but there's the "kicking around in the back of the landrover" jacket, the "leave it in the garage in case it starts raining while I'm down there" jacket and the "next to the front door for snow clearing" jacket, as well as one or two others.
I did actually throw away some old ones earlier this year, I'm down to only three or four now.
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Poster: A snowHead
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The snow skirt is not to keep snow out but stop things falling down onto the snow. Examples include;
Stuffing my hat into my jacket when it turns warmer during the day.
Ditto with gloves
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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A decent flannel shirt comes with none of thee pointless features and works great most of the time 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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My zips out (Black Diamond). I like it, it keeps the wind out, but I do remove it in summer if I'm using the jacket as a raincoat (it's much more heavy duty than my actual raincoat).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| pisteoff wrote: |
| Powder skirts - what are they all about?...... |
I luv 'em - keeps the draughts out as I prefer regular trousers not high waisted/bibbed salopettes. Wish my outdoor/dog walking jackets had 'em. |
This.
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I often only wear a t shirt or base layer under my jacket and I have definitely stuffed it on occasion and found snow wedged between the powder skirt and the jacket which would have ended up either up or down somewhere where one does not require snow to be.
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I'm impressed that something so inconsequential could be an issue for people, even for Snowheads that's unexpected
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I think its all about specifications, to tick as many boxes as the manufacturer can to justify the price.
I was treated to a new jacket last Christmas, it took me about 3 days of use before I decided to unzip the "snow skirt". Now I can bend over enough to get my boots on. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| SnoodyMcFlude wrote: |
| I'm impressed that something so inconsequential could be an issue for people, even for Snowheads that's unexpected |
- jfi I started the same thread on Facebook - 3X the comments here
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So Snowheads 3x as good as Facebook - good to know.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I thought this was about female dealers 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If the powder you are skiing doesnt look like a powder, then its not needed.
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You know it makes sense.
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I think it may have been useful for the kids jackets when they were young and would often play/roll around in the snow.
For me, as an adult, no need. Mine is very tight (or I am fat) so I never do it up. I think the missus likes it to stop drafts coming up.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| phil_w wrote: |
I'd like a hood-free jacket too, but those are as hard to get as jackets which aren't built for big people.
Maybe there's a business idea there: a sewing shop which removes unwanted features (and beer gut space) from expensive jackets. |
I agree 100%. I took my hooded jacket to a specialist outdoor repairer/tailor but they told me it's the cost of the jacket in the work done to remove the hood and make it into just a collar.
Looking at removable hood jackets I came down to:
Helly Hansen Alpha Lifaloft (too expensive and size runs small)
Karbon Helium _ nearly bought it but then sold out when I went back
North Face Chakal - what I eventually bought. Can also be used as a winter jacket without looking too ski-jacketish
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Poster: A snowHead
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Snowskirts are for deep pow, a windbreak, and styling.
Europe rarely gets enuf snowfall to warrant one.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Timberwolf,
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I use when it’s very cold - helps keep my core warm.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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MJit spot on. Introduced by the outdoor clothing manufacturers to persuade us we shoudn't wear our gore-tex walking jackets on the slopes in the 90's. I remember being in an Arc'Teryx store when my wife told a rep she wore a Beta jacket for skiing. They said that not a skiing jacket, so she whipped out a photo of her wearing one waist deep in Japan powder and the assistant went and showed it to all his colleagues.
Maybe better for snowboarders?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| rdk wrote: |
... Looking at removable hood jackets I came down to:
Helly Hansen Alpha Lifaloft (too expensive and size runs small)
Karbon Helium _ nearly bought it but then sold out when I went back
North Face Chakal - what I eventually bought. Can also be used as a winter jacket without looking too ski-jacketish |
And this season's Rossignol Strawpile jacket. Not removable, but although the hood is beefy and full size, and it also zips away.
One of those just arrived on my doorstep. It's not for big people, and not cut large in front for those with beer guts. Lightly insulated. No pit zip and probably not fully taped. It has a snow skirt, a few cm above the high waist which has double tensioners etc.
I'm not sure about dog walking, but this isn't the sort of jacket I'd want for general UK walking; I'd want something longer for that, with zero insulation, more tape/fewer seams, or something which packs down small.
| 22 wrote: |
| [powder skirts were] Introduced by the outdoor clothing manufacturers to persuade us we shoudn't wear our gore-tex walking jackets on the slopes in the 90's |
I'm pretty sure snow skirts were around in the 1980s, but the earliest reference I can easily google is rec.skiing.alpine in 1994. Quite a lot of them are attached with zips, and even when they're not, they're no more annoying when used in rain versus snow, in that they're pointless in both  If you look at say this US patent from 1918 I think the basic idea has been around for a very long time (#22).
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| pisteoff wrote: |
| Powder skirts - So what on earth is the powder skirt for? |
like this?
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| 22 dropout wrote: |
Maybe better for snowboarders? |
Could be, as they have a tendency to sit down on the snow (or IN the snow if it were deep?)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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They work for snowboarders or anyone attempting a bit of off piste in deep snow or even the side of the piste if you stop and fall in you tend to go backwards and get a lovely amount of thick snow trying to get in everywhere ! Other than that i can't remember ever having to need one .
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| phil_w wrote: |
| Surely even the theoretical falling powder skier who has forgotten they'd be wearing a pack is more likely to collect snow through that opening where their head is than to somehow have it travel upwards under their jacket, failing to be blocked by the jacket hem, but being stopped by this additional barrier. |
It depends if you are skiing in waist-deep powder; in my experience, a snow skirt is essential. Nothing to do with falling over. Now, if you are not doing that, then ditch it. All mine have had the option of zipping out. However, ski jackets are international and need to cater for the North American market, where this is far more likely than in Europe. Think of it as the reverse EU effect (aka where the EU mandates things like USB-C charging ports, and everyone, including Apple, complies, even in the USA). This time it's a North American feature, and we Europeans get to suck it up
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