 Poster: A snowHead
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Hey folks,
Just wondering whether it makes sense to carry the space saver spare wheel in the care with us when we drive to France over Easter. Am leaning towards not taking at it as:
- 95% of the journey is motorway, so with a blowout or puncture we would have to call breakdown assistance in any case
- even if we were in a position to mount it, it would not get us to where we need to go - only to the nearest garage
- I have never mounted a wheel, nor am I particularly handy. I feel like a wheel attached by me would constitute a grave safety concern
- the space saver also is not fitter with a winter tyre.
Unfortunately, the space below the boot is not large enough to accommodate a full size wheel + tyre.
So I would be inclined to leave it at home and utilize the space for other things. Am I missing something here, are there any compelling reasons to take the space saver spare along with us?
Would also be quite keen for someone who has experienced a breakdown / tire issue on French motorways and how that got resolved.
Appreciate any input.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Definitely take it with you, far more option should you be unfortunate in having a puncture.
Practice now at home, mounting and demountaing the spare, not too hard and the least you'll find out is if you do want to go nowhere near it 
Make sure it's at correct pressure ready for use too.
You or anyone else can at least move the car competently in getting you to relatively safe place by using it. Driven reasonably, you'll not notice much difference.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Unfortunately, the space below the boot is not large enough to accommodate a full size wheel + tyre
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Our Vauxhall, fitted with a space saver, had quite enough room for a full size tyre - they were just saving fourpence.
I've not had a puncture on a French motorway, but HAVE had punctures on minor French roads, and had a spare tyre, so got on our way. Puncture caused by a nasty sharp-edged pothole on a mountain road in a rented car equipped with only a can of gunk would have caused a massive, and dangerous, problem had we not had other cars in the group and had I not been capable of speaking French to the grumpy local garagiste who had to drive 10 kms up a winding mountain road to pick up the car the following morning and fit 2 new tyres - and also willing and able to drive back down the mountain the following day and pick it up. Goodness knows how long it would have taken had we just phoned Europcar in Geneva airport and waited - lone woman (my daughter in law) on a narrow road, in the snow, with three tired and hungry kids as dusk fell. Proper nightmare.
I would never go anywhere without a spare wheel if I could help it. Even if you can't change a wheel (get someone to teach you - it's not difficult but you might need a good wheel brace with an extension for leverage) someone who stops to help will be able to do so. The space under the floor won't be very useful - keep your space saver in it, if it's REALLY not big enough for a proper wheel
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With winter tyres the space saver needs to go on the rear so a swap around of wheels may be needed.
You can always call out your breakdown provider to do the change.
You may have a very long wait if your provider cant get a repair or replacement tyre.
The space saver will at least get you to somewhere of some comfort till you are mobile again,
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Adblue tank is where mine would be, just got a can of glue and no runflats as standard. Buy a new can of the glue each year incase it goes off.
Would also be interested in what happens if you get a blow out in france as we intend to drive from now on. Maybe I should buy a space saver and put it in the boot on long journeys like this.
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Always take a spare, even if you have to deflate it to fit it in the hole. It will only take a few minutes to bring it up to pressure with a half decent pump.
If you get a puncture on a motorway, the recovery can fit it for you and get you on your way much quicker.
A few years ago, we had to buy a second car that my Mother could get in and out of without difficulty. Never thought to check if there was a spare, just assumed it would be a space saver.
Used the car to go to Twickenham, and clipped a very square kerb whilst dropping off passengers. Surprised to only find a tube of gunk, which only works with small punctures. Hole was too big to use it and safely drive 120 miles back up the motorway.
Called a very busy RAC. Sat 3 hours in a pub and a further 4 hours in a car in freezing weather before being picked up for a 2 part relay. Eventually got home at noon the following day, 14 hours later than planned.
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It’s not that frequent to get a puncture or blow out. So it’s a small risk to use the space for luggage instead.
That said,
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even if we were in a position to mount it, it would not get us to where we need to go - only to the nearest garage
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Personally, I’d rather be waiting at the nearest garage than the side of motor way.
But that’s just me. And I’m pretty good at following instructions. So if it were me, I’d pull out the instruction, go through the motion on how to jack up the car and how remove the punctured tired (but without actually removing any of the lug nuts, obviously not putting on the spare). That should give sufficient confidence in actually be able to do it on the side of the road.
Still, if what you really want is to use the space for carrying extra things, the risk is small. You don’t really need all the other excuses. 
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Sun 10-03-24 21:19; edited 1 time in total
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| Glosterwolf wrote: |
Adblue tank is where mine would be, just got a can of glue and no runflats as standard. Buy a new can of the glue each year incase it goes off.
Would also be interested in what happens if you get a blow out in france as we intend to drive from now on. Maybe I should buy a space saver and put it in the boot on long journeys like this. |
We've done this with a VW Touran, old now but fitted with two spare seats under the boot floor and no wheel space. Stands up and ratchet strapped to side of load space for us.
Just gives you options and mobility. Scenario if there needed your tire size delivered (there's sooooo many different size and spec) to repair, the wheel could be left there at tire place and you could transport to local hotel if its an overnight.
Not much happens motor vehicle repair wise in France on a weekend.
Another option, carry a new tire in your size in case and it can be fitted locally fairly conveniently. You can use all the space inside that tire for luggage in bags if needed, so not much loss of capacity.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I'd much rather have the option of a fitting a space saver and getting to where I could get a new tyre fitted rather than wait around for a very expensive (unless you have European breakdown cover) recovery truck.
Fit a space saver, get to a town or village off the motorway ask for a suitable budget tyre (and/or winter tyre) to get you on your way for the rest of your trip. They may even be able to repair the puncture which takes about 15 minutes. Or depending on how far you are away from your destination or stop over you could finish the drive.
Just google, how to change a tyre and there will be countless numbers of guides and videos. Make sure you jack in the right places (usually easy enough to locate). It's better to loosen the nuts before you jack as they can be very stubborn to get going and you don't want to be bouncing up and down on it up the air. So crack the nuts a little, jack it up, remove nuts, remove the tyre (this may need some encouragement as they can "stick on" with a bit of corrosion), fit the space saver, hand tighten nuts so its secure, lower car to ground and then really tighten up the nuts again with the car on the deck.
If you find you can't get the flat tyre off, but the nuts back on hand tight, lower the car to the deck and gently drive the car forward a yard and then back a yard. This is usually enough to crack any corrosion sticking the wheel on. Then jack it back up again, remove nuts and hopefully the the wheel should come right off. Also, once you've removed the wheel place it under the car whilst you fit the new one. If for some reason the jack fails (it won't but its belt and braces) then the car will land on the wheel rather than crash back down to the tarmac.
Oh and remember that if the flat is really empty, then you'll need to jack the car up higher to fit the space saver as it'll be inflated and thus need more clearance!
And what would you realistically store in the space? Normally they are fairly grubby and not a huge amount of extra space to fit stuff into.
I had a rental car from Geneva and about a mile away from Les Crosets in the PdS I clipped a very sharp, sticking out rock as a large bus squeezed past me on a hairpin. It lost all the air pretty much instantly. Out came the space saver and a wheel change at about 1400m on a rather narrow road with a fair incline. It wasn't ideal but we got the job done and got us to our accommodation. We spent the next couple of days trying to find a replacement in the local villages as well as the larger town of Monthey. Unfortunately no where could get us the same brand and type of the damaged tyre before we were due to depart and I wasn't keen on paying once for a new tyre only for the rental company to say well it's now not a matching pair so charge me again.
Whilst we were there, we had over a metre of snow. So I swapped the good wheel onto the front so that the end that does the power and steering had a matching pair of winters on and put the space saver on the back.
The car was absolutely fine getting out the snow, back down the mountain and back to the airport. We left an extra hour for the journey as a space saver has a speed limit of about 50mph normally. So I just took it carefully back along the motorway. Dropped of the car and apologised explaining what happened and left expecting a decent bill. In the end, it only cost me about £70 when they sent the charge through.
Most cars are front wheel drive, so unless you have either 4WD or RWD then really all the back wheels do it keep the back bottom off the car off the road. So not having a winter tyre on the back axle in an emergency wouldn't bother me too much.
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Not much happens motor vehicle repair wise in France on a weekend.
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We packed up our car to come home one night, left it in the covered parking, then in the morning one tyre was flat as a pancake. Hauled everything out of the boot, put the spare wheel on and set off for Calais, but worried about not having a spare, so thought we'd buy one.
It was a Sunday, and completely impossible to buy a spare. Completely. Also be aware that French garages will insist on identical tyres on an axle. So you can end up being forced to buy 2 new tyres. But last time I had to change a wheel on my own car (full size spare carried in a cage underneath - fitted at extra cost when we bought the car) a garage in Albertville repaired the puncture (simple hole made by a nail) for 20 euros.
I would add to @Fridge03's excellent explanation, that I would ALWAYS loosen all wheel nuts before jacking the car up. And being an old woman with weak hands, I also have a hefty lever extension thing in my car, so if necessary I can stand on it and jump up and down a bit, if the wheel nuts are very tight. I was also taught (by my father before he allowed me to drive his car) to tighten up wheelnuts evenly - opposites - and gradually, not screw one on really tight at a time. But I always feel jumpy driving the car, knowing I'd screwed the wheel on myself, and am relieved when it doesn't fall off.
Oh - and be aware that if your car has pointless special locking wheel nut things, you'll need to know where to find the thingy.
It sounds as though I've had loads of punctures. I haven't, but once you've been driving for 60 years, and on some terrible roads (we had one puncture in the Masai Mara in Kenya!) they mount up.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Most cars are front wheel drive, so unless you have either 4WD or RWD then really all the back wheels do it keep the back bottom off the car off the road. So not having a winter tyre on the back axle in an emergency wouldn't bother me too much
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The back wheels are as important as the front for steering. Having once put the lowest cost possible tyres on the rear of my car and finding the stability control coming on at almost corner I think you need as good grip on the back as the front.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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But four including a space saver is much better than 3. Though it is good if the back two follow the front two around bends.
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Thanks for all the feedback. I will take it along for the ride based on the replies.
Though I am not sure I want to practice removing and putting a wheel back on, since if I botch the job it could pose a risk of driving 1500 miles on a poorly fitted wheel. I once had to dodge a errant wheel hurtling towards me that had just detached itself from a car driving down a dual carriage way, that left a mental mark. I am bottom 5th percentile when it comes to these kind of things. Nothing I have ever built with my hands (e.g. IKEA furniture etc) has not turned out to be complete poo-poo. I'll watch some instructions and familiarize myself with the process, in case I do find myself in the unfortunate position, but I don't want the mess with my wheels if I don't have to.
In case of a puncture/blowout on the motorway we have to wait for breakdown assistance in any case, so wouldn't be able to fit the wheel ourselves. Also in that situation, surely it is easier for the breakdown assistance to tow to the nearest garage, than to remove all the luggage from the boot on the hard shoulder whilst cars are wizzing by at 90mph and then fit the space saver?
I suppose the one area where it would come in handy would be past Moutiers, since there there i should be possible to get off the N90 and find a safe place to fit it, and then find a garage to go to.
Seems to me the only real longer term solution is a full size spare. Might be worth investing in some sort of rear or roof mounting for that.
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You know it makes sense.
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| ski_free wrote: |
| In case of a puncture/blowout on the motorway we have to wait for breakdown assistance in any case |
Why is that so? Why couldn’t you make a go at fitting the spare? I’m a little confused…
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@ski_free, It's realy simple to change a wheel. The bigest problem is if the garage who fitted the wheel tightened the nuts too hard. I had the lever supplied with the car just yield as I tried to undo the nuts. However, the chances of a pucture are pretty rare and in many cases you can just pump the tyre up and continue for at least a couple hours.
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Poster: A snowHead
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It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. AA patrols have been killed in the attempt.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| abc wrote: |
| ski_free wrote: |
| In case of a puncture/blowout on the motorway we have to wait for breakdown assistance in any case |
Why is that so? Why couldn’t you make a go at fitting the spare? I’m a little confused… |
While I'm more than capable of changing a wheel, there's no way I'd be trying that on a motorway. I'd be waiting for breakdown assistance to come and do it for me.
In answer to the OP, I've driven back from Nottingham to Oxfordshire using the space saver, with the majority being on the motorway. I just kept the speed down to the tyre's rated speed of about 50mph. Does yours say you can only drive round the corner?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Origen wrote: |
| It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. AA patrols have been killed in the attempt. |
While I kept hearing about that danger, and I can sense that while stopping on the side of a high speed motor way, I feel it’s even riskier to wait for a long time for the breakdown service to come along. The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel. So the sooner I get out of there, the better off I am.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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And if you take snowchains as you should, really, as there's going to be massive snow at Easter (fingers crossed) they might fit in the compartment too.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel.
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I thought the reccomendation was that you left car and walked away from the hard shoulder.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Sometimes the big question is not about the space saver, but about where do you now put the full size wheel you’ve just taken off. If the space saver carrier/well is only that big, then likely it won’t accept the now spare full sized flat. So where will you put that?
One of my cars is a Porsche, it has exactly that issue.
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| johnE wrote: |
| The bigest problem is if the garage who fitted the wheel tightened the nuts too hard. |
Yes, I would retighten nuts after any grease monkey had been near them.
I've known a couple of people who have had punctures in France and had to wait days for a spare tire (or frequently tires) to arrive at the garage because they have unusual wheel sizes for France (one was a Peugeot C .
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| Orange200 wrote: |
Sometimes the big question is not about the space saver, but about where do you now put the full size wheel you’ve just taken off. If the space saver carrier/well is only that big, then likely it won’t accept the now spare full sized flat. So where will you put that?
One of my cars is a Porsche, it has exactly that issue. |
Been there, done that!
I was moving from Florida to New York. My car full of my personal items, bikes, skis, computers and boxes full of dishes, pots and pans. Then I had a puncture. 
Since I’ve changed wheels before, I started the “process” in auto-pilot, only to be confronted with a boot full of “stuff”!
So go ahead and picture this: a mountain of boxes, a bike and a couple pairs of skis, on the road side. Fortunately, it was on a residential area. So some passerby helped with the loosening of the lug nuts (I have an extender, but even with that, it still takes my “helper” jumping up and down on it to loosen up some of the nuts).
When it’s all done and the spare on the car, I was then suddenly confronted the even bigger problem of how to fit everything back into the car with the full size whee taking up half of the boot! (Solution, put some of the items into the well where the space saver came out of)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| davidof wrote: |
| I've known a couple of people who have had punctures in France and had to wait days for a spare tire (or frequently tires) to arrive at the garage |
Ever since I started using winter tyres I've always bought five so as to have a spare ready to go if necessary. Swapping the spare in/out each time I go from summers to winters evens out the wear.
| abc wrote: |
| It’s not that frequent to get a puncture or blow out. |
I had one three weeks ago.
Current car (A4) has a space saver, with not enough room to put the spare winter instead, so it has to take up luggage space - fill it up as far as possible with stuff wrapped in plastic bags. However, still take the space saver as the spare winter is not on its own rim - with this car my tyre place wasn't able to source rims when I initially needed them, and haven't tried looking again in the five years since.
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| abc wrote: |
| Origen wrote: |
| It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. AA patrols have been killed in the attempt. |
While I kept hearing about that danger, and I can sense that while stopping on the side of a high speed motor way, I feel it’s even riskier to wait for a long time for the breakdown service to come along. The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel. So the sooner I get out of there, the better off I am. |
That's exactly why you shouldn't be waiting in the car in most cases.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| sugarmoma666 wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
| Origen wrote: |
| It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. AA patrols have been killed in the attempt. |
While I kept hearing about that danger, and I can sense that while stopping on the side of a high speed motor way, I feel it’s even riskier to wait for a long time for the breakdown service to come along. The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel. So the sooner I get out of there, the better off I am. |
That's exactly why you shouldn't be waiting in the car in most cases. |
So where do you go? 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| abc wrote: |
| sugarmoma666 wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
| Origen wrote: |
| It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. AA patrols have been killed in the attempt. |
While I kept hearing about that danger, and I can sense that while stopping on the side of a high speed motor way, I feel it’s even riskier to wait for a long time for the breakdown service to come along. The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel. So the sooner I get out of there, the better off I am. |
That's exactly why you shouldn't be waiting in the car in most cases. |
So where do you go? |
Behind the barriers and to a safe place if possible. Otherwise call 999.
https://nationalhighways.co.uk/road-safety/breakdowns/
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Take the spacesaver. You could get a puncture on the way back, 1 mile from Calais.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| ski_free wrote: |
Unfortunately, the space below the boot is not large enough to accommodate a full size wheel + tyre.
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How many of you advocating taking the space saver have paid attention to this? Where do you put the full size wheel that comes off?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Hilbertpace wrote: |
| Orange200 wrote: |
| ski_free wrote: |
Unfortunately, the space below the boot is not large enough to accommodate a full size wheel + tyre. |
How many of you advocating taking the space saver have paid attention to this? Where do you put the full size wheel that comes off? |
Take the spacesaver. You could get a puncture on the way back, 1 mile from Calais. |
Fortunately, with such a well-chosen username, that’s not a problem for @HilbertSpace |;>
TBF not cramming every nook & cranny is probably wise - but you could always take a back-pack to put some of the excess baggage into ;-?
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Mon 11-03-24 7:35; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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More seriously…
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| It's exceedingly dangerous to change a wheel on the motorway without high vis warnings and lights. |
@Origen I thought hi-vis for all occupants & a warning triangle were de-rigour en France? Add in an extending wheel-nut lever, a bright-red LED flashy light, & a head-torch or two, then a wheel change might be a goer but for…
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| AA patrols have been killed in the attempt. |
Several decades ago, well before motorway driving was actually taught, my driving instructor said the hard-shoulder was the most most dangerous motorway lane - saying her friend had been killed while changing a wheel - but that was before all-lane-running “smart motorways” :-{
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| While I kept hearing about that danger, and I can sense that while stopping on the side of a high speed motor way, I feel it’s even riskier to wait for a long time for the breakdown service to come along. The chance of my car being hit, with me inside, is just as high as my being hit while outside fitting the spare wheel. |
@abc though being inside the car does allow for all those lovely NCAP 5-star protection features?
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| So the sooner I get out of there, the better off I am. |
Which is why you get out of the vehicle, behind the barriers, AND upstream of any potential impact site. Although that & moving up any available hill aren’t mentioned by National Highways
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In the winter in northern France?  |
@abc good job you’ve all that warm & waterproof ski gear …somewhere in the car!?!
Maybe a suitable compromise on safety v. speed of recovery, is to get everyone out & over the barrier, then get someone wearing the hi-viz to place the warning triangle & any lights back up the road while you call the recovery service and wait for them to position their 3-tonne van in the way of on-coming traffic, before un-packing the boot to get to the spare & let them change it?
Whether you wear a crash-hat while doing any of this is, as usual, your personal choice!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Awful thought, a blow out on the motorway when you've no spare. Really scary.
Without a spare you won't be going anywhere except on the back of their truck, even once the breakdown truck arrives. At least with your space saver you could drive yourself to a hotel once they've changed the wheel, or drive to your resort at 50 mph if you are already well south. Better hope it's not just outside Calais on a Saturday.......
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I thought it was illegal to change wheel in France on hard shoulder and you had to wait to be moved?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Good point - perhaps it is. I wouldn't do it anyway. Nor in the UK.
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My cars don't have spares these days, just a kit to blow foam and a number for the manufacturer's recovery service. Works fine for me; I don't miss the old days much at all.
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| Boris wrote: |
| I thought it was illegal to change wheel in France on hard shoulder and you had to wait to be moved? |
it is, normallement !
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Depends on the nature of the puncture. Foam won't do much for damaged caused by sharp edge of a "nid de poule" on frost-shattered mountain road. I've had to deal with two of those in the last ten years.
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| phil_w wrote: |
| My cars don't have spares these days, just a kit to blow foam and a number for the manufacturer's recovery service. Works fine for me; I don't miss the old days much at all. |
You need luck to make that work in practical reality. Anything more than a simple nail, screw or similar type of puncture, then it's outside the range of that kit. They're almost worthless in application if you've had to slow the vehicle from any highway speed with the tire flat too, there's so much quantity of rubber "crumbs" shed from sidewall internal as to make much short of 5 ltrs puncture fluid ineffective.
Nobody has mentioned preparation, given that its very serious potentially to be stranded and immobile in many situations.
I check our family vehicle tires regularly and particularly before any longer journey like this, also a walk round at any stops en route to spot anything in way of deflation etc in practical avoidance of running problems.
If the OP or anyone else doesn't routinely check tires or have skills of that order, then worthwhile as small part of journey prep to get a competent view prior to travelling date.
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FAQ
